Poland's interior minister and the central bank chief recorded

The two men allegedly discussed how the bank could help the government deal with a budget deficit and increase its chances of re-election in 2015.

Under Polish law, the central bank must remain independent of politics.
Lovely.

Lets have a link to back up your story please.

Wow, top news story in Poland and you ask for a link..

PF members in other parts of the world might not have seen it, as there are other things going on at the moment, like the crisis in Ukraine and Iraq for example.

And the story gets murkier by the day. Worth looking at where the restaurant owner's registered business address is.

At least give us a clue what to search on! Never mind, I found it, but Vincent was right.

I was going to ask about this the other day.
Had some problem logging in .. the site gets iffy when I am on different PC.

My fiance is really worried about it. Specially since he says a good portion of his generation do not feel their votes count, so do not vote. He is afraid a backlash/panic against the party they are in will panic elderly and anti-communists into voting anybody of opposite party. He was watching the effect on their currency (because he is saving and after degree going to work to get to me).

He talked about it over 4 hours and he almost NEVER speaks things political to me.

He compared it with corresponding members of my "murican gubermint" as best he could. By the sound of it is pretty racy. White water/Watergate level racy

I guess it is pretty cloak and dagger stuff that seemed set up to catching some politics as usual at the perfect corrupt moment?

I want to see links too. ....
He was watching news while we were in Skype playing cards; but I can't get on demand Polish news.
Not to mention my Polish has regressed this year without daily practice with my study buddy.

I am back to: Hello/goodbye - I like pickles -Where is the bus station? -How much is i? _ kind of phrases. The rest could be a compliment with a proposition or told I dress like asylum patient and I'd still be nodding and smiling

But I was curious. I wouldn't have known who half the people he was talking about were if not for here. And the other half? can be martian. I wouldn't know.

nytimes.com/2014/06/17/world/europe/secret-tapes-of-politicians-cause-a-stir-in-poland.html?_r=0
irishtimes.com/business/economy/poland-s-central-bank-chief-regrets-language-used-in-secret-recording-1.1833304

haha this is Polish forums and people don't know the most important news from Poland:D

anyway, i hope the era of Tusk is over. now or never.

so two movers-n-shakers were secretly taped trying to boot a government official out. What is the big deal?

The big deal is that government forces are at this second raiding the offices of Wprost.

I'm generally a PO supporter, but this is either the end of the current government or the end of Poland's chances to become a western democracy.

embarrassing... but in a way, I'm glad Polish government is taking this wiretaping (recording?) issue seriously.

One interesting thing is that the owner of the restaurant where it happened (popular with politicians - I used to live nearby and see famous faces going in and out all the time) has his registered business address on Russian Embassy property. It explains a lot. Just the sort of thing they'd do.

Another scandal. I wonder if this'll do it or it will take something more for people to realize PO are a bunch of crooks.

For quite a while PO's only argument has been 'okay there's been another mess up, but do you want PiS to run the country?.'

Hopefully this won't fly anymore and they get kicked out soon, or at the latest, during elections.

That's basically it, and thank heavens most people don't want those PiS clowns back. They'd drag the country back into the doldrums within 6 months.

PiS have no economic policy to speak of and their social policies are ludicrous. All they have is a somewhat 'charismatic' (slightly-deranged) leader who doesn't know his arse from his elbow.

However, the worrying thing in this case is this:
"The goal of this well-organized crime was not the public good, but eavesdropping on politicians of the ruling party," Mr. Tusk said. (From the NY Times link above)

If PO is helbent on censoring whistleblowers then they are no better than PiS. While I don't really think that Belka did much wrong, it would be perfectly common in other situations with the government to ask about future cabinet ministers etc, it's quite worrying that PO are attempting to bring the whistleblower before the courts and I well done to Wprost for not revealing its sources.

Another worrying aspect is the Andrzej Parafianowicz situation. If he used his power to stop an investigation then he should be called before a court.

But, let's not forget, for some idiotic reason, Polish politicians enjoy immunity while in office. And until that is written out of law then this lovely corrupt country will remain as it always has been. Corrupt to the bone with a feckless elite running the show, be that PO, PiS or whoever.

Career politicians couldn't care less for their constituents in Poland, believing that they do is just swallowing their nonsense.

Yes basically it's worrying that he has done what he always does, tried to sweep this under the carpet like nothing has happened. For crying out loud they wanted to have more money printed. Then who would pay for it in the long run? Tax payers. The situation is so bad that even the pro PO mainstream media has no option but to criticize them, because what else can they do?

It's certainly interesting.

I reckon it's because journalism in Poland is a tight, closed-shop. Particularly political journalism. I've seen it on other countries. When the government tries to f!ck with the media they close ranks and support each other. Poland for all its faults enjoys quite a free media, so threatening to bring journlists to court to reveal sources will not go down well and I would presume two things here.

a) the Wprost author/editor would rather serve jail time than reveal sources, if it comes to that.
b) no judge in his right mind would send the author/editor to jail...not while under the watchful eye of the EU anyway.

Or, on the other hand, the traditionally pro-PO side of the media might have come to realise that it's time to move away from PO and get behind Palikot. That would be interesting

For me, the Parafianowicz situation is more worrying. But because the law here is so bat-sh!t crazy he'll get away with it. Immunity for politicians must end.

The Belka thing isn't really that important, it's day-to-day politics. The head of the bank ask a politician whether another politician will find himself in a position in the future. That's about it.

The printing money thing would have helped to lower inflation, which would keep foreign investors interested in Poland and helped to keep interest rates down. Sure, it devalues the zloty for us living here, but when have they cared about us? They want foreign money to 'go further' and while the EU is still pumping money into Poland, those in power will continue to want to line their pockets with Brussel's money.

Have a look around the internet for successful tendering processes that have been awarded to brother/uncles/in-law/close (or distant) relatives of ministers. Corruption is still rampant in Poland and will continue to be so for a long time.

The question is what will Polish citizens do about it?
The answer is they'll do what they've always done.
Nothing, just accept it and get on with their lives coz they're so apathetic towards the boot that's firmly placed on their necks they barely even notice it's there anymore.

Interesting situation watching the Polish media now. We have the media reporting on wrong doings against....the Polish media! Not hard to work out who's side they will be on. They're right to be angry though.


Not sure I agree with this. His European parliament results were horrible and his projected support for future parliamentary elections is awful. He has lost a lot of support. Why would they get on his bandwagon? Unless you know something I don't.

osce.org/fom/120003

now even osce is interested about the case. lovely.

If PO use the police to raid newspapers and confiscate materials without a court order, they are going to alienate the educated middle classes and lose votes, including mine.

How long ya gotta live here before you can vote in Polish elections?

a) The AWB are not part of the Polish government.
b) The AWB have a legal obligation to investigate corruption, to do that they needed materials which Wprost didn't want to hand over.


Whisteblowers? Try criminals. Illegal recording and ones which I fully expect was used to attempt to blackmail one or both of those men, not a whistle.


I support media not revealing sources, except when those sources/media obtained their info by criminal means, such as the phone hacking scum at the News of the World.


Depends which ones you're talking about. I expect you can already vote in the local, mayoral, municipal and European. For national elections it's still Polish citizens only (but that may change soon).

So, you think they tried to blackmail those involved and then when that didn't work they went to the press?


That's a wee bit different though ain't it, that was journalists invading privacy. A newspaper printing info that came from Hugh Grant's voicemail isn't exactly earth-shattering info.

However, if they 'hacked' a politician's voicemail and got information regarding him closing down a case involving his family then the journalist would have to be praised.


Yea, long enough for those. Don't think I'll be changing nationality just to vote in elections. I'm useless, I usually vote for the most unpopular guy on the list coz he usually looks like he needs the numbers....unless he's with Sinn Fein, I'd never vote for those faux-Marxist headbangers.

The amount of money Wprost can pay for this is too small to make the effort and risk worthwhile. So either this was done for blackmail purposes in terms of cash or for political purposes (replacing certain politicians with more favoured ones).


Actually it was mainly a PI paid by the journalists, but the principle is the same: a news article being made possible by a criminal act.


Regardless of why the investigation had been started against the family member and if that family member had been up to no good and whether the officials in question had themselves behaved properly?


So register and vote in them all. I've voted in every one of those election since Poland joined the EU (except one, when I went to make sure my name was on the list and then remembered I had something better to do that day).

Seems logical yea, looks like PO will weather the storm though or will this vote of no confidence from PiS lead to the govt falling....and probably being voted back in?


Yep, actually all the more reason for them to hack it if they suspect that more corruption was involved.

I'd be interested in where you found this out. I've searched for it but can't find anything. If it's true, it seems to cast the whole affair in a completely new light, but so far the media doesn't seem to have picked up on it.

Polish TV broadcast clear images of ABW agents who are involved in counter-espionage operations. Clear voices too. Boris can stay in bed and see exactly who's been tailing him. Illegal TV coverage. And now the neighbours know - and the schoolteachers too. I was visiting parents-in-law yesterday - and the neighbour came round, saying "Have you seen X on TV?" Fantastic. Bravo.

I'm using government in the US sense - and ABW are definitely a governmental organization.