The BEST Guide to POLAND
Unanswered  |  Archives 
 
 
User: Guest

Home / News  % width posts: 27

Can someone give a neutral overview of Polish politics?


Teffle 22 | 1,321
21 Oct 2010 #1
I have some idea, a kind of broad understanding, but when I ask Polish friends to elaborate they get all hot and bothered and start contradicting and arguing with each other!

So, can anyone give a party by party synopsis, in a non-partisan manner?
alexw68
21 Oct 2010 #2
when I ask Polish friends to elaborate they get all hot and bothered and start contradicting and arguing with each other!

So - they've captured it rather well, then.
Kasz 1 | 76
21 Oct 2010 #3
There is two groups Pis and PO. Pis won elections some time ago and they fuc*** up hardly bringing to power two idiots Giertych and Lepper. Then there was fastes elections again cus goverment failed and broke up. Ppl mad and PIS for bringing those bastards started to vote for PO not cus they are way better just cus they are not PIS. In poland u dont vote on some ppl u vote against other.
Torq 32 | 2,999
21 Oct 2010 #4
Right side of Polish political scene...

Liberal Conservative: UPR (Unia Polityki Realnej), WiP (Wolność i Praworządność)
Catholic Conservatives: PR (Prawica Rzeczypospolitej)

and the left side...

National-Patriotic Socialists: PiS (Prawo i Sprawiedliwość)
Cosmopolitan Socialists: PO (Platforma Obywatelska)
Peasants and Farmers Socialist: PSL (Polskie Stronnictwo Ludowe), Samoobrona
Post-communists: SLD (Sojusz Lewicy Demokratycznej), SdPL (Socjaldemokracja Polska),
UP (Unia Pracy), PPS (Polska Partia Socjalistyczna)

That's it in a nutshell. Of course there are more smaller parties, but the overwhelming
majority of them are socialists (of many different kinds.)
Ironside 49 | 10,305
21 Oct 2010 #5
UPR (Unia Polityki Realnej)

5 members three fractions

WiP (Wolność i Praworządność)

never heard about them

PR (Prawica Rzeczypospolitej)

10 members and great expectations
:D

ted to vote for PO not cus they are way better just cus they are not PIS.

as you see Teffle - most peeps are just morons
Torq 32 | 2,999
21 Oct 2010 #6
never heard about them

partiawip.pl

5 members three fractions

10 members and great expectations

Bollox.

But you see, yours is exactly the attitude towards right-wing parties in Poland that puts
socialist parties like PiS or PO in power. That's why Poland will be ruled by socialists in
foreseeable future and nothing much will change for better.
Ironside 49 | 10,305
21 Oct 2010 #7
Bollox.

hey only kidding :)

That's why Poland will be ruled by socialists in
foreseeable future and nothing much will change for better.

not because of my attitude but because of predominant socialists governments across the EU, you cannot really do much without EU masters approval:( and that the fact !
alexw68
21 Oct 2010 #8
But you see, yours is exactly the attitude towards right-wing parties in Poland that puts
socialist parties like PiS or PO in power.

Said right-wing parties have themselves rather contributed to this impression. AWS? Imploded due to factionalism. LPR? Likewise. PiS? Arguably, on the way to same.
Torq 32 | 2,999
21 Oct 2010 #9
Said right-wing parties (...)

AWS?

LPR?

PiS?

None of the parties you mentioned can be described as right-wing. They all represent different
shades of socialism: AWS - why, that was a labour union party - not exactly something you
would call right-wing, LPR - Christian socialists (Christian in morality and social sphere, socialist
in economic and administration sphere), PiS (national-patriotic socialists, as I said earlier.)

We have only 3 (three) right-wing parties in Poland: UPR, WiP and PR.
hague1cmaeron 14 | 1,377
22 Oct 2010 #10
So - they've captured it rather well, then.

Absolutely, there is no such thing as neutrality in politics.

Liberal Conservative: UPR (Unia Polityki Realnej), WiP (Wolność i Praworządność)
Catholic Conservatives: PR (Prawica Rzeczypospolitej)

and the left side...

National-Patriotic Socialists: PiS (Prawo i Sprawiedliwość)
Cosmopolitan Socialists: PO (Platforma Obywatelska)
Peasants and Farmers Socialist: PSL (Polskie Stronnictwo Ludowe), Samoobrona
Post-communists: SLD (Sojusz Lewicy Demokratycznej), SdPL (Socjaldemokracja Polska),
UP (Unia Pracy), PPS (Polska Partia Socjalistyczna)

That's it in a nutshell. Of course there are more smaller parties, but the overwhelming
majority of them are socialists (of many different kinds.)[/quote]

That is a politically illiterate summation of Polish politics, unless you were trying to be funny.
zetigrek
22 Oct 2010 #11
Good to see we're all in broad disagreement then : )

Maybe I can help. Torq divided those parties on left/right in the economy point of view and yes in Poland you have to be socialist if you want to have some popularity. But note that most of those parties are in fact declared as some kind of right wing parties (Pis and PO are both christian democracy)

PiS is also neoconservatistic while PO declares as liberal conservatists.

Those 2 parties currently have the biggest support, but not because their programs attracts people. They are kind of antagonists so people mostly vote for PO to make PiS not win and PiS supporters vote on PiS to stop the super evil PO ;)
Torq 32 | 2,999
22 Oct 2010 #12
That is a politically illiterate summation of Polish politics, unless you were trying to be funny.

Why, forgive me, but I'd say that having spent most of my life in Poland and being for
a period of time actively involved in politics, I have a good idea what I'm talking about.

Torq divided those parties on left/right in the economy point of view and yes in Poland you have to be socialist if you want to have some popularity.

Of course. That's why we will never have a right-wing party in power in Poland
(well, not in a foreseeable future.)

What they say and what they do are two completely different things.

I might as well declare myself an Eskimo :D
OP Teffle 22 | 1,321
22 Oct 2010 #13
Thanks hague, Torq & everyone - liberal conservative in what sense?

Seems a bit like an oxymoron, though not necessarily as I would probably describe myself as a right wing libertarian ; )

Maybe I can help. Torq divided those parties on left/right in the economy point of view and yes in Poland you have to be socialist if you want to have some popularity. But note that most of those parties are in fact declared as some kind of right wing parties (Pis and PO are both christian democracy)

Am I right in saying really there aren't too many centre-ish parties then?
zetigrek
22 Oct 2010 #14
liberal conservative in what sense?

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberal_conservatism
OP Teffle 22 | 1,321
22 Oct 2010 #15
Yes, but in what sense, in practice, for this party?
Torq 32 | 2,999
22 Oct 2010 #16
liberal conservative

I described UPR and WiP as liberal conservative, because they promote liberalism
(or even libertarianism) in economy and conservative values in social life.

More information here...

upr.org.pl/main/artykul.php?strid=1&katid=79&aid=390

...if your Polish is not good enough, then use google translator (it should give you a rough
idea about the party's program.)

There is also PR as a good representation of Catholic conservatives.

prawicarzeczypospolitej.org

All other parties are socialists under many different disguises (christian, national-patriotic,
modern-european, peasant etc.)
zetigrek
22 Oct 2010 #17
Yes, but in what sense, in practice, for this party?

I have no idea, I've just read this on wikipedia ;)
They had some "liberal" ideas in ecnomics but it seems they gave up those ideas...

Here you have an article: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Platforma_Obywatelska

Torq

But dear Torq
you should mention that those parties are not present in political life. UPR is actually known only of its controvercial funder Janusz Korwin Mikke. They have really little support less than 1%.
OP Teffle 22 | 1,321
22 Oct 2010 #18
OK - thanks for that guys.
Torq 32 | 2,999
22 Oct 2010 #19
But dear Torq you should mention that those parties are not present in political life.

Oh, I believe I mentioned it and expressed my deep conviction that they can't even dream
of being in power in Poland (not in a foreseeable future anyway). Poles prefer socialist parties,
like PiS or PO.
zetigrek
22 Oct 2010 #20
OK - thanks for that guys.

Read also wiki site about PiS and I think it will be absolutely sufficient overview: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PiS
OP Teffle 22 | 1,321
22 Oct 2010 #21
Thanks, but they are the one party I know more than enough about I think!

I don't want to learn any more about them. It will upset me.

; )
delphiandomine 85 | 18,266
22 Oct 2010 #22
Am I right in saying really there aren't too many centre-ish parties then?

The PSL (farmers) could be described as Centrist - they have some policies from both political wings, but they tend to be rather middle of the road.

PO are much more complicated though - they are actually probably centrist because of having both liberal and conservative wings - because of the lack of a decent centre-left party (though Palikot might change this) - you tend to see a lot of the centre-left people supporting them through no other credible alternative. As Torq says, they have socialist policies, but they may be dropped in a hurry post-2011 if they win a decisive victory.
jwojcie 2 | 763
22 Oct 2010 #23
Well, there is no neutral view but just for a sport, my view:

Classification by economy:
Parties and influential forces other than media:
Socialists: PPS, UP, SLD, SdPL, PR, Catholic Church, Solidarność
In the middle but to the left: PIS, PSL
In the middle but to the right: PO
Liberal: UPR

(Liberal in economy equals level of freedom in economic activity)

Classification by moral values:
Parties and influential forces other than media:
Conservative: UPR, PR, PIS, PSL, Catholic Church, Solidarność
In the middle but to the conservative side more and more: PO
Liberal: PPS, UP, SLD, SdPL

(Liberal in moral values equals level of freedom in sexual activity ;) )

With media it is more complicated and there is many of them but I would say that for the most important:
Socialist in economy and liberal with moral values: Polityka
A little less socialist in economy and liberal with moral values: Gazeta Wyborcza, Talk FM
Not liberal but not socialist in economy and liberal with moral values: TVN, Polsat
Not liberal but not socialist in economy but conservative with moral values: Rzeczpospolita
Liberal in economy and conservative with moral values: Wprost

TVP and other state owned media - entirely depends on which party elected their latest management. Zero independence.

One more thing especially with newspapers, regarding economy it seems that what they write often depends on who paid them for advertisment on page next to an article...
OP Teffle 22 | 1,321
22 Oct 2010 #24
Thanks Jwojcie - interesting angle & info.

Anyone greatly agree or disagree with it?

One thing that has certainly struck me is that Poland has a lot of parties - I know some are minor, but still. Are many of these defectors from other main parties?

In Ireland & Britain, if you exclude the true outsider/nutter outfits, you could count all parties on one hand.
jwojcie 2 | 763
22 Oct 2010 #25
One thing that has certainly struck me is that Poland has a lot of parties - I know some are minor, but still. Are many of these defectors from other main parties?

There were even more of them. Yes, some are defectors. Without going into details:
Parties like SLD, SdPL and UP, PPS for some extent are postcommunist and have a source in THE ONE party ;)
Other than PSL are mostly rooted to Solidarność movement but not to current Solidarność union. It splitted into countless little parties in 90'. Late 90' and 2000' was a time of joints, but with many separations.

I didn't mention one thing, it is quite usual that on the local level nation-wide parties are suprisingly weak. For example in Wroclaw, so quite a big city, president has his own party/movement. He is post-solidarity guy and you can place him somewhere between PIS and PO but he is independent from them. I mention this because local governments has quite a lot powers and local coalition can be totally different from nation-wide coalitions.

In Ireland & Britain, if you exclude the true outsider/nutter outfits, you could count all parties on one hand.

I've read that you have a law wich practically excludes possibility of a third party (isn't the biggest issue of current third party in UK to change this law?). Polish law also prefers bigger parties but not to that extent as British one.

Besides, Polish saying goes: "Where two Poles there are three opinions" so binary political system wouldn't probably go well in Poland ;)
hague1cmaeron 14 | 1,377
22 Oct 2010 #26
Why, forgive me, but I'd say that having spent most of my life in Poland and being for
a period of time actively involved in politics, I have a good idea what I'm talking about.

No idea

Yes, but in what sense, in practice, for this party?

Trust you will not get much sense out of this forum. This is how the sensible mainstream view things

PO-economic liberal+social conservatives

PIS-economic conservatives (not as liberal and prepared to spend more money)+ social Conservatives, more socially conservative than PO

SLD-socially liberal+ economically center left, they don't differ a lot in economics from PIS
Ironside 49 | 10,305
22 Oct 2010 #27
Classification by the views on economy:

Parties:
Traitors :PPS, UP, SLD, SdPL.
Mix - traitors and representatives of farmers :PSL
Socialists a la French right wing: PiS
Liberalism a la Eastern Europe, corruption as a way of privatization:PO
fringes of politics : LPR- mentioned only because of long existence as a party and radical ( for Europe), liberal views - similar to views hold by the right wind republicans in USA.

PR - a new formation and a big ?

Classification by the views on moral values:

Parties:
Conservative: UPR and some wee parties on the fringes of politics.
Standard European Center - full Political Correctness- PO
Standard European Right a bit more traditional - PiS
European left, radical PC plus anti- RCC - PPS, UP, SLD, SdPL
non values- PSL

With media

Polityka,Gazeta Wyborcza, Talk FM,TVN, Polsat,Wprost- different shadows of PC and BS!
Rzeczpospolita - some resemblance of independence - however not much !


Home / News / Can someone give a neutral overview of Polish politics?
BoldItalic [quote]
 
To post as Guest, enter a temporary username or login and post as a member.