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Ive been in the UK for 6 days to relocate and im going back to Poland.


poland_  
15 Aug 2010 /  #121
I remember you telling me about that and you have posted about it before too.
Your analogy of a sick friend is a good one, I may have to use that in the future.

Funny how things come around, here is a great song from the Waterboys " Old England"
youtube.com/watch?v=Jv_6B77pfCQ
hague1cmaeron  14 | 1366  
15 Aug 2010 /  #122
Don't be so despondent people, so long as the Conservatives remain in power things will get a little better, but first they have to get a little worse before that happens. The problem with some in the UK is that they are unwilling to think of the national good and they tend not to understand the concept, when you mention national good the first thing they think about is welfare not self sacrifice. That is why they might be tempted to revert to labour when things get a little tougher, the party with all the easy answers.
MareGaea  29 | 2751  
15 Aug 2010 /  #123
It's amazing how conservative you are, it's nearly disgusting. Forgotten yet that Thatcher, a conservative, brought the UK nearly to bancrupcy? Forgotten yet that that same Thatcher wanted everybody to own their homes, even when they could not afford it, with the result that after she had gone, the vast majority of those houses were for sale and the country fell into a crisis hardly ever seen before? That things are going bad in the UK is not the fault of Labour, it's the fault of the Conservatives. Never forget that.

Edit: Labour did a pretty good job cleaning up the mess the Conservatives left behind in the 90's. Now that a new crisis is spreading, which is normal in economics, those silly Conservatives are the first to blame Labour. But what they conveniently forget that the crisis caused by the Conservatives was much bigger than the crisis we've had in the last few years. For the UK, that is.

>^..^<

M-G (gee, those conservatives have all the easy answers ready: blame Labour, but at least Labour tried and the conservatives did not)
wildrover  98 | 4430  
15 Aug 2010 /  #124
[quote=MareGaea]brought the UK nearly to bancrupcy?

The trade unions...backed by the Labour government did a pretty neat job of sinking the country....
MareGaea  29 | 2751  
15 Aug 2010 /  #125
The trade unions...backed by the Labour government did a pretty neat job of sinking the country....

What about Thatcher? She ruined the country pretty much at the end of the 80's. The crisis in the UK started much earlier. And you know that very well, wildrover!

>^..^<

M-G (darn, always blame everything on the Left!)
hague1cmaeron  14 | 1366  
15 Aug 2010 /  #126
Forgotten yet that Thatcher, a conservative, brought the UK nearly to bancrupcy? Forgotten yet that that same Thatcher wanted everybody to own their homes, even when they could not afford it

It is amazing how politically illiterate you are, when Thatcher came to power Britain was nearing bankruptcy, the former labour chancellor had to go to the IMF with a begging bawl,and the unions held the country to ransom. Ever heard of the winter discontent? When Thatcher came to power she paid down the debt and much more, under her reign the country grew wealthy to an unprecedented degree.

this is how it use to be.

youtube.com/watch?v=Je65Vw7ndro

youtube.com/watch?v=-k8lMc3QmSk
wildrover  98 | 4430  
15 Aug 2010 /  #127
What about Thatcher?

Yep..i voted for her....

she was not afraid to take on the unions , and sank their boat good and proper....

Later the Labour government followed her example to curb the power of the unions , as they too could see the damage they were doing....

She screwed up on the Pole tax though....

I objected to it on the grounds i did not have any Poles living at my house...

Little was i to know that some years later i would have four Poles living at my house , and at one point eight more that i had to rescue from a tricky situation...
MareGaea  29 | 2751  
15 Aug 2010 /  #128
It is amazing how politically illiterate you are

Don't say that to me again. Just because I don't buy that conservative nonsense doesn't mean that I don't know, ok? I'm getting tired of all those conservative nitwits who think they have all the knowledge. And then they copy my lines. Weak.

When Thatcher came to power she paid down the debt and much more, under her reign the country grew wealthy to an unprecedented degree.

Yeah, it was so wealthy that all those ppl who bought their houses under her reign, nearly all had to sell it again after she was gone as they couldn't afford it anymore. Up until 1983 it went well with Thatcherism, after that it went downhill and the UK is still suffering from that consequence. In 1991 it was a country on the verge of bancrupcy. And it has never fully recovered from that.

She screwed up on the Pole tax though....

The Poll Tax was a welcome error, at least the UK was liberated from Thatcher since it burst the bubble of what Thatcherism really was.

>^..^<

M-G (tiens)
wildrover  98 | 4430  
15 Aug 2010 /  #129
Yeah, it was so wealthy that all those ppl who bought their houses under her reign, nearly all had to sell it again

The reason her government gave people the right to buy their council houses , is because a guy with a mortgage is much less likely to want to go on a pointless strike called by the unions...worked very well indeed...

Yes of course many of those who bought were lifelong council tennants , who never should have been allowed to own a house...

A peasant will always be a peasant...even if you give them money..
MareGaea  29 | 2751  
15 Aug 2010 /  #130
Thatcherism was only good for those who already had money. Not for those who didn't. And then this horny dance with Ronald Reagan. Virtually made me sick. We in the rest of Europe didn't shed a tear when she left the stage.

a pointless strike called by the unions

You're referring to the great miner's strike of 1983-1985? That was during the Thatcher years and eventually caused her politics to go downhill. After that it became clear that everything was based on hot air, a bubble, just waiting to burst. That it eventually did was only due to the fact that the Poll-Tax showed Thatcher's true face.

>^..^<

M-G (off to bed)
hague1cmaeron  14 | 1366  
15 Aug 2010 /  #131
Don't say that to me again. Just because I don't buy that conservative nonsense doesn't mean that I don't know, ok? I'm getting tired of all those conservative nitwits who think they have all the knowledge. And then they copy my lines. Weak.

Why not, when you said she increased debt when in fact she did the exact opposite? Not only was she able to decrease the country's debt she also managed to reduce taxes that damaged the country's wealth creation capacity.

MT motion of no confidence in the commons.

youtube.com/watch?v=-jNMdDvXI2c&feature=related

And no, you are wrong everyone in private enterprise benefited under her, especially tradesman like plumbers etc. Hardly wealthy are they?

And what is wrong with owning your own home?
wildrover  98 | 4430  
15 Aug 2010 /  #132
Thatcherism was only good for those who already had money. Not for those who didn't.

Unlike the Labour government which threw money at the poor and unemployed , and created a nation of spongers...
MareGaea  29 | 2751  
15 Aug 2010 /  #133
Why not, when you said she increased debt when in fact she did the exact opposite? Not only was she able to decrease the country's debt she also managed to reduce taxes that damaged the country's wealth creation capacity.

Like I said, it worked until 1983 - and the great miner's strike played a catalyst role in it. After that it went downhill, as became clear that only a handful of Brits enjoyed materially what Thatcher was doing. And in the end it was as bad, if not worse than it was before she came to power. This unprecedented wealth and the clearing of debts was only a temporary effect, felt by only a handful.

Unlike what you conservatives think, some left-wingers do know their stuff.

Unlike the Labour government which threw money at the poor and unemployed , and created a nation of spongers...

And what Thatcher did was exactly the same, with the difference that the group who had always been richer than those spongers, became richer and those spongers became even more poor and more in debt than they already were. Thatcher didn't care about the lower class. Don't pretend she did. That mortgage plan of hers was only to reach a hand to the property developers, the guys who owned. They earned loads by this policy and those poor fcukers who fell for it, had to pay the bill in the end. Not that much difference with the current crisis, I would say.

>^..^<

M-G (now really off to bed)
hague1cmaeron  14 | 1366  
15 Aug 2010 /  #134
some left-wingers do know their stuff.

This is the most complete illiterate rubbish i have ever heard, totally at odds with all statistics. Just plain wrong!

it is just so wrong i don't know were to start.

Why do you think that 'New Labour' and Blair modeled themselves on Thacher and adopted some of her policies if she was so wrong?
Amathyst  19 | 2700  
15 Aug 2010 /  #135
"The British can never see the writing on the wall untill they have their backs to it"

Bollox, the British have been leading and not enacting some script...Scrawled on a "wall!" ...If it were so, we'd be lagging behind! Me thinks those words were written by some tossy middle class fuckwit who had no idea! The Industrial Revolution was fueled by the working class whilst those writing this rubbish were deciding what to have for dinner! Please dont quote one persons pathetic one liner without knowing the history of your country!!

For those that have written England off and think its a mire with no future, please feel free to leave or dont bother coming back, some of us love "gods own county"..my green and pleasant land! FOREVER ENGLAND! FOREVER ENGLISH!..This isnt a racist statement, this is a fact! Same as those on this board as Polish and proud of it.
Chicago Pollock  7 | 503  
15 Aug 2010 /  #137
wildrover

A peasant will always be a peasant...even if you give them money..

Nonsense. "...the only difference between a rich and poor person is that the rich person has more money." Donald Trump

hague1cmaeron

And what is wrong with owning your own home?

Nothing. Everyone should own their own home. Home ownership is in the Public Interest. People can afford to own homes if they have good paying jobs.

Speaking of England I was last there in 2005? 2006? and my favorite place is the Northeast Coast (Northeast Lincolnshire, Yorkshire). I've been all over England (except the Northwest) and I have to say that I like the People along the Northeast Coast the most. Give me York or Scarborough or Cleethrope (sp?). Lovely friendly good natured people. Maybe the reason I like it so much is that it's a heavily ag (agricultural) area. You see plenty of farm equipment on the roads. Just like home. The best meal I ever had in England was in a pub in Scarborough near the castle (whatever it's called). Roast beef and gravy, roast potatoes, yorkshire pudding. Great traditional English meal. There are two Englands, London and the English countryside. I'll take the Countryside (sometimes it's too serene).
FUZZYWICKETS  8 | 1878  
15 Aug 2010 /  #138
Welshguyinpola wrote:

I am fed up of the **** tv here dancing, dancing and more dancing coupled with some lousy soap operas.

hahaha, it's so true.

what, you mean you don't like to hear Pudzian sing duets or watch him doing the tango in a Shrek outfit?
Avalon  4 | 1063  
15 Aug 2010 /  #139
MareGaea

Thatcherism was only good for those who already had money.

Bollocks!!!.I and many of my friends started our business's up when she came to power. She gave us the incentive to work hard, to earn good money, and more inportantly, to be able to keep it.

MareGaea

We in the rest of Europe didn't shed a tear when she left the stage.

Perhaps that was because she negotiated an £11 billion rebate from the UK's contrubitions to the EU and always refused requests to recind it.

hague1cmaeron

Correct. She was the only post-war PM to repay and reduce the national debt by half. Labour have now put us back into the worse situation since WW1.

Why not, when you said she increased debt when in fact she did the exact opposite? Not only was she able to decrease the country's debt she also managed to reduce taxes that damaged the country's wealth creation capacity.

Seanus  15 | 19666  
15 Aug 2010 /  #140
Looking back at Thatcher, she remained true to her goals. I was never a fan of hers but she rigidly clung to her position which was negatively interpreted by Ken Clark, Michael Portillo, Michael Heseltine, John Major and other Conservative Cabinet members of that era. Norman Baker was a stubborn git over the ERM discussions and it was like they had all been debriefed to take Britain down this road. Thatcher had to go and she was made out to be like a mental patient. Yes, she had dizzy moments when speaking (I mean that literally) but she was coherent enough to know that the dilution of national sovereignty was a very real danger. Hindsight is 20/20 but let's be glad for that!

I like Ken Clark as a man. He is well spoken and articulate. However, he is a Bilderberger and thus I question just how autonomous he was. Smart men should use their judgement and not have it used for them!!
wildrover  98 | 4430  
15 Aug 2010 /  #141
For those that have written England off and think its a mire with no future, please feel free to leave or dont bother coming back,

I for one , have not written the Uk off....i just worry about it...!
Seanus  15 | 19666  
15 Aug 2010 /  #142
I recommend a thoroughly likeable Englishman, Pat Condell. He sees things very well and comments on the issues of the day that serve to bring the UK down. He's very articulate and knows the negative factors impacting on the UK. He also neatly ties in international cases that have repercussions for the UK. God Bless him!
wildrover  98 | 4430  
15 Aug 2010 /  #143
. The best meal I ever had in England was in a pub in Scarborough near the castle (whatever it's called). Roast beef and gravy, roast potatoes, yorkshire pudding. Great traditional English meal.

The pub you are talking about is called the Albion.....I used to have a flat just over the road from the place....

Its been a bikers pub in the past , and at one time was a gay pub , but i think its more of a family place now....


  • 29408_6f207ed4928b8b.jpg
poland_  
15 Aug 2010 /  #144
It's amazing how conservative you are, it's nearly disgusting.

Absolutey WRONG.

Thatcher was good for the UK, she turned things around, ok at the expense of the miners and the unions. The Uk had fallen into to a socialist cesspit, the unions were destroying the country, then PM Thatcher and her conservatives brought it to an end, she was respected the world over. Fast forward 30 years, the same decline and the conservatives now have the chance to clear up the mess left behind by the Labour inept. Cameron is not made of the same metal as PM Thatcher, but at least he the conservatives realize that the party must end and they understand they are accountable to the genrel public.
Seanus  15 | 19666  
15 Aug 2010 /  #145
She also introduced the poll tax against the advice of her senior ministers. She lied over the Falklands and was taken to task by a housewife (one Mrs Gould). She introduced General Management into teaching in the NHS, a grossly incompatible step. She limited the scope of Aneurin Bevan's 'from cradle to grave' vision to those who could afford it. She moved so far away from the Scandinavian model of public services that it was laughable.

As I said, I liked her stance on Europe as she simply made us aware of relinquishing power, ceding it to Brussels. However, she was a domestic disaster on many counts.
delphiandomine  86 | 17823  
15 Aug 2010 /  #146
Perhaps that was because she negotiated an £11 billion rebate from the UK's contrubitions to the EU and always refused requests to recind it.

Blair's giving up of part of the rebate in exchange for precisely nothing tangible was perhaps the worst thing he could have done. He had a golden, golden chance to say "CAP Reform or nothing" - as the UK had always done previously. But no, he wilted in the face of Eastern European opposition - which was frankly ridiculous.

To this day, I'm not seeing what the UK actually got out of it, apart from losing cash.
southern  73 | 7059  
15 Aug 2010 /  #147
I remember our former prime minister Andreas Papandreou had a fetish to annoy and enrage Thatcher in every EU cabinet.I think he did it to become likeable to Miteran and imterior front.
wildrover  98 | 4430  
15 Aug 2010 /  #148
She also introduced the poll tax against the advice of her senior ministers.

Yes , that was a pretty big goof....and she paid for it...!
Seanus  15 | 19666  
15 Aug 2010 /  #149
I think her whisky consumption 'shot' up after that. Arguably, Maggie had it much harder as, despite her landslide majority, the tide turned and Labour began chipping away and clawing back many voters. She had to contend with a vociferous Scargill and rising working class. In Poland now, PO don't have such an immediate challenge but PiS showed their grit and determination. Their problem will be that they will need to keep incentives in place for businesspeople to thrive. If they don't, they will lose critical voters and there are many here that could switch to PiS over tax disillusionment and loss of earnings etc.
time means  5 | 1309  
15 Aug 2010 /  #150
Bollox,

I don't think so. Look at the country today and the quote stands. Hopefully we can now see the writing on the wall and do something about it.

The Industrial Revolution was fueled by the working class

More likely the mill and mine owners wanting more production.

I recommend a thoroughly likeable Englishman, Pat Condell

Me too.

....and she paid for it...!

Thank fcuk!

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