I am a businessman from Dubai, A Pakistani national and coming to Warsaw to open a warehousing and distribution setup. Of course we will be generating employment also for Polish people. What should i expect from people? any sort of racism based on wheatish skin color or nationality or anything? should I expect dirty tricks from my competitors , in order to fail my business? Corruption at Government or people's level?
I would really appreciate an honest input from you all.
Really ?, that is not my experience of living in Poland and Dubai, in fact there are similarities when it comes to bureaucracy and dealing with workers.
But as any businessman knows these issues can come into play in any new setup, the key is that the OP will be in the driving seat and employ the right local people to get things done.
All I can say is that Poles in Poland can be as cute hardworking and capable as Indians are in Dubai.
Thank you so much..... Your words really made my day. We faced a lot of problems (specially corruption problems) when we opened setup in Kiev and Tbilisi. We are now keeping only retail outlets in these 2 cities and moving the warehousing and distribution to Warsaw. From the customs officials to the tax authorities, everyone gave us a very tough time in Ukraine and Georgia. I hope Warsaw will be different.
The level of corruption in Poland is much lower than in Ukraine or Georgia, but that doesn't mean it is a non-existent phenomenon. The greater problem would certainly be beaurocracy, in my view (possibly less pronounced than in Ukraine).
Thanks for the info, I am sure it would be manageable, in Tbilisi we could not clear the containers without bribing the customs official, same goes with Ukraine. Eventually we started incorporating it into our costing as additional expenses. The best thing is that it did not stop at that point. Once they know the container is delivered at the warehouse, then the tax authorities will come and threaten you that you have under invoiced your goods, so you have to bribe them also...... It was a nightmare in short.
Also you'd have to offer some competitive working conditions and perks to make sure you get employees. Read into the conditions of employing people in Poland and the costs for the employer before making the final decision.
@kaprys: Yes, the law firm we are working through, is going to take care of employee's for us.
@Lyzko: You have no idea my friend...... we later came to know that all the trouble we were facing in Tbilisi was because of our Azerbaijani competitor who was extremely influential / well connected and leader of the trading mafia. He had contacts in the govt. and used them against us.
In Tbilisi we could not clear the containers without bribing the customs official, same goes with Ukraine.
In Poland expect the same but more of it or worse. You even will probably have to bribe the officials at the local government office to get a permit.
Oh and because Poland is in EU the bribing will probably cost more and they will expect it in dollars because they love America so much they probably wont even take euros. They always take dollars.
The level of corruption in Poland is much lower than in Ukraine or Georgia
That is only in Warsaw. The rest of Poland is even worse than those two places because they want way more, on a bigger scale, and only take dollars.
we could not clear the containers without bribing the customs official
But how did you know or even come on the idea of bribing them? Meaning did they give you hints or ask for money or did you just offer out of the blue hoping they would? Ive never seen in Poland anyone expecting it meaning they wont give you hints even cops will just give you a ticket and not give hints like hey were dirty, thats the other difference between old poland and modern poland and lands east and poland, but I really think they are just as corrupt and if you offer yourself they always take as long as I said it is dollars.
Thanks for the honest input........ In Georgia and Ukraine, it was very easy for them to ask for bribe because they were telling this to our translators...lol. We don't speak Russian or the local language. In Poland at least English is spoken widely, that is also one of the reason to move here because language is the biggest hurdle in this former soviet union region.
We are planning to be in Warsaw and I hope it should be OK (as you said) if something goes wrong then we always have an option of moving the business to the Economic Free Zone..................appreciate your feedback friend!!! Thanks
@Ojczyzna Stop trolling here. The corruption is much lower here than in Ukraine. And if anyone experience it at local authorities level it can be always reported to cba.gov.pl/en.
ANything can be reported anywhere including Ukraine or the United States where the jails and prisons and lawyer practices are amongst the most corrupt in the world, yet no one cares. Just because something can be reported doesnt mean people will or anyone will care. You realize in America lawyers lie to their clients to convince them of plea bargains and even work with das with secret money exchanges and hand shakes? and how in the U.S. Trump a criminal is running their country? Your argument holds no water. I am sure Ukraine or any country has something similar to cba.goc.pl. I was ripped off multiple times and tried to email the establishments (including a local gym where the guy took my money and claimed I gave him the wrong change right in front of the camera here in Warsaw) none of those managers fired them or really did much. HERE IN POLAND.
Go to this gym near old town called zdrofit. Then order a water or drink from this young maybe Ukrainian guy and pay him in coins. He will pretend you paid him the wrong amount and ask for more. Than complain toy our little cbs or whatever and see if anyone will do anything. Or go to any of those pijalnia bars in Warsaw and deal with the bouncers who assault people and pepper spray them on a regular basis and will steal things like bags if you leave them for a second.
Great response, genius right there. Go on defending Pollackistan.
And I can count on my money you stupid Pollack that is why I said he did it on purpose and kept arguing with me and he was the one who was the idiot or couldnt count not me.
Actually in America there is a lot of people in prisons for simply walking out of a store without paying and some asian or vietnamese **** chasing after them and getting hurt. So due to that knowledge and my experiences in that land I do not take chances. If I walk out and he mistakes me or didnt count right or tried to rip me off but thinks he can get away with it and chases me and I slam him on concrete. In America that is automatic prison.
Poland was no different from all the rest of the Black Market, especially under Communism! You acted like an honest, babe in the woods, deer in the headlights....you were dead meat. Poles, like the others, had to finagle in order to survive.
In America, particularly in California, the police actually shoot people for anything even unarmed. And in America many shop owners even have guns and shoot people, look at those Koreans in the ROdney King riots for instance. Plus, over there the cops dont do any investigations if you have any history or record or are Pollack or foreign. They just interview you to admit you were at a scene and nothing more, handcuffs come on.
The US sure ain't perfect, but the title of the thread was concerning dirt tricks, and I merely answered in the affirmative, based on my experience with Eastern Europeans here in the States. Bribery was a way of life in their countries and thus it fit neatly into ours:-)
I think we have slipped away from the original topic of Corruption at the Govt and competitor level and got to corruption at bars and pubs level.
For us the main idea of conducting business in Poland is that Your country is in such a strategic location (Central Europe) that distribution of goods to Europe and the CIS countries is very easy. You guys are bordering with Belarus, Ukraine, Slovakia, Czech, Germany & Lithuania.... what else does one wish for other then that?
Its a heaven for Manufacturers who wants to just sit there with 20,000 sq meter warehouse and distribute the goods in all the neighboring countries.
You people are amazing....... never compare your beautiful country and your system with America or any other country. America has its own huge problems, we do have a setup in Los Angeles, Karachi, Dubai, Nairobi, Colombo, Lagos, KL and now opening in Central Europe. So I had a chance to live in all these countries for certain time.
God bless you all and God bless your beautiful country!!!
This is not the place to get sensible advice - try PAIH (I think they have a team in the Gulf) or your own embassy might have a trade service here.
Corruption is far less than it used to be - partly because of govt policies and mostly because smartphones now mean everyone has a recording device on them. However two areas where you can still encounter it are in planning permitsand in customs clearance. Play it straight from Day 1 and your first few months might be difficult but eventually your business will be OK.
@dubaidude Well, at least two posters here have no idea whatsoever about doing business in Poland. But I guess you're aware of the fact that it's just an internet forum full of random posters.
In fact, if I were you I'd be more than careful to even think of bribing someone as it may get you into some serious trouble.
You need to get someone reliable to help you through the beaurocracy for sure. I hope the company you chose has some good reviews.
@cms neuf...... Thanks, see the problem in CIS countries is that the govt is corrupt so the corruption is cascaded down till the lower level. They know that if we report, the money will go to higher authorities pockets, why not settle here? If the govt is not corrupt then the lower level staff is very careful for getting caught.
@kaprys..... I am absolutely in agreement with you. If we were OK with the bribing then there was no need for us to move to Europe but for a legal work with complete documentation, why bribe?? I am not importing drugs or any illegal stuff.......why bribe?? We did our working before deciding to come here and guess what? Poland is far much better than other European countries when it comes to corruption. My fear was that just like in Tbilisi I don't find a competitor here who uses dirty tricks to fail us. We are manufacturers and most of our competition are traders, we have far better prices then a trader and can be a threat to our competition, so just want to be careful. Though most of our goods will be for re-export from Warsaw but still the local industry as well is huge in Poland and we will be definitely looking into selling inside the country.
My respects to all of you for participating in this thread and sharing your honest opinions.
lol speaking of collussion and corruption on the gym level in Warsaw: biznes.gazetaprawna.pl/artykuly/1155778,zmowa-na-rynku-fitness-sledztwo-uokik.html
The thing was I wasnt the only one who said it Paulina. Terri's first response to the thread was also similar. By thew ay since this thread yesterday, I did some research and found some interesting dirt on Poland:
The difference seems to be that companies in Poland pay for security or ochrone, in Russia they pay mafia for the same security and call it dacha or dassek. Any other differences?
more on the dirty tricks gym can play or pakiets for gyms and businesses as a whole as multisport has taken over as a monopoly and few places are elft for rivals:
