Love / American marrying Polish woman in Poland - Church problems [79]

As mentioned previously, in the US context it's not especially weird. Marriages outside of churches may be performed by religious figures or a few different kinds of non-religious figures (who may be hired by one of the spouses-to-be or the organizers and who might never see the couple before or after).

On the other hand, the OP should be able to find the paperwork for the first wedding and see who filled it out to see if it was any kind of religious figure. That might help.

Also, some confusion may be caused by the use of the word 'Methodist'. In my experience in the US people who have no clear religious affiliation (beyond being vaguely Christian) are very liable to call themselves Methodist if asked for specific denomination. I had relatives that did just that. It's kind of a Gricean answer.


An RC marriage alone is still not recognized by the government. The change in law basically meant that RC priests are now allowed to perform civil marriages (as long as the paperwork is in order). If it were a purely RC marriage the Polish state would not be able to grant divorces to 'konkordat' marriages but it can and does. The church doesn't recognize them of course and someone with a konkordat marriage and a civil divorce can't get married in church but they can remarry in a civil ceremony.

Love / American marrying Polish woman in Poland - Church problems [79]


My, aren't you a kind soul. And how very christian of you to phrase it just that way.

Did you even read the thread? He's not a catholic and doesn't care about the ceremony for himself. The whole married in church is for his wife (and redundant since they live in the US and are legally married there). It's something he wants to do for his wife (and her family). Not getting a church marriage in Poland will no effect whatsoever on their marital status in the US it will just be sad for his wife.

What I think might be going on: His wife used the word 'methodist' at some point to describe her husband and this makes the priest think that the first marriage must have involved the church.

Possible way out: There are a bunch of different branches of methodism. "Remember" that the methodism involved in this case (if it is in any way) is one that isn't in dialogue with the RC church....

Love / American marrying Polish woman in Poland - Church problems [79]

I believe coppermouse. In the US there are lots of ways to get legally married and it's not that uncommon for the bride and/or groom to not know the personal performing the ceremony at all. The variety of people allowed to conduct civil wedding ceremonies is a lot longer than in Poland too. Notary Publics can marry people (at least in some states) in addition to some others.

Governments in the US only recognize civil marriages conducted in the US. Religious figures are among those allowed to perform divil marriages but they're only valid if the priest or minister or rabbi fills out the appropriate paperwork. Religious figures are not allowed to preside over divorces AFAIK and I've never heard of church based 'divorce' for anything but some catholics (and catholic church based divorces would not be recognized by the government).

To me, also American, coppermouse's confusion about who married him (beyond the fact that whoever did had to fill out the appropriate government paperwork) seems pretty normal.

I think the priest in question simply cannot fathom a different kind of system (just as some posters here can't) and his wife is having trouble finding the words that would make him understand that the previous wedding was not quite 'civil' in the Polish understanding or church based either and that he's asking for something that doesn't exist due to the difference in marriage customs.

Language / Too many English words in the Polish language! [709]


I agree that it's beyond belief (and not in a good way). But one will not decline it at all. One declines nouns (and adjectives) one _conjugates_ verbs (including presumably luknąć).

Language / The usage and future of the special Polish letters: ą, ć, ę, ł, ń, ó, ś, ż, ź (Polish language) [203]


Oops typo alert, that should be tagże, pogżep

Language / Too many English words in the Polish language! [709]

Gadżet is a false friend. It usually refers to some kind of souvenir of a place or event while English gadget is a device that does something.

The difference is very clear if you do a google image search for gadgets and gadżety

Language / The usage and future of the special Polish letters: ą, ć, ę, ł, ń, ó, ś, ż, ź (Polish language) [203]

I'm so glad I missed most of this.

Anyway, this is pretty common phenomenon. Highly literate native speakers without a grounding in linguistics tend to believe things that are clearly at odds with the observable facts.

Many Spanish speakers are convinced there is (or should be) a difference between b and v while linguists note that not a single native speaker can maintain such a difference in spontaneous speech. Some Americans believe they distinguish latter and ladder when they don't.

Voicing assimilation in Polish works the same way. When sounds with both voiced and unvoiced equivalents come together in a word all the preceding such consonants assimilate to the final one (unless the first consonant is unvoiced and the second is w or rz in which case the process is reversed).

Therefore the medial clusters in także and pogrzeb are identical (także pogżep). There is no controversy in phonetics or regional variation about this. Individuals might at times adopt spelling pronunciations for particular purposes (usually for words in isolation) but this has no effect on basic usage. There is some variation in whether clusters like sm an zm are pronounced identically or differently (I forget the details but it's a major regional distinction).

If Antek really thinks there a distinction emerging between the clusters gż and kż then he should contact the Polish and/or linguistic departments of his local university. This would be a major, major innovation in Polish speaking norms and would probably represent the further anglicization of Polish (since English is very unusual in the way it allows mixed voicing clusters such as obtain or even blackguard with a very unusual /kg/ cluster

Language / The usage and future of the special Polish letters: ą, ć, ę, ł, ń, ó, ś, ż, ź (Polish language) [203]


tej


Leading Polish phoneticians do not agree with this assessment.

Language / The usage and future of the special Polish letters: ą, ć, ę, ł, ń, ó, ś, ż, ź (Polish language) [203]

Actually in current electronic communication Polish letters like l, ż, ę etc are more common now than in the past. In the first years of email (and sms's) the norm was not to use them while the current norm is most definitely to use them. Polish accented letters aren't going anywhere.

Language / The usage and future of the special Polish letters: ą, ć, ę, ł, ń, ó, ś, ż, ź (Polish language) [203]

The Varsovian was wrong. The word is written także and pronounced tagże everywhere. On rare occasions, także might be used as a spelling pronunciation but no one says anything but tagże in everyday speech (according to Polish linguists, including phoneticians).

News / Dumbing-down in Polish schools and the Matura [185]


Educational institutions can deal with Polish Matura exam or even 'maturity exam' as bureaucratic literal translations of the kind needed for admission or transfer credit decisions (though 'maturity exam' is a horrible sounding collocation). In everyday usage with educated native speakers of english neither is advised. (I use matura in English with people who know what it is, with people who don't know what it is I say something like 'high school graduation exam' maybe adding that's something like the French Le Bac or German Abitur if I think they might know what those are. "High school leaving exam" is kind of bland but alright in international English maybe (though again Americans who have no such exam might still be puzzled.

Work / (IT field) moving from India to Poland -Wroclaw in May '11 [46]


Turkey is not an EU member state. There are continuing negotiations but the majority of the EU probably does not want Turkey. The main problems are that Turkey is not able at present to meet the social standards of the EU (esp relating to the treatment of ethnic and religious minorities).

News / Don't let Poland become like my country, France. [630]


No they don't. And use the right terminology

hijab = hair and neck covering

niqab = face covering (the burka is a local form of niqab)

IIRC neither is mentioned in the Koran. They're based not so much on religion as culture. Seeing as how the cultures that practice face covering cannot create the kind of civil society that I like living in I'm all for banning them in public areas. In the west you show your face in public. Don't like it? Go somewhere where it's the norm.

News / Dumbing-down in Polish schools and the Matura [185]


Nonsense. It's a skill that can be taught like any other. It's just not a popular skill that lots of people want.

News / Dumbing-down in Polish schools and the Matura [185]

Back on topic. I'm mostly not a big fan of testing at all. I suppose it has to be done sometimes, but the Polish educational establishment places far too much emphasis on high stakes exams (which encourage cheating) and a lot of time and effort is wasted teaching to the test and in engaging in the eternal proctor/student war of getting away with and detecting cheating.

There are better ways of measuring student knowledge and progress than big sit down tests...

News / Dumbing-down in Polish schools and the Matura [185]


I would still say that most native speakers of US English will have no idea what is meant by 'maturity exam'. That a few schools might use it in the context of admission or transfer credits doesn't make it a well formed expression in US English (I make no claims about UK or even Canadian usage). For the uninitiated speakers of US English 'maturity exam' would sound more like a psychological test rather than a school leaving exam.

I've never heard any native speaker of any kind of Englih call it anything but Matura (often with a Polish 'r') in Poland.

News / Dumbing-down in Polish schools and the Matura [185]

IME English speakers in Poland say 'Matura' (when speaking to people who know what it is) just the same way that they say "Gazeta Wyborcza" or "Radio Maryja". They're all treated as proper names. If they're talking with someone who wouldn't understand they use something like "Polish A-levels" or "high school graduation exam" or just describe what it is.

"Maturity exam" makes no sense for native speakers of English (a 'maturity exam' would certainly not have much in common with Matura).

News / Dumbing-down in Polish schools and the Matura [185]

Some years ago I was helping a high school student who wanted to do English on his matura even though his school didn't offer English. The materials I saw for preparing students were a joke - very unidiomatic and unnatural language based on 'grammar rules' that don't exist (and it didn't allow for American variants when those differ from British norms).

My main educational service at that time was to break the code of the test - that is to figure out what the test takers want and how to give it to them, all without cheating (which the student said helped him more than anything else and not just in English - he, a bright enough kid, had had no idea such a thing was possible).


If you hadn't trashed my comment, an alternative explanation was offered. Go look it up.
just to put things right.
I call the Polish high school leaving exam 'Matura' (I treat it as a proper name, like Kraków or Przemysław). I would also never call it a 'maturity exam' because despite the etymology it's all wrong for modern mainstream English since there is no particular conceptual link between formal education and maturity for Anglophones.

Law / 90 days in Poland on my passport. What is better - Visa or Karta pobytu? [8]

Slightly dated info (I expect others who are more up to date to correct any mistakes)

- US citizens cannot obtain a work visa in Poland (partial exception for teaching in certain institutions that probably won't hire you unless you have professional qualifications)

- A visa can only be extended once, the karta pobytu is definitely the way to go (if you can get it).

Language / Too many English words in the Polish language! [709]


That's irrelevant because they treat it as a proper name. They certainly don't think of it as any kind of fabric hall or market anymore than they realize that the name Kraków comes from an old possessive form (Krak's (I forget if it's Krak's city/castle/compound or what)).

News / Grafitti plague in Warsaw [84]


Okay, try this...... CONTEXT MATTERS!

If the owner consents (or pays) for it, it's not grafitti.

I'm too realistic to think that grafitti can be eliminated entirely. But ideally it's a minor aspect of the urban experience and usually disappears relatively quickly.

I even have no problem with established grafitti walls, set aside by cities for the inclined to decorate as they see fit.

I take boiling, rage-filled exception to mindless tagging and/or primitive scribbling of no merit against the will of the owners.

And the fact is that most 'taggers' are sniveling cowards targeting the property and housing of those unable to defend themselves. They don't tag multinational corporations because they know what might happen to them...

News / Grafitti plague in Warsaw [84]


They do, just rarely. But the fara church in Poznan was hit a few years ago.

Generally, Polish people, no matter how 'unreligious' they are still respect church property, they just don't care about other people's or the public's property.

News / Grafitti plague in Warsaw [84]

That definition is inadequate since it makes any kind of public sign grafitti

If you like defiance, then maybe you'll like this charming bit of grafitti on a catholic church.

USA, Canada / Thoughts/ Opinions on Krolewskie Jadlo, Polish Restaurant and should I order in Polish? [7]


Why not try? What's the worst that can happen?

- they decide you're mocking them and beat the crap out of you?

- they sabotage your food in unspeakable ways?

- they burn your house down?

- they kill you and throw you into the bigos pot..

your new home:

News / Grafitti plague in Warsaw [84]


What part of 'vandalism' don't you understand? The pictures you posted are mostly likely made with the owner's consent and not grafitti at all (which by definition is defacement of property that does not belong to the person doing it).

Just how does grafitti improve this sign?

Grafitti vandalism reduces property values (which will be a concern to you if you ever own anything) and weakens social trust (vital for advanced civilizations to function).

Life / The REAL Warsaw :-) Video clip. [43]

Living in Wielkopolska I find inter-Varsovian squabbling about the 'real' Warsaw to be incredibly tedious.

I didn't find the original video tedious at all. I'm glad someone here gave it some publicity since I'd managed to miss it before. But ...traditional urban folklore meets Franek Kimono and a nice panorama of the modern Polish urban experience... what's not to love? Here's a version without the annoying watermark

USA, Canada / Thoughts/ Opinions on Krolewskie Jadlo, Polish Restaurant and should I order in Polish? [7]


Yes. Yes, you are.

News / Kaczyński wants a people-friendly Poland [64]

This sounds to me like same old, same old.

Life / Disco Polo - No No No No No! [95]


Just remember, you asked for it.

A relatively benign beginning......

And directly into

DEEP HURTING

EXTREME PAIN

No, I do not have any mercy, why do you ask?

Study / Summer camp for English speaking kids in Poland? [30]


A "British school" in Poland should be teaching them Polish and if they're camp age they should do okay with a Polish group by summer. Some of the adults and other children will probably know enough English if there's an emergency and the rest of the time their adjustment to life in Poland will be greatly aided (even if they don't spend that long here the language experience will help them on its own).

As warszawski said, there's no market for all-English camps in Poland (except for language learning). You might look into that (sending your kids to English immersion camp for the other kids to practice with) though that seems a little .... unsettling in ways I can't articulate.