News / Decoded talks inside Poland's president's plane are released in Internet [337]


Quite what you are talking about I'm not sure. But the Pilots were using the wrong procedure to approach the the airport, using barometric pressure; this gave them the height about sea level not the height above the airport as they should have been using. This is a fundamental mistake never mind the fact that they were not flying the aircraft after it descended below the decision height.

Remember, neither the ATC or the autopilot is responsible for flying the aircraft; thats the pilots job.

Travel / Lake near Krakow (Zakrzówek Lake?) [12]

Kryspinów, the free lake, at least, has no toilets. You have to pay for the private lake don't you? whats that like?

News / Decoded talks inside Poland's president's plane are released in Internet [337]


Go and read the PPRune discussion of this, its pointless trying to argue if you don't understand basic terrain or ATC system in use. Its discussed in detail on those two threads.

Referring to a valley as 'nonsense' just about sums up you understanding of what happened.

News / Zloty exchange rates - is this just speculation? [87]


Some of us get paid in US Dollars, have debts in Sterling and are spending in Zloty :)

I don't expect the Zloty weakness to last long, its risk aversion and people seem to love risk as it pays.

News / Decoded talks inside Poland's president's plane are released in Internet [337]


All you need to know is that the autopilot flew the aircraft into the ground. Switching it off is easy, put some control input. They didn't do that until they were 20m above the ground and falling at 10meter per second.

The language skill were irrelevant, the piloting skills were irrelevant.

Nobody was flying the aircraft - so it crashed.

News / Decoded talks inside Poland's president's plane are released in Internet [337]

Well, there were people who should not have been in the cockpit involved in the flying. The President was also flying the plane - as somehow - he had a to make a decision on whether to divert.

Nobody who should be in the passenger cabin should be involved in decisions whether to divert/abort. The reason is that somebody must always be flying the aircraft; and until a few seconds (10:40:58,2) before impact, NOBODY WAS FLYING THE AIRCRAFT. The captain did not react to the go around command from the First Officer (10:40:51,2), there was obvious uncertainty about where the authority was.

In my opinion its the Presidents fault, he had the head of the airforce and his other staff walking in and out of the cockpit discussing what they were going to do, standing over the pilot and confusing the chain of command. When it came to the important decision to go around there was a delay of several seconds - which is why they are dead.

There are other issues of course - they use the wrong altimeter to determine height - ignoring the height of the airport, ignored all warnings (another chain of command issue) from the ATC, other Polish pilots and TAWS (which may have not had up to date altitude readings for this airport - however it was accurate)

The captain was young and inexperienced - would a more experienced pilot (such as the one sacked previously) have allowed such a situation? possibly not.

News / Decoded talks inside Poland's president's plane are released in Internet [337]

Whats amazing was that they were using the autopilot until six seconds before they hit the first tree. Descending at 10 meters per second they waited until the height radar said 20meters before taking over control.

The Autopilot couldn't land the aircraft becuase there was no guidance system for it there was no ILS (Instrument Landing System). Basically nobody was flying the aircraft and they couldn't see that they were flying into the ground. Controlled Flight into Terrain, a very common cause of accidents.

pprune.org/rumours-news/415657-time-re-open-polish-presiden tial-flight-thread-10.html#post5728616

Travel / cheapest air from US to Krakow [13]

Ryanair are usually the cheapest from UK to Krakow. Got to factor in getting to Stanstead airport though. If you fly to Gatwick then Easyjet fly to Krakow, often more expensive but still reasonable.

Real Estate / PLN 2,500 the going rate for an apartment in Poland [210]


Scotland? ever looked at a map, especially a population density map? Scotland is a long way from anywhere and very lightly populated, of course its cheap to rent or buy. Northern Sweden is even cheaper - vast amount of empty space,

My GF apartment is a 70m two bed, communistic built block 10mins walk from the main square. She rented each room out for 1000pln per month to couples or pairs of girls. Previously she used the third room to live in as well. This is for an unmodernised apartment with 40 year old furniture. She has never had trouble getting willing tenants, its the location.

We are modernising it now and expect to obtain 2500 pln per month once completed (we will share it with new tenants).


The only reason you would need 150 year mortgage is if prices were so high because lenders gave you a 150year mortgage. Easy credit is the reason why house prices are so expensive, how much did houses cost when you could not get a mortgage? about the same as an average wage. When banks lend you 5-10 times your wage, that is how much your house will cost; if they lent you 100 times earning the houses would cost that much.

You would spend your life and more paying the bank interest and they would get the house back when you inevitable defaulted. Banks cannot lose.

Travel / Lake near Krakow (Zakrzówek Lake?) [12]

Is that the one where there are several bars and no toilets?

I find it off putting to go and swim in a lake which has hundreds of people pissing into it everyday.

Language / Is math in Polish different than in English? [59]


When I was taught maths at University different teachers would use different symbols for the same thing. Different books use different symbols.

Engineering and science has different definitions of e, for instance, which is particularly stupid.

Infact, when you start using the Greek language in equations you are at perfect liberty to us them a you see fit - there is no real definitions of where and how they are used. The rules is, as long as the person you are talking to understands your notion, then it's fine.

Law / EU citizen residency certificate to live in Poland [34]


Yes, Spain and France for certain. UK is unusual in that respect.

Life / Expats in Krakow - Do you miss TV from back home? Help is at hand! [17]


Problem is that when its popular - F1 race for instance - you get breakups. Any idea how to prevent this?

Real Estate / Making an offer for Polish houses [30]


Unlike oil, property is not a compulsory purchase and its illiquid, its a slow and difficult process to price and go through the selling procedure.

Most of the cost of petrol is is tax and other charges - in Europe its 80%. Quite frankly what you said there is idiotic.

If a seller sets the price and the buyer refuses to pay it, because he can do without or buy from someone else then the seller doesn't set the price does he? Buyer and sellers have to AGREE a price that both can accept, therefore the price is set by both.


In other words , they do not set the price. If the buyer asks for more than someone is willing to pay its not sold .. ever.

News / Flood situation worsens in southern Poland [119]

Pride has got nothing to do with it. Of course you can do many things to prevent flooding and I'm sure NL experience will come in useful around the world in the future. But it costs money - lots of it. Suggesting that Poles build artificial ponds and canals will not be a cheap as letting natural flood plains to flood - as nature intended. Pity the poor fools who build on flood plains, but .not. .much.

News / Flood situation worsens in southern Poland [119]


You mean build below sea level and reclaim vast amounts of land? Very impressive but its not quite the same thing - river floods are best managed by allowing flood plains to, well.. flood.

News / Flood situation worsens in southern Poland [119]


I live about 300meters away. Yesterday. after looking at the bridge, decided a relocation to the parents in law would be a good idea. The apartment basement was already flooded (simply due to heavy rain) and some buildings opposite had already lost power.

News / Zloty exchange rates - is this just speculation? [87]


Its was increasing against every currency when I posted, by several percent. If fact at any point in time its can be either up or down - regardless of the person who is charge of the central bank.

News / Zloty exchange rates - is this just speculation? [87]


True, except its gaining against every currency and there was no assassination.

News / Zloty exchange rates - is this just speculation? [87]


When foreign companies invest in countries with cheap labour the currency appreciates, thats a well trodden path - so your conclusion is wrong.PLN is suffering from risk aversion, I expect its will recover soon-ish. maybe a few weeks.

News / Zloty exchange rates - is this just speculation? [87]


Its idiotic thinking like that that drives assets bubbles and delusions of wealth.

Look at the UK today and what do you see? a booming stock markets and house prices rises of 10%. What you don't see is the 200billion pounds the UK government printed and dumped on the streets to keep the spending party going (and labour in power).

In a few days that will stop, taxes will rise (5p basic rate rise), a million more government employees will be on the dole, interest rates will rise house prices crash another 40%. Its going to be **** in the UK for 10-years.

The UK is in the worst financial situation of any other EU country besides Greece, bets against its are rocketing. Pound is going for 1.31 against the dollar in the next four months.

Poland in comparison has a booming economy, little state or personal debt and the one of the worlds most undervalued currencies.

The Pound is going to crash, the only reason the Zloty is falling now is a flight to less risky currencies (dollar) at a time of panic - but a thirst for risk returns very quickly.


Whereas a beer in London bar costs around 16.5 zloty and 23 zloty for the Chinese dish. The pound isn't so much neurotic as vastly over valued.

News / Brown's 'Bigotgate' and the debate about Poles [63]


When you divide something into two there is no third part, its east or west, left or right.


It was behind the Iron curtain, therefore East.

News / Brown's 'Bigotgate' and the debate about Poles [63]


Good luck with that fantasy. The term is not geographic its political.

There is no central Europe, only East and West. Nobody in the UK refers to any of those countries as 'central', the dividing line was the Berlin wall anything east of it was Eastern Bloc/communist and now ex-communist bloc.

Eastern Germany was in the East and Austria was non-aligned. Czech Republic, Slovakia are ex-communist and Switzerland is neutral.


A thank you... right... ********.

The real reason (as documented at that time) was:

we shafted you and now we can't send you back to imprisonment under communism, in fact we can't force you back as you are armed to the teeth and neither the British Army or its officers would obey an order to force the Poles back. The UK was also desperate for workers, German POW's were forced into labour and not repatriated either for YEARS - some chose to stay.

The UK was so desperate for manpower they even recruited my friends Italian father by offering a job at the docks in Palermo - work as a coal ripper for 7 years and you get the citizenship.

UK, Ireland / Help for Poles based in Uk who want to go bankrupt [18]


No, actually this would be positive for the UK economy and bad for the Polish economy. EU citizens can get out of their Polish debts by paying a UK company.

News / Crash of Tu-154 at Smolensk-North--could it have been a bomb in the Polish plane? [233]

"A bomb? You know, it's possible but how and from where? You can rule out the idea that it was pre-planted as you don't know where the plane was going to crash"

You set a bomb to explode at high altitude so you guarantee a complete kill and maximise the explosive power in a pressurised vessel.

You don't set it to explode within 30 seconds of landing becuase the plane is virtually certain to survive it as as the passenger, especially if the plane arrives 2 minute early.

Travel / Stag Parties in Kraków [119]

Ahh, sad English guys jealous of Poles coming to the UK and stealing their jobs and women, so they take out their frustration on line.


To you there might be no point, but everyone is free to decide what they want out of travelling. Visiting every church in Poland maybe someone's idea of a holiday, but to me it would be as pointless as staying in a hotel bar.

Travel / Stag Parties in Kraków [119]


Why not? free planet.

Having said that, I haven't met a single person who isn't Polish in the six months I've been in Krakow.

News / Russian air traffic controllers ignored communication protocol of Polish pilots? [194]


Certainly the Russians are jumping the gun with claiming there was no technical issue with the plane and the claim that they didn't understand Russia is suspect becuase they could have been very busy dealing with a problem and finding the airport so speaking to ATC could have been a low priority.

But the fact is they attempted to land in fog after being warned not too and were aware that there was no ILS - thats not a the Russians fault.

News / Will todays tragedy effect the economy of Poland? [34]


Thats utter garbage.

Bloomsberg, probably the second most important business news source after Reuters says,

"The momentum that's been generated over the past few days is just astounding," said Bartlomiej Sienkiewicz, who heads Othago, a Warsaw-based consultancy that helps firms do business in former Soviet Union countries. "It means the possibility of doing serious business with Russia and breaking the mold of 20 years of strained relations."

bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601109

Economically, this is very good news for Poland, which was already in line for a major boom.