Bieganski
18 Apr 2015
History / Was the holocaust by Germans in Poland the worse genocide in history? [210]
Your pretzel logic to hopefully characterize all these men as card-carrying Polish citizens who volunteered to carryout genocide during Nazi Germany's occupation of war ravaged Poland is hilarious!
The men you listed - Bilaniuk, Obodzinsky, Palij, Serafinowicz and Sawoniuk - were all born on territory that is now part of Ukraine and Belarus. Nothing provided in your supporting links shows that they regarded their identity as Polish rather than Ukrainian or Belarusian. It hasn't been established either that they had any command of the Polish language if at all. Furthermore, Poland never had a collaborative government with Nazi Germany in occupied Poland especially when the death camps were up and running. Therefore any possible claims of Polish citizenship by these men at the time could never have been officially authenticated.
In fact, both Belarusians Szymon Serafinowicz and Anthony Sawoniuk were already British citizens when they were accused of war crimes which they denied. Although Serafinowicz was found unfit to stand trial, Sawoniuk was convicted and imprisoned on war crime charges. Neither were ever stripped of their British citizenship. So how does that make you feel Harry knowing that your fellow Brits committed genocide during the war? Why haven't you and other members of the British public ever demanded the British government give Poland a formal apology and billions in reparations for British participation in The Holocaust? I expect a full account from you because earlier today you said yourself that "Denying history is no way of making sure that the mistakes made in the past are not made again in the future."
As for the other men, they all moved to either the United States or Canada after the war and took up citizenship there. Regarding these other war crimes allegations, including those made against and denied by Bronisław Hajda, all focused on seeking to strip the men of their US and Canadian citizenship and deport them. Some did loose their citizenship but not a single one was ever successfully deported and so were left effectively stateless.
How peculiar though that pursuing these men rested solely on accusations that they did not declare on their immigration paperwork any alleged participation in Nazi-led atrocities on occupied Polish soil. But why would they do this in the first place when they strenuously denied the charges later on in life? And if such serious charges had iron-clad proof to back them up then why didn't the American and Canadian justice authorities ever seek to convict and imprison these men on crimes against humanity rather than making it a case of them failing to declare their suspected status when they immigrated? As aforementioned your home country of Britain found that it had jurisdiction over the war crimes your two fellow citizens committed in Poland when Nazi Germany occupied her.
Interestingly your one NY Times link from 2003 admitted that "The evidence against Mr. Palij and Mr. Bilaniuk has not been made public."
Really? Nearly 60 years after the war ended at that point and the prosecutors had to keep evidence regarding such serious allegations under wraps? Were these accused OAPs a flight risk or was the proof so flimsy they feared they would get no traction with the cases?
So much for transparency and due process under the law. It would be laughable if it wasn't so pathetic.
Once again Harry, your dire attempt to implicate Poland in The Holocaust has absolutely no merit.
I'm able to do so and have done so in the past...Are you still laughing?
Your pretzel logic to hopefully characterize all these men as card-carrying Polish citizens who volunteered to carryout genocide during Nazi Germany's occupation of war ravaged Poland is hilarious!
The men you listed - Bilaniuk, Obodzinsky, Palij, Serafinowicz and Sawoniuk - were all born on territory that is now part of Ukraine and Belarus. Nothing provided in your supporting links shows that they regarded their identity as Polish rather than Ukrainian or Belarusian. It hasn't been established either that they had any command of the Polish language if at all. Furthermore, Poland never had a collaborative government with Nazi Germany in occupied Poland especially when the death camps were up and running. Therefore any possible claims of Polish citizenship by these men at the time could never have been officially authenticated.
In fact, both Belarusians Szymon Serafinowicz and Anthony Sawoniuk were already British citizens when they were accused of war crimes which they denied. Although Serafinowicz was found unfit to stand trial, Sawoniuk was convicted and imprisoned on war crime charges. Neither were ever stripped of their British citizenship. So how does that make you feel Harry knowing that your fellow Brits committed genocide during the war? Why haven't you and other members of the British public ever demanded the British government give Poland a formal apology and billions in reparations for British participation in The Holocaust? I expect a full account from you because earlier today you said yourself that "Denying history is no way of making sure that the mistakes made in the past are not made again in the future."
As for the other men, they all moved to either the United States or Canada after the war and took up citizenship there. Regarding these other war crimes allegations, including those made against and denied by Bronisław Hajda, all focused on seeking to strip the men of their US and Canadian citizenship and deport them. Some did loose their citizenship but not a single one was ever successfully deported and so were left effectively stateless.
How peculiar though that pursuing these men rested solely on accusations that they did not declare on their immigration paperwork any alleged participation in Nazi-led atrocities on occupied Polish soil. But why would they do this in the first place when they strenuously denied the charges later on in life? And if such serious charges had iron-clad proof to back them up then why didn't the American and Canadian justice authorities ever seek to convict and imprison these men on crimes against humanity rather than making it a case of them failing to declare their suspected status when they immigrated? As aforementioned your home country of Britain found that it had jurisdiction over the war crimes your two fellow citizens committed in Poland when Nazi Germany occupied her.
Interestingly your one NY Times link from 2003 admitted that "The evidence against Mr. Palij and Mr. Bilaniuk has not been made public."
Really? Nearly 60 years after the war ended at that point and the prosecutors had to keep evidence regarding such serious allegations under wraps? Were these accused OAPs a flight risk or was the proof so flimsy they feared they would get no traction with the cases?
So much for transparency and due process under the law. It would be laughable if it wasn't so pathetic.
Once again Harry, your dire attempt to implicate Poland in The Holocaust has absolutely no merit.