Is it possible that Polish president was assasinated? If so then, by whom?

But it could be an unfortunate coincidence. You don't know for sure if it really is sabotage.

Olga, you are a conspiracy freak. Your attitude can possibly be explained by a hatred of the former Soviet Union, KGB or anything else, but this doesn't make your words sound right when it comes to the topic.

In this disaster everything is so clear as it can possibly be. Practically, the whole accident has already been investigated just on the basis of the open information and the witnesses living in the area.

So, this is the classical controlled flight into terrain. The pilots were landing in a heavy mist on the military airfield that never had any landing system of civil aviation type and violating the recommendations of the flight control to go to a different airport. Without the ILS system the pilots attempted to land looking for radio signals and lights, and being on the reight course, lost control of the altitude while looking for the sights of the terrain. This was a fatal error, since the terrain rises up by ca. 40-50 meters to the level of the airfield just 1.5 kilometers away from the end of the landing strip. The pilots seem to have detected the ground at its rising slope, when it was too late. The airplane hit the tree (and you can see it in the photoseries in the link below), lost the part of the left wing, became uncontrollable and hit the ground just 200 meters away from the airfield.

The link to the photo series is below.
picasaweb.google.ru/Amlmtr/MWzNeJ#
An old broken birch tree is the one that had apparently been hit and became the cause of the disaster.

Photo #45 shows the reconstructed path of the aircraft, and you can also see it in the Wikimapia.
picasaweb.google.ru/Amlmtr/MWzNeJ#5459881356386012002

The only real question in this story is why the pilots made such a risky decision. The circumstances are already practically determined, and you'll see them proved officially as soon as the Polish investigators make public releases about the reasons of the accident.

There is no room for conspiracy speculation about the role of Putin, KGB and all that ********. This all is already destroyed by the facts that we already know from the mass media. You may believe that Putin planted this birch tree or instructed the pilots of the President's aircraft to ignore the flight controls. But this just makes the others think you are a freak, or perhaps a network troll. Your decision.

The fact that the invited guests died in Russia, is a pain for all of us. Please accept condolences to the people of Poland.

i must agree. It could be an accident

1. Georgia never joined NATO. There was just some talk about it. But now NATO leaders will think twice, if not triple times, before continue to deal with Georgian leaders.

2. Georgia was punished not for joining NATO or plans to do so. Georgian military commanded Georgian peacekeepres, that was on same positions as Russian peacekeepers, to silently withdraw, and then opened gunfire to russian peacekeepers and Tchinvali civil buildings. You'll find the rest (with lots of photos) on the Net.

3. Concerning South Ossetia and Abkhazia - better read something before saying that it is legally part of Georgia. Especially about referendums in beginning of 1991 and their results, that was completely ignored by gerogian nationalists that take control over Georgia that time.

How about an alliance between 2 power-hungry Prime Ministers, one on each side, hmmm?

any combination is possible. Alliance of two or few, conspiracy between some internal Polish and foreign factor, etc, etc.

quote=Velund]Georgia never joined NATO[/quote]
Sorry, Georgia was puinished for NATO aspirations. Same sh*t. And those were regions that wanted to break away from Georgia, that Russian tanks swooped in in an attempt to scoop up.

This is certainly not unique to Russia.


Him? Even the West concedes the 'journalist' to be a spy: news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk/6180682.stm


Agreed - like that pesky Swine Flu thing. Good on Poland.


Are you Polish?


It was never the EU's to lose in the first place.


...in defense of the aggressor. Good on Russia.

BTW, just read in the news that one of two parametric recorders will be transported and opened in Warsaw, where will be analyzed with participation of russian experts. Voice recorder and second parametric recorder will be analyzed in Moscow with participation of polish experts.

I was referring to real journalists, not Litvinenko. Like Politkovskaya and others.

Where is their profit from that? Only to demonstrate for Olga that they are true devils they are ready to lose everything?

The video below, recorded shortly after the crash, will be examined
by the experts to determine its authenticity. It shows the wreck
still burning, you can hear a siren and something like shots fired.

youtube.com/watch?v=ZofR4YmsuHg

The results of the analysis will be known in about 2 days.

Shots after the crash ? Prosecution will examine film.

"In the Internet appeared the movie filmed just after the presidential plane crash near Smolensk. Heard shots on him " - reports "Radio ZET " on its website. Radio also learned that the film intends to examine the prosecutor's office .

" We can not downplay " - told Radio ZET Colonel Jerzy Artymiak the chief of the Military Prosecutor's Office . " In an interview with Radio ZET , Jerzy Artymiak stresses that the decision was made to examine the film by experts. They determine its origin, content and authenticity. Phonoscopic analysis will also be subjected to background sound film. Results will be known for two days " - says

How would they lose everything if nobody finds out? Why you think Putin is front and center of investigation--expert in suppression.


I know that, maybe you should actually read the article: euobserver.com/9/29831

If "Grad" missiles and 120 mm cannon shells shot to civil buildings is "aspirations" - I don't know what is "love" in your language.

I've seen many photos/videos of the crash site, and that is NOT what can be considered as HEAVY fog. Bulls**t story coming from bulls**t masters.

you said that

What then Poland doing in NATO if isn`t that important?? If Poland isn`t THAT important to NATO (NATO leading powers), Poland should maybe think about leaving the alliance, isn`t it? Its maybe best for Poland to be military neutral, as it is Serbia.

See, maybe Kaczynski got same idea... and now, there is no Kaczynski.

If you are not the one experiencing the event, in the cockpit flying the plane, how do you know what it was the pilot saw or the troubles he had? You cannot possibly know.

Olechka, I wonder if you realize that the lion's share of your accusations towards Russia is based on unfounded speculations. I personally don't mind if you use any data like "litvinenko or politkovskaja killed at order of putin" but you gotta prove it first.

I would be interested to know if Tusk used the same plane when he went there three days earlier. Does anyone know anything about that?

Sasha...go find Russian forum somewhere.

i have to go back and read some, but the coincidents add up, even if its 50/50 chance what would you bet, now i know that doesnt mean much but i like if/then predictions like if this was an accident then...and if this was an assassination then... let me go on as Katyn was called "the crime and the lie" in this instance the crime is simple while the lie can be complicated, I know this is still not enough to go on but I predict all were involved and Iran will not be an issue by the end of the year.


still new here so i admit that, but this stuff is like whack a mole, pressure here makes something pop up somewhere else.

i read that preliminary findings would come out wed/thurs anything?

olga we love you your doing a fine job

You're out of order, Olga.

Sasha has been a valued member of the forum for almost two years and he's
a Gold Member (which means that, apart from his valuable comments, he also
contributed financially to the existence of the forum). You are in no postition
to tell Sasha (or anyone else for that matter) to find a different forum.

The answer is simple: once the Warschau Pact was disbanded, Poland wanted to join the other club. Firstly, because it was afraid of any new Russian aspirations; secondly, like a kid that lives on his own for the first time in his life he does everything the parents always forbade him to: they went to the other side to make clear that the Eastern Bloc really was over.

Thank you czar...I have been doing a lot of research as you can tell, and I know what I'm talking about. Let me know if you want good links. I spoke with pilot friend couple of days ago. There were reports the plane was dumping fuel on approach, means pilot was getting ready for crash landing and was dumping it to prevent explosion/fire on impact.

On the other side, Yugoslavia/Serbia always chooses middle way, nor Warsaw Pact, nor NATO

So we got middle finger

But listen, middle finger is always an option. Go ask Kaczinsky

Olga: You can't dump fuel on TU-154. There goes your research.

That's fine--I'll just ignore any more smarmy "Olechka" references by him.


Exactly. So why so quick to blame the pilot :P

the plane cant dump fuel but this just shows discrepency in accounts.

anyway if putin contributed to this forum what then


check and mate, hah i just wanted to say that but no, i cant joke im letting humor creep in as a coping mechanism.

Boeing 737 & 757 do not have fuel dumping ability. Tupolev-154 absolutely has fuel dumping capability.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fuel_dumping

Lech Kaczynski was not assasinated! He is responsible of killing all the ones on board! It was his decision to land and it was his order! The pilot had to obey the order!

Leszek

I think that might have sth to do with a personal disliking between Tito and Stalin.