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Have many Poles had enough of one another?


SzwedwPolsce 11 | 1,595
16 Aug 2011 #61
Customer service is poor in PL compared to Western Europe. But it is slowly changing to the better.
southern 75 | 7,096
16 Aug 2011 #62
I always like how polish women promote their shop products with their big decoltes.
pip 10 | 1,659
16 Aug 2011 #63
and newly botoxed lips.
southern 75 | 7,096
16 Aug 2011 #64
Yes,sometimes even shopping can become interesting for a man.
OP Seanus 15 | 19,706
16 Aug 2011 #65
Back to the topic, please.

DE, any personal stories? ;) ;)
Des Essientes 7 | 1,291
16 Aug 2011 #66
DE, any personal stories?

Seanus, you claim that this thread is merely observational but its title asks the reader to draw conclusions about Poles' mental attitudes regarding their fellow countrymen based on these observations, and thus this thread is doomed to failure because you cannot know whether, or not, Poles hate one another just by watching them shop. I do have a personal story for you. Yesterday I read this thread's OP about how you, Seanus, exude "positive energy" and that many of the Poles shopping around you are negative "creeps" and I came to the following conclusion: Because of your being an English teacher, Seanus, you want the people you encounter in everyday life to be defferential towards you, as if they were your students, but they are not, and frankly from having read many of your posts here, especially the one were you threatened to "personally" have me banned, you seem like a puffed up easily offended ninny and you are thus you are unworthy of deference. Indeed I am in sunny California, and not in Poland, but that doesn't change the fact that this thread reveals that you, Seanus, have a patronizing attitude towards Poles and I have every right to point this out. As for the other posters that bragged about getting people fired, or complained that people they've encountered in the "service industry" were not nice enough, I would like to remind them that although those people do indeed work in the "service industry" they are not thereby your personal servants. I hope that Poles in the service sector never become the fawning sycophantic slaves that bossy Western douchebags expect them to be.
pip 10 | 1,659
17 Aug 2011 #67
As for the other posters that bragged about getting people fired, or complained that people they've encountered in the "service industry" were not nice enough, I would like to remind them that although those people do indeed work in the "service industry" they are not thereby your personal servants. I hope that Poles in the service sector never become the fawning sycophantic slaves that bossy Western douchebags expect them to be.

back it up. if you encountered at least half of the rudeness in your sunny California that exists in Poland- then perhaps your comment might be valid. However, in the service/retail industry- the job is customer service- plain and simple. This is the job. It doesn't have anything to do with being "nice enough" it is the job.

Last month I was in Tesco. There was an elderly couple asking a cashier about a piece of child's clothing- I think it was on sale. This cashier started screaming at them. I don't mean raising her voice- I mean screaming. It was embarrassing. I didn't say anything because clearly this woman was not stable. My husband would have said something- but he wasn't with me at the time--he calls people on their rude behaviour all the time.

The point is- they are not meant to be personal servants- I don't really know how you would say that, but people in the service industry need to have a friendly disposition. Should you tip a waiter that is rude or gives you crap service? same thing. It doesn't have anything to do with being a "sycophantic slave"--it is the job, plain and simple- if you don't like the job than change it.

but then again, you don't live here- do you? so how would you know what customer service is really like.
wielki pan 2 | 250
17 Aug 2011 #68
I'm hearing more and more that Poles want to leave.

Seanus, you are having a cheap shot at the Poles, one fully understands the average Pole earning the basic wage and then having salt rubbed in by the likes of you (no offence) they see people from GB and Ireland walking around with fist full of zlotes and they ask the question why they have and I not have... I can understand the mood of the day... Everyone is happy when the have a belly load of booze and plenty of good food, car, house and money.... get the point?
pip 10 | 1,659
17 Aug 2011 #69
sorry but foreigners do not rub in the face of Poles how much money they earn. Poles rub it in the face of fellow Poles. You see more Poles with big suv's and name brand clothing and all done up- compared to the foreigners who work here, who keep a relatively low profile.
wielki pan 2 | 250
17 Aug 2011 #70
You see more Poles with big suv's and name brand clothing and all done up- compared to the foreigners who work here, who keep a relatively low profile.

Pip I think Seanus is talking about life in a small country town, not in a major city. People may view Seanus as some sort of rich guy etc, where money is no problem...
delphiandomine 88 | 18,454
17 Aug 2011 #71
. I do have a personal story for you.

He asked for a personal story about Poles in Poland - not the rantings of some American who has never visited Poland.

I hope that Poles in the service sector never become the fawning sycophantic slaves that bossy Western douchebags expect them to be.

When you work for a company that puts customer service at the very, very top of its priorities, you do everything in your power to help people. Especially those that are looking at spending 3000zl on books.

Let's be honest Des - you've never been to Poland, you don't speak Polish - you haven't got a clue what's going on here.

Tell you what though - tell us, where is one likely to find better service - Carrefour or Auchan? Anyone living in Poland can answer this - so - come on.

but then again, you don't live here- do you? so how would you know what customer service is really like.

Add to that : never been here.

Pip I think Seanus is talking about life in a small country town, not in a major city. People may view Seanus as some sort of rich guy etc, where money is no problem...

Seanus is talking about life in a major area. He lives in part of the Katowice metropolitan area - not exactly "small country town".

Incidentally, you'll find in Poland that service tends to be much worse in cities than in small towns/villages.
OP Seanus 15 | 19,706
17 Aug 2011 #72
It is based on observation. How else do you make judgements and form opinions, DE, with your eyes closed? Funny that my students agree with me and they have lived here all their lives. You are one of those who defend Poland come what may/no matter what types that is way out of touch with the reality on the ground. I thought you wanted to learn about arts and philosophy, not everyday life in shops. You've already admitted I'm not lying so you're clinging onto your defensive ways and there is no other explanation.

Where did I use the word 'hate'? Besides, I'm asking the question which isn't even leading. A leading question is 'many Poles have had enough of one another, right?'. Discuss. However, it's not that way. If you don't like the topic, take a hike. You know peoples' opinions by asking and they are free to share their experiences or withhold them. Wrocław contributed and that was good as he knows Polish and British culture well. He had no qualms about coming forward.

I have already said that people will be as people will be and that's their prerogative. I'm not into marketing/PR, sales or any other overtly opinion shaping profession. Teaching, as I see it as a facilitator, is about sharing ideas and not forcing people to produce anything or do anything on the spot. I really don't have a problem with people in the shops, I just see that many Poles look well and truly bored of one another. So they are creepy, I can cope with that. It's an observation, not a criticism.

You will be suspended for provocation and leading the thread off-topic. By all means learn but stay away from threads you can't contribute to.

As I've said in many places on PF, I have a very positive impression of some Poles and a negative one about others and I could say the same for Scotland or any other country you care to mention. People are people and I'm discussing one aspect here.

Wp, please don't assume. I have high costs (ZUS, accountant, tax and internet) and my salary is not high from my job. I am one of the last people in the world to be materialistic. In fact, I have actively spoken out against it. I said it just the other day to the poster called pawian. Without my private students, I'd lead quite a meagre existence. I am eternally grateful to them and I've said it many times before. I don't have my own car, I don't drink much beer at all and I don't have a house but a modest flat. Modesty is a virtue! I'm happy with my lot :) They don't view me as rich as I don't discuss my income with them, simple. Besides, I live in a medium-sized city, not a small town. Over 200,000 people here.

Back to the thread, the atmos was better today because of the sun. That's what I put it down to anyway. Fewer people looking bored with each other. The weather plays its part for sure.

DE, I really feel this is one of my stronger threads and I encourage you to share your observations about social interaction here. The vibe is often good and attitudes are relaxed. I was thinking more about administrative centres so feel free to discuss your experiences of Polish urzędy :) Pewnie byłeś kiedyś w urzędym skarbowym czy w urzędach w ogóle.
Parastie - | 4
17 Aug 2011 #73
I live in Poland currently and come from working in the US, and in the service industry. I did computer technical support, working for Gateway was my first job. I know what customer service should be.

In Poland, I believe that service is hit or miss. You often find that people working in the industry are accustomed to rude clientele that rarely is polite to the server. I live in £odz and you can quickly see at restaurants how differently servers will act towards foreigners and locals. Foreigners will typically tip, and servers have learned to be extra nice (especially waitresses as apposed to waiters) and quick. If they hear you speaking English, they'll be right next to you asking what you'd like with a big smile. Speak Polish, and you could be waiting awhile. The restaurants around Manufaktura are where I get the best service.

I think it really comes down to a sense of worth. In the US, I was taught from a very early age to take a lot of pride in my work, regardless of what it was. Here, it does not appear to be the same. It seems that everyone hates their job and most educated people I know are always looking for ways out (especially the doctors I know). In Poland the pay scale is still very low, so it's hard to take pride in servicing others when you're barely paid enough to buy lunch, much less the expensive meal someone just ordered. I sympathize with people here, but really if you want a better life you have to start with yourself. Take some pride, what little is to be had, and try to enjoy life a little more.
pip 10 | 1,659
17 Aug 2011 #74
but don't you also think that a lot of people in the service/retail industry have to do this work- I mean, who wants to be a cashier--unless it is your first job or an older person that uses it to supplement their income. The group in between are the nastiest bunch of bitties- but they have to do the job because they don't have skills for anything else.

I did my time working service and fast food. I new it was a stepping stone and a temporary job- imagine working at McDonalds when you are 35?? I would be crabby too.
Foreigner4 12 | 1,768
17 Aug 2011 #75
^ I'll second that.
Yesterday a girl got steamed at me for not ordering all the cold cuts I wanted at one time. It literally changed nothing as she only had to bend forward and reach to the left or right but I was having one of those rare empathetic days where I could ask myself if i'd be happy being a young woman slinging schab for meager earnings. There are also a great many Polish customers who tend to treat those in the service industry very poorly (unbelievable arrogance). I wouldn't be kissing any ass either if I knew my customers would fart the second my face got close.
Des Essientes 7 | 1,291
17 Aug 2011 #76
I am one of the last people in the world to be materialistic. In fact, I have actively spoken out against it.

Ha ha Seanus you are indeed patronizing as well as self-righteous.

back it up.

Pip you called a clerk a "cow" in your post #58. Have you ever stopped to think that it takes one to know one?

Even more reason to call if you ask me - all those cushy maternity provisions would be lost if she was fired.

^Delphiandomine telling Pip she should've tried to get a pregnant cashier fired after he bragged about getting a bookstore clerk fired in post #57, and he has the nerve to claim in post #61 that Poles are not dignified! What would a petty craven creature like him know about dignity? Absolutely nothing that's what.
delphiandomine 88 | 18,454
17 Aug 2011 #77
So, Des - what about those personal experiences of Polish customer service?

What can you tell us about the differences between supermarkets and locally owned stores, for instance?

Or perhaps you might want to offer a critique on the differences between Piotr i Pawel and Alma - both chains are Polish owned, but one is headquartered in Poznan and the other in Krakow. I'm curious - what are your thoughts as to why service varies?
plgrl
17 Aug 2011 #78
delphiandomine

If your salary was the lowest possible, no chances for promotion or self-developement, if you were overworked and still had nothing from life, only worries... would you be smiling?
pip 10 | 1,659
17 Aug 2011 #79
I am also curious.

and lets add the difference between CCC and Gino Rossi- both are Polish owned also.

If your salary was the lowest possible, no chances for promotion or self-developement, if you were overworked and still had nothing from life, only worries... would you be smiling?

wait a sec- it is still a job. I have encountered many friendly people working the cash at a supermarket- why is it some are happy and some are crabby hags?

What it boils down to is if you don't like your job then find a new one. There are always entry level positions available.

It also is possible to work somewhere like Auchan or Tesco and have in house training and work your way towards a better position.
delphiandomine 88 | 18,454
17 Aug 2011 #80
If your salary was the lowest possible, no chances for promotion or self-developement, if you were overworked and still had nothing from life, only worries... would you be smiling?

Been there, done that - most of us have had similar sorts of horrific jobs. I have a friend who used to work in a factory where she had to push one button every 20 seconds - she survived.

Even in Poland, there's plenty of opportunity to better yourself if you want to - the people stuck in the lousy jobs for life are there by choice, or are simply incapable of anything better. And let's be honest - most of the dreadful service comes in chain shops where there's a chance to develop, not in small local stores.

I even know one guy who worked a hard physical job for 5 years to be able to go to university at the weekend - he was working 50-60 hours a week in all weathers. Now he's a very successful sales manager.
Des Essientes 7 | 1,291
17 Aug 2011 #81
Been there, done that - most of us have had similar sorts of horrific jobs.

This doesn't answer plgrl's question and it ridiculously assumes that "most of us" have had horrorific jobs. Who is us Delphiandomine?

comment removed
pip 10 | 1,659
17 Aug 2011 #82
my cleaning lady is from Ukraine. Her daughter is coming to Warsaw to go to school on the week ends and work as a cleaning lady during the week. She is 20. She should be out talking about how stupid boys are or getting drunk off 2 beer---not cleaning toilets.

but, it is what she has to do to have a better life.

I have been working since I was 15 years old. Fast food, retail, restaurants---all while going to school. My husband worked as a dishwasher and a sandwich maker when he first immigrated to Canada.

Stepping stones to get where you need to be.
plgrl
17 Aug 2011 #83
I'm curious - what are your thoughts as to why service varies?

As a Polish person I can say only that I've never bought in those shops but what I expect from tellers is to be fast. And mostly they are fast... unless some costumer forgot money and they have to cancel the receipt. The only thing which gets on my nerves is when there is a queue, 3 teller points and only one open...
delphiandomine 88 | 18,454
17 Aug 2011 #84
edited

but, it is what she has to do to have a better life.

And she will be much better off for it - especially over the vast amounts of lazy Polish graduates who finish their 5 years and then suddenly realise that they're unemployable. Some of the CV's I've received recently are hilariously funny - one of them had done absolutely nothing for the whole 5 years.
plgrl
17 Aug 2011 #85
Been there, done that - most of us have had similar sorts of horrific jobs.

No you wasn't. You're British! I can't imagine you working for 6 PLN per hour.

Even in Poland, there's plenty of opportunity to better yourself if you want to

Load of rubbish. If you say that, that means you don't know the real life. I hate when people talk those slogans but don't see that there are people who have no choice.

And let's be honest - most of the dreadful service comes in chain shops where there's a chance to develop, not in small local stores.

In local stores the teller is mostly the owner of the shop.

even know one guy who worked a hard physical job for 5 years

If he was construction worker it's hardly an awful job. I thought that construction workers in GB earn quite a lot.
pip 10 | 1,659
17 Aug 2011 #86
As a Polish person I can say only that I've never bought in those shops but what I expect from tellers is to be fast. And mostly they are fast... unless some costumer forgot money and they have to cancel the receipt. The only thing which gets on my nerves is when there is a queue, 3 teller points and only one open...

ahhh....my favourit---poczta!!
plgrl
17 Aug 2011 #87
wait a sec- it is still a job.

you must be cynical...

What it boils down to is if you don't like your job then find a new one.

Haha! Are you seriously living in Poland?! Haven't you heard how a year ago or so a strike of the tellers in one of the supermarkets end up?
delphiandomine 88 | 18,454
17 Aug 2011 #88
No you wasn't. You're British! I can't imagine you working for 6 PLN per hour.

But working for 3 pounds an hour is a reality for many British kids - even less if they're apprentices. I know one guy who started out earning the equal of about 11PLN an hour - in the UK! (about 2.50 an hour).

Heck, my first job involved standing outside in all hours - I knew the owner of a large nightclub, who hired me to deal with the promotional activities of the place. Horrid job - terrible hours, often spent outside supervising staff in the middle of winter - and stressful.

Heck, I even worked for a fast food place once for a whole (very hot) summer - that was a living nightmare, especially given that I was working with a bunch of career-minded drones who could only repeat company policies. I was fired, just before the end of summer - but still ;)

Load of rubbish. If you say that, that means you don't know the real life. I hate when people talk those slogans but don't see that there are people who have no choice.

They have plenty of choice - but they choose not to take them. Poland's not such a bad country that people can't better themselves *if* they want to. Of course, many of them are married to sexist pigs who demand the dinner on the table at a certain time or they'll get a slap - but that's not the fault of Poland. The same sexist pigs will also refuse to look after the kids at the weekend so the woman can educate herself - but again - not the fault of the country.

The opportunity is there - but many of them simply don't want it. After all - opportunity means working more than 40 hours a week and actually putting effort in - can you honestly imagine those scowling middle-aged women in Carrefour doing that? Let's be fair - many of them don't *want* extra responsibility.

In local stores the teller is mostly the owner of the shop.

Well, my local bakery is a great example - there used to be two women working there who had a fantastic sense of humour. Always joking and laughing, always pleasant, decent service - and they didn't own it. But they were professional.

If he was construction worker it's hardly an awful job. I thought that construction workers in GB earn quite a lot.

That was Poland - in a small town in rural Wielkopolska. Not exactly a great job 10 years ago, was it?

ahhh....my favourit---poczta!!

You know - my local post office has quite friendly people working there. They even tend to hold onto stuff a bit longer than they should - which is appreciated :)

Haha! Are you seriously living in Poland?! Haven't you heard how a year ago or so a strike of the tellers in one of the supermarkets end up?

It ended badly because they were manipulated by Solidarity into making themselves look stupid - which was a great shame to see a trade union use them for their own political objectives.
pip 10 | 1,659
17 Aug 2011 #89
You know - my local post office has quite friendly people working there. They even tend to hold onto stuff a bit longer than they should - which is appreciated :)

you are lucky then. I have had the post office lose 5 parcels, the line ups are horrid and I always have a problem with my name.

It is better since we moved however- and now the security at my osiedle takes the parcels when I am not home. Our letter carrier is super- he always says hi to me on the street and he even stopped me once in the forest (I was walking my dog) and gave me my mail.
plgrl
17 Aug 2011 #90
many British kids

Kids? Kids?! What are you talking about?! Kids don't have families to support, they earn money for chewing gum!

I know one guy who started out earning the equal of about 11PLN an hour - in the UK! (about 2.50 an hour).

How many years ago? if you say 5 then I say that 5-6 years ago 3PLN per hour was a standard.

The opportunity is there

name them!

After all - opportunity means working more than 40 hours a week and actually putting effort in - can you honestly imagine those scowling middle-aged women in Carrefour doing that?

What?! Do you think that those people work only 7 hours a day and free sundays?! You live in different world, aren't you?


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