Demonstrations in Poland in defence of democracy.

Unfair example, Polonius. Hindenburg by that time was a senile old man, scarcely aware of much of anything, to say the very least, of the deception being worked that supporters were more numerous than in fact was the case:-)

The latter was Frau Riefenstahl's department and her crowd manipulation which worked to stunning effect!!

Let's keep to the topic please

Stop lying Harry, you know very will there is no criminal issues but only constitutional issues and if anything both sides are in the wrong, even three sides if you include Tribunal.

There is not will to compromise on the so called opposition side and that is that!
Will you stop spinning things and presenting your radical OPINION as a representation of the truth.


Why? Cannot one even mention homo parades by its name? Is that yet another holy cow or your faith?

Why should there be compromise when the Constitution is crystal clear on the matter?

At the end of the day, you're actively supporting the wrecking of Polish democracy for political gain. Family in the PZPR by any chance?

How can there be compromise without breaking the constitution?

Touche:) This Cameron fellow really is a card:) The most disliked Tory since Thatcher.

At the next KOD march someone should ask: Anyone present who was in the PZPR or had family members who were please raise your hand. If those who didn't raise their hand were subjected to lie detection moree than half would probably be found lying. That's why 30 of PO's MPs were former party members or SB informers. Not too many in PiS.

You'd probably find similar numbers in almost all parties.

Don't forget that many people were members of allied organisations to the PZPR, such as the way that the majority of teachers were members of the ZNP by default, which in turn allied to the OPZZ which was a member of PRON.

The sooner we get rid of the PZPR-Solidarność duopoly in Polish politics, the better.

If you're so enamoured of an unwiedly quadrisyllabic word and turned off by its common abbreviation, here goes: homosexual.
Happy?


Indeed, "almost" is an apt qualifier, because all except PiS. At the time of Wałęsa's 1992 parliamentary coup, their predecessor Porozumienie Centrum were likewise the only party with no SB informers in the released secret-police files.

No, I meant rather in the sense of "all but the SLD, where almost everyone has departed except those from the good old days".


You do need to remember to add that the Centre Agreement just so happened to be the ones releasing the files.

And more power to them. Too bad Wałęsa and his fellow-felons with things on their conscience stifled the operation. A year or two of confuson and the matter would have been settled. Now two decades on it remains unresolved and will continue to linger and poison the body politic for at least another generation. And all because of Wałęsa's "Bolek" hang-up.

What, for choosing to only release files relating to other parties and covering up their own?

More to the point, the lustration courts already proved that multiple names on the list weren't actually collaborators. Macierewicz simply did it to eliminate perceived enemies, just like he does today.

Stop repeating that. The Constitution is anything but crystal clear, is muddled and contradictory. In this case so many thing were done by both sided that they cannot be undone and a new opining is need a compromise which opposition doesn't want. Those guys are adamant on destabilizing the country rather then abide by the democratic rule. .

Sorry that you find such plain language to be difficult.

Constituional lawyers agree that the constituion is ambiguous and open to extensive interpreation. Does it anywhere expressly state that the TK may issue their rulings in violation of the law?

The TK rulings are above ordinary law. It's an important part of the division of power that the Constitutional Tribunal is not subject to laws passed by parliament, as it would result in the lesser branch being able to stop the work of the higher branch.



It's absolutely crystal clear that the Constitutional Tribunal is not bound by lesser law. The vast majority of the legal profession agrees with that observation, and the courts have declared that the TK's ruling is binding on them.

They have efffectively turned themselves into the third chamber of parliament. The TK should be dissolved altogether and the supreme Court given whatever extra powers are needed to replace it. Does poor Poland need an extra set of pricey, toga-ed parasites?

An interesting stance, but that change requires more votes than the lovers of PIS have, so The Dear Leader Chairman Kaczynski will just have to learn to follow the law just as the rest of us do.


Can't the TK be funded by simply disbanding that ridiculous Smolensk commission that appears to exist only to pay tens of thousands of zloty every month to Party faithful?

They are part of the judicial branch of power.


Interesting idea. What would PiS do when the Supreme Court also refuses to side with them?


Just think : over 100 members of the commission, all on 25,000zł/month. Most of them know nothing about aviation.

A truly sickening waste of the taxes we pay (but the opponents of the TK here do not pay). How much is the salary of a TK judge anyway?

New draft ant terrorism law.

Under the new measures, the authorities will be able to detain suspected terrorists for up to 14 days or to immediately expel foreigners considered to pose a threat to national security. -

Officials will also be able to suspend mass public events and gatherings.

See more at: thenews.pl/1/10/Artykul/246066,Poland-unveils-antiterrorism-plans-ahead-of-NATO-summit#sthash.2FIcOL4G.dpuf

I wonder if foreign fifth columnist demonstrators will be expelled if this law comes into force.

A truly sickening waste of taxpayer money to roll out law enforcement week after week to police and protect the KODerast trough-defenders, reroute traffic and repeatedly subject innocent citizens who just wnat to get on with their lives to disruption and inconvenience. Just to cater to a band of frustrated poor losers who cannot reconcile themselves to last October's defeat at the polls. Even the pervert parade or whatver it's called is only once a year. But week after week, after week, after week, after week, after week, after week, after week..... All that money down the drain and not a peep or a squeak from the Anglo-expat contingent! Very telling indeed!

Dude, I have pointed out to you and harry my argument. You both choose to ignore it. Either because you don't know legal theory in Poland or your Polish is not up to standards or as I personally suspect you are not interested in real debate. You rather towy with your biased and spread your one-sided propaganda here.

Do you think that your quote make for a convincing argument you are wrong. Not at all.
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They are not above Constitution! Alas TK and their procedures are not above 'ordinary' law, and basic rules of law still apply to them. What you claiming here is nonsense, or rather your conclusion as to what is that what need to be announced for what it is - rubbish.

Probably not, given that EU law would prevent it. Wouldn't you say that Poland should actually be more interested in the people who come to Poland and pretend to be Polish patriots but aren't actually Polish or still retain citizenship other than Polish?


Yes, it is sickening that the PIS lovers won't just obey Polish law and thus give the protestors nothing to protest about.


Actually you make a lot more than just a peep or a squeak, and you are pretty much the only Anglo-expat on this board.

" still retain citizenship other than Polish?" Good point harry but it would take time for them to get polish citizenship, passing the language test may also prove a barrier to some.

What has that got to do with preventing terrorism?

Yet again, we see PiS enacting yet more communist law.


There are certainly questions over non-EU citizens in Poland that worked for the PZPR and who obtained property at a knock-down price due to their connections.


Your argument is a minority view and the courts (who interpret the law) don't support your ideas. Furthermore, the view isn't shared by constitutional experts.


The TK is bound only to the Constitution. They are intentionally above the law to prevent governments from using the law to abuse the TK.

If you've got any evidence that the TK is actually bound to lesser law, let's see it.

Do you mean Balcerowicz, Kuroń, Rzepliński, Kwaśniewski or Cimoszewicz who were not EU citizens at the time of their collaboration with the Soviet-imposed regime?

"What has that got to do with preventing terrorism"

Once these laws are passed many countries law enforcement agencies use them as the would any other law.

Example from the UK below.

Anti-terror laws 'used to spy on Plebgate journalists' Source the Daily Mail.

I trust that Poland will only use the law as quoted "expel foreigners considered to pose a threat to national security"

This could apply foreigners who wish to undermine or overthrow the democratically elected government of Poland

I would personally love to see Poland expelling people involved with opposition politics. It's a tactic straight out of Communist times, and the payout from the European courts would be substantial.

"expelling people involved with opposition politics"

I could never Imagine for one moment out government would expel one of our citizens demonstrating against the government.

But foreign plotters who wish to incite mayhem and riot while hiding behind a political banner would "pose a threat to national security"

That sounds exactly like the kind of excuse used by Communist governments in the past to expel the opposition.

Given that this thread is about KOD, can you tell us when KOD have been involved in mayhem and rioting?


Why? Plenty of Poles were invited for a chat, stripped of their citizenship and given papers valid for a few days only so that they could leave the country. Others had their citizenship stripped at the border. Happened before, could easily happen again.