Demonstrations in Poland in defence of democracy.

Old man Gross is known for playing the anti-Semitic card to curry favour with America's Jewish egghead set. Hardly a reliable source. This "scholar" claimed among other things that the testimony of a Holocaust survivor must be accepted as historical truth. In addition to quintupling the number of alleged victims at Jedwabne. But his anti-Polish lies and distortions have made him a pile in the Kosher circles who readily lap up any anti-Polish garbage that comes their way.

Old Europe, new Europe, we're all in it together - and this is something the majority here are happy with. The current regime don't seem to get that.

The profits siphoned abroad by foreign-interests group who have cashed in on investing in Poland as an exploitable cheap manpower and assembly-works site Poland far exceed the EU handouts Poland has received.


Becuase the propagandists keep banging away on the allegedly "generous" subsidies Poland is getting. If people knew that the profits extracted from Polish blood, sweat and tears exceeded the handouts, if they knew how much theor Old EU equivalents are earning, they'd soon sing a different tune. But the pro-EU fanatics carefully suppress such information.

Siphoned? Perhaps you just object to the principle of profit.

Nothing to stop youy (or anyone else here) buying shares in the companies you object to so much, and seeing a return on your investment - assuming the folly and ineptitude of PiS doesn't cause any more instability than it has already.


Jobs.

They deserve to be heard, yes. And now Duda is considering stripping Gross of the Order of Merit - for telling what is very likely the truth,

Gross and the truth are absolute antitheses!

There have been so many fabricated stories about the Holocaust - including Ernest Wiel who has been proven a fraud. Yet the reports of people who contradict any 'historical fact' of the holocaust are totally silenced.


This Jan T. Gross guy is another Polish traitor who has sold himself out to foreign interests. I can't believe he calls himself a Pole and yet says things like "Poles killed more Jews than Germans". I believe a prosecutor is trying him for libel or something. Yeah, I'm the truth is more Poles killed Jews than Germans... please... Next Isreal is going to try to sue Poland for what they did to the Jews during WW2.... oh wait, that happened already!

I don't understand why there's all these Poles demonstrating recently. I understand the abortion thing - PiS went a bit too far with that. However, I don't really see what PiS is doing as undemocratic - here in the US putting your own people in power is expected - that's just par for the course in our so called 'democracy' I don't know maybe I'm missing something...

But the profits should mainly benefit Poles, not foreign profiteers. Morawiecki should waste no time in trying to build up a viable Polish enterpreneurial class, although the Brussels dictatorship will probably make it difficult to give them the preferential treatment foreign interest groups got under the Tusk regime.

As you said, there is no old or new EU -- we're all in it together. We're all equal, except some are more equal than others!

Definitely not. Poland has little political power in the EU council. We would have lots of political power, but unfortunately Tusk is Merkel's laptop

Why don't you contact Morawiecki and share some of your ideas? He may well be receptive.

I really don't know enough about the political situation in Poland. Most of what I gather is through what I read here, conversation with my grandparents, and somewhat the news. Are you talking about Mateusz or Kornel Morawiecki?

Also Jerzy Kosiński (of "Painted Bird" fame or ratherr notoriety!)

Sad to have Polish fraudsters like that...

Personally, I think that the democratic system is oftentimes overrated. Here in the US we supposedly have so much freedom but yet we're total slaves. Our democracy has turned into socialism where wealth is redistributed through taxes, tens of millions of lazy people, who simply don't want a job (80 million ages 16+ according to the BLS) but yet we need to provide for them. I say let them starve and freeze their butt off for a while and I bet they'll go looking for a job on their own after a few days with an empty stomach. India is regarded as the world's largest democracy yet most people are dirt poor. Meanwhile, countries who's politicians aren't constantly thinking about election, reelection, and satisfying lobbyists because of earlier campaign contributions can focus on other things. Many countries that have a very high standard of living along with low taxes actually have dictators/monarchs, or presidents who have been serving for decades at the helm - Qatar, Kuwait, Libya under Gaddafi, U.A.E..

Quite frankly, I wish PiS would change the laws to extend the terms of a president and sejm members so politicians don't spend 1/2 the time they're in office worrying about elections. Wishful thinking though....

Sorry, Adrian, but my suggestions were addressed to Smurf. He laid out a rough outline of how to revitalise the Polish economy. He should share his views with Mateusz Morawiecki who appears receptive to good ideas.

Have PiS ever cared about truth? Or decency? Or justice.

We should be under no illusions about their intentions. They would be happy if there was never an election again. Basically national socialist scum.


Why?


Exactly. And Poland has done very very well out of the EU. Interesting how things will unfold next year when Poland has to start giving instead of receiving....

No wonder that normal, decent, politically moderate people come out on the streets because they feel that Poland deserves better than the truly appalling PiS and their opportunist cronies.

The poltically moderate come out because they have been duped by the crafty lies and cleverly cotnrived ruses of master propagandisrts Petru, Schetyna and Michnik and their useful idiot Kijowski banging on about freedom and demcoracy. In actuality, they are actually supporitng the resentul poltical losers, assorted Poland-bashers and the toadies of foreign exploiters. That reality however is cleverly concealed from the public with high-sounding slogans and political window-dressing. Meanwhile the good-change government presses ahead with what's best for Poland, first, last and always! Way to go, PiS! Good job of work! Hang in there! Mangy curs will bark and growl, but the caravan just keeps moving!

That or most people are fundamentally decent enough to prefer a state where democracy and the constitution are valued, where extremism remains on the margins and where the economy is managed well.

Basically the opposite of the PiS 'vision'.

P3 is a Marxist.

What very few people seem to realise is that profit is at most 10%, more like 7% of the income of a company.

The rest, 90% plus, is retained in country. When you work through the supply chain, nearly half the money is paid in direct income taxes on wages. When workers spend their money, VAT is paid and so it goes on.

This is why Polands economy has gone from $60billion to $500billion+ and Polish wages and wealth has gone up.

Yes, Poland should have more Polish owned businesses, but that will require Poles to compete in a capitalist market, which means being the best on its own merit.

You can legislate to buy by dictat, but thats Communism.. and we all know that doesn't work.

Not in particular, but the market is what the market is


Gays certainly lack freedom, women are pretty much 2nd-class citizens. She's like the Muslim in the burkah who thinks she is free.


No, it won't work. Things have gone too far for it to work.
I'd go about it by focusing on what PL is good at and go all in on those industries.

Many tyrants claimed they supported democracy, often adding some qualifier like people's, workers' or social. The PC version of democracy is similar. Only the minority who buy into the leftstream PC religion can enjoy PC democracy, liberty and freedom of speech. The decent majortiy are told to keep quiet, obey your (PC) betters and muzzled if they try to protest.

"Many tyrants" can claim whatsoever they want. Here in Poland the current regime (who really do want to be in power for a thousand years in their 4th reich/republic) have put into practice a set of policies that have alienated millions - basically a full frontal attack on democracy...

Very few companies have a profit margin of 10%. It's not a big deal if the profits leave Poland since that's a miniscule per cent of the money spent and generated in Poland.

But marxists and other economic illiterates don't want to understand that.

I wouldn't agree with that. If the profits were miniscule compared to the money spent then they'd be losing money and they wouldn't hang around here for long at all at all.

The likes of Dell, IBM, Microsoft, Google, Facebook etc, they don't keep their money in Poland and most of the profits made here pay a pittance in corpo. tax. However, if you put up the tax they'll leave and people will lose well-paying jobs.......with the exception of IBM, those guys pay peanuts.

It would be better if the money stayed in Poland, that's not going to happen though. Ya see people look at things like GDP and believe it's a true reflection of an economy, GNP is a far better indicator since GDP counts profits that are generated within Poland, but it doesn't say how much is taken out. With GNP, we know pretty much how much is generated within by Polish companies and what they tend to do with their profits.

It's a catch 22, best thing in my opinion is to encourage these companies rather than hire people here to outsource to Polish companies. They profit from the work and the Polish company reinvests and spends money in Poland to remain competitive.

Only on PC-style corporate "democracy" which gives the goodies to foreign-interest groups and leaves a few crumbs for the Poles. The PiS government are serving Poland's decent majority, not some snobbish elite brimming with resentment and too stupid to realise they have been deservedly voted out of office. As it is, eight years of PO scmasterism was eight years too many!

How much profit do you think those companies make in Poland? I'd say nothing, they LOSE money in Poland because outsourcing is providing service for overseas customers. Poland GAINS well paid, tax paying jobs and loses NOTHING from outsourcing.

When the EU and other states start taxing companies for the profits made in country (which I can see coming) then we will see multinationals paying more tax in the USA, UK, Germany and other big economies possibly offset by its loses where its cost centers are - like Poland.

Yea, that's what I said Poland should do. They don't do that in many cases though. They're more than happy to let large corpos in like Dell, IBM, Amazon, KPMG with the promise of low tax so long as they provide job. Idiots in powerful economic jobs still think the trickle down system works, when in reality nothing could be further from the truth.

They all pay 3,500 or 4,000 zl something entry salaries, which wouldn't keep your dog in the luxury to which he has become accustomed, that's for sure.

Having said that, better than working for the main employer in small town Polska B.

ZUS.

But when will we have a Dellski, IBMowicz or Amazoński -- inidgenous Polish-owned corporations creating original designs and manufacturing decent, recognisably Polish, good-value products for domestic consumtion and export?? That's what it's all about.


If a thousand or 10,000 KODists chant "constitution and democracy" 1,000 or 10,000 times, PO will somehow miraculously get back into power and
live happily ever after. If you believe in such mantras and fairy tales, have fun!
Maybe if one distribtued 10,000 tins of Heinz baked beans to 10,000 Brits outside the URM, who knows....except gas warfare has been outlawed!

Well thanks to PiS the time frame has been pushed back a few decades. Again, these can't be created by government fiat (you really are stuck mentally in the PRL with government mandated norms and quotas). You create a business friendly environment (hard for business haters in PiS to do) and wait.

No miracle - just an election...