Palikot - too liberal/modern for Poland?

And become what PiS supporters have become? No one deserves such terrible fate.

PiS is definitely not ideal. But still better than Palikot.

I disagree. But that's our opposing views :)

Actually, from what we can see last time, Palikot actually gained votes that didn't exist before the election.

Anyway, taking votes away from those two is meaningless - Palikot will never, ever, ever support PiS. And it means your boys will stay in opposition forever!

As for you legend, remind us, where do you live?

I see you need tutoring. So far I have been easy on you. Now it gonna change.
Remind me what are you? Some kind of big boss in company of brow-nosing and ass licking? You are talking about skills? You haven't present none here - just occasional rambling. Most of which are incoherent ramblings. Maybe try Russian or pidgin that would be more suitable for your type of a intellect.

Ah you must be a hell of a dwarf if calling somebody little makes you feel better. Delusion of grander right? Doesn't work on me boy I don't care much for morons.


Sure you disagree with cronies connected to PO you would looking for job.

What makes me laugh is that you keep accusing PO of doing exactly what PiS did.

What makes me laugh that you have no idea but you are repeating BS.

Oh please Ironside, you weren't in Poland, you had no idea how PiS went about their business. You weren't the one sitting and watching as they put the old TKM philosophy into practice, nor were you the one who saw the top job going to some inexperienced moron from Gdansk.

The best example - who did Kaczynski appoint as head of the CBA? Hmm....

honest man? And really involved in anti-commie opposition.


I native, I know more then you will ever learn. Also I have been there at the beginning. I know people who were a center of action there.

I'm not gonna name the names but presidents of city, Deputy Prime minister, President of Poland, MP a dozen a dime, Prime mister, Have been cooperating for some time with a person who is being mocked here constantly but he is a sound and logical dude(no I never knew Kaczysnkich although few people from PC when they have been residing on Krakowskie Przedmiescie or Pulawska not sure).

Another Prime minister I think I can name him Mazowiecki, a nice pleasant guy to talk to but a big disappointment.
Summary.
Don't tell me that you know better Delphi about politics in Poland.Unless you are Luft in disguise.

Right where they belong


The same applies to you calling everyone else idiots and morons.


lol

I thought so, I dislike this organisation for probably the exact opposite reasons you do. I don't like mad right wing populist organisations.

Ruch Palikota, right wing?

Errmmm....Barney, we are talking about the same party, right?

That's what I was thinking. Centre-left if aything.

Yes, they are classily Hayek.
There is nout leftwing or right wing about sexual politics or anti clericalism.

Well, actually......

The fact that is a major annoyance while discussing politics is that great majority considers our political scene to be one-dimensional. Being narrowed to just one axis, we can classify many parties as leftist or rightist, that in reality don't have that much in common. A definitely better way of classification is to place a party on a two-dimensional plane, such as this one:



Known also as Nolan Chart in its variation, allows to classify parties and their views not only based on economic left or right, but also considering how much do they want to restrict people's freedoms (libertarian vs authoritarian).

Since we're discussing Palikot's movement, I can certainly see a lot of postulates that are economically to the right, such as lowering government expenses, limiting the government itself, reduce taxation, reduce costs of employment and self-employment, and so on. On the other hand, you see a lot of postulates that are leaning towards personal freedom, usually characteristic for the before-mentioned one-axis left, such as legalizing soft drugs, deregulating abortion, legalizing gay marriage. So this places Palikot's movement leaning towards the purple area of the chart, which according to its description, is Right Libertarian (Nolan Chart would describe it as both economical and personal freedom). One of the main reasons of Palikot's success in recent election is the fact that no party would fit into that area before. So voters who would like to enjoy their both economical and personal freedoms, having no one to vote for before and feeling unrepresented in the Parliament, suddenly got someone to vote for.

Then think about PiS. People blindly consider them right-wing conservatives. They are definitely conservatives when it comes to personal freedoms, where they would want to restrict everything and anything. However, would a rightist party really bring up postulates such as: progressive income tax, government social spending, free (government funded) education, government funding programs, and so on. That sounds like a party that has a leftist program.

Palikot's movement no matter which way you slice it is very much to the right of centre probably a little more to the right. That crazy tea party libertarian stuff they promote is extremely toxic to society as a whole. That smokescreen of personal freedom is the exact opposite of what it appears to be. Personal freedom only comes with personal wealth and their policies will do nothing to improve social mobility.

Barney, really, do you know anything about Ruch Palikota?

They aren't promoting tea party stuff at all - they're promoting liberal economic reforms that Poland badly needs, especially in the area of ZUS for small businesspeople. Their policies will in fact help people massively - they support the abolition of KRUS, which will certainly help everyone as we no longer have to pay to support uneconomic farms.


They are anything but. They're Catholic Socialists. And they're harder to the left than any other party in Poland economically.

Tell me this one lads,

How long have I got to live in Poland before I can vote?
I can vote in local elections and EU, but what about national ones?

Or do you have to be a Polish citizen?

Do you know anything about politics?

They are straight from central casting every cliche in the book.

Yep, unfortunately. I'm going to apply for citizenship as soon as I can - just so I can vote.


Reforming the business environment in Poland is a 'cliche'?

It's no secret that the average Palikot voter is being robbed blind.

And Palikot's greatest 'liberal economic reform' was an appeal for the state to start building factories! This guy will do and say anything just to stay in the limelight. He once ran a Cahtolic magazine Ozon (very good in fact) and later tried to be a poor man's Luther by nailing his declaration of Apostasy to a church door. He is the consummate happening artist and will bring a pig's head or rubber penis to a TV stuido, or knock down shots of vodka on the street as long as TV cameras are whirring nearby. Megalomanic ego-tripper he is!

You forgot "leader of the 3rd biggest party in the Sejm".

By the way, who was it that brought an iPad to the Sejm to give a speech? Not Palikot.

Vote for Palikot, he seems you're kind of guy.

Yeah, just like world peace.........supported by beauty pageant people.

... what? clearly, when it comes to personal freedoms, they are nowhere near being to the right. Read my previous post.


Exactly! It's like the older part of SLD (stara gwardia) or UP with a strict, religious undertone.


A wise man changes his mind, a fool never will. I'm personally happy to see the change.


At least he's not spending his third year sick in his own mind trying to prove the myth that Smolensk was a coup d'état.


I remember that! Hilarious and pathetic. The law doesn't let him speak? Who cares about the law?! *Takes iPad out*.


I'm a kind of guy too!


Right. Anything that's an attempt at fixing current economic situation would be considered cliche, then. Garbage.

Oh dear.

Everyone stands in election to "fix the economy" no one stands on a platform to wreck the economy it's a cliche. If you don't understand that you have no business discussing politics. But then someone who would vote for a whole new movement coincidently named after the leader and thinks it was a liberating vote is beyond redemption.

The words maybe. But take a look at the program. At least read the bullet points. What he proposes is far better than what anyone else has to offer.


Everyone has business discussing politics, because politics concern everyone's everyday lives.


I'm the last one to vote for a party just for its name and not what it has to offer instead. What are you basing your assumption on?