He reminds me of this Serbian who once was on the forum and declared just about every city in Europe to be of Serb/Slavic origin
I do not declare, I just provide links from Wikipedia.
How come Poles like Russians but not Germans?
I do not declare, I just provide links from Wikipedia.
If I follow your line of thinking, Tyniec should revert to the Irish because its name has Celtic origins.
And Novgorod should be renamed to Holmgard. :D
Why to rename? I didn't propose to rename something...
Needs to take school lessons of geography. It's map of USSR, not Russia, naïve...
needs to look at your country leaders (ex KGB) and maybe (just maybe) you'll realize that nothing has changed where you live, Russia, Soviet Union, "все равно".
needs to look at your country leaders (ex KGB) and maybe (just maybe) you'll realize that nothing has changed where you live, Russia, Soviet Union,
I seem to live for a while in Northern America. I never lived in Russian Federation or Russian SSR. I'm from Ukraine. In any case I cannot do something about anything that happens in Russia...
One person on forum (who claimed to be native German) claimed that such German cities as Halle and Dessau were also founded by Slavs. But I wasn't able to find mention of it Wikipedia. Someone else also claimed that Hamburg was built by Slavs. But Wikipedia states it was built by Germanic people before and mentions only "In 880 Hamburg was destroyed again this time by Slavic and Danish soldiers." In 983, the town was destroyed by King Mstivoj of the Obodrites." After further raids by the Obodrites in 1066 the bishop Adalbert permanently moved to Bremen." But was it rebuilt by Slavs again? Does anyone knows?
The Limes Saxoniae border between the Saxons and the Slavic Obotrites, established about 810. - Map.
The Limes Saxoniae border between the Saxons and the Slavic Obotrites, established about 810. - Map.
Limes.saxoniae.wmt1.png
goofy_the_dog
8 Jul 2013 / #97
I know that berlin was built by slavic tribes.
However vlad, i am as far from panslavism as one can be! ;)
However vlad, i am as far from panslavism as one can be! ;)
Why, not? Better pan Slavism than to suffer from arrogant pan-antiSlavism.
arrogant pan-antiSlavism.
any examples of that?
goofy_the_dog
9 Jul 2013 / #100
Panslavism is a dream vlad, it would be slavery under rossija ;)
The same as it was years ago.
Apart from there is still a lot of time to pass before the hatred between our nations will dissapear. Maybe it will never come to that, who knows?
The same as it was years ago.
Apart from there is still a lot of time to pass before the hatred between our nations will dissapear. Maybe it will never come to that, who knows?
goofy_the_dog
9 Jul 2013 / #101
Saying that poles, ukrainians or beylarussians like russians as a country, culture and tradition is a lie.
Vlad how about the ukrainian famine ?
First genocide on such a scale in the history of humankind.
Adolf didnt manage to beat the speed of the russian made ukrainian holocaust.
Or our polish katyn, gulags or siberia.
Your matushka rassija commited loads of crimes, give us back money and land or at least apologise, by ur politicians.
Then maybe we can stsrt building fundaments of our friendship.
But saying that poles and russians are friends now, it is a disgusting treason, like spitting onthe bodies of those millions of ppl that died.
The last time russians that we are slavic brothers, was the tsarists time, poland was called privislynyj kraj ;-).
Russians were very racist to anything that wasnt russian, theyve also discriminated catholics.
Not such slavic brothers afterall eh?
Vlad how about the ukrainian famine ?
First genocide on such a scale in the history of humankind.
Adolf didnt manage to beat the speed of the russian made ukrainian holocaust.
Or our polish katyn, gulags or siberia.
Your matushka rassija commited loads of crimes, give us back money and land or at least apologise, by ur politicians.
Then maybe we can stsrt building fundaments of our friendship.
But saying that poles and russians are friends now, it is a disgusting treason, like spitting onthe bodies of those millions of ppl that died.
The last time russians that we are slavic brothers, was the tsarists time, poland was called privislynyj kraj ;-).
Russians were very racist to anything that wasnt russian, theyve also discriminated catholics.
Not such slavic brothers afterall eh?
Vlad how about the ukrainian famine ?
First genocide on such a scale in the history of humankind.
First genocide on such a scale in the history of humankind.
We need to figure out what relation to this case ethnical Russians had.
Or our polish katyn, gulags or siberia.
The same thing.
Adolf didnt manage to beat the speed of the russian made ukrainian holocaust.
Could be argued. According to Wikipedia USSR lost in WWII 22-30 millions of people in total.
Ukraine lost 16% + of population. Could be compared to what numbers?
The last time russians that we are slavic brothers, was the tsarists time, poland was called privislynyj kraj ;-).
Russians were very racist to anything that wasnt russian, theyve also discriminated catholics.
Russians were very racist to anything that wasnt russian, theyve also discriminated catholics.
Privislynyj means what in what language? Laughable. Vast majority of population in Western Ukraine, Belarus and
Poland remained under rule of Polish lords (feudals). It were Orthodox Christians who were discriminated.
goofy_the_dog
9 Jul 2013 / #103
Hahahaha XD i see that you dont know a lot
prywislyj as nadwislanski.
Ortodox discriminated under tsar LoL, orthodox church was a state religion.
You are talking about the war im talking of russian made genocides.
Hmm.. What do u mean as ethical russians?
I strongly advice you to read gulag archipelago.
prywislyj as nadwislanski.
Ortodox discriminated under tsar LoL, orthodox church was a state religion.
You are talking about the war im talking of russian made genocides.
Hmm.. What do u mean as ethical russians?
I strongly advice you to read gulag archipelago.
The Wagri, Wagiri, or Wagrians were a tribe of Polabian Slavs inhabiting Wagria, or eastern Holstein in northern Germany, from the ninth to twelfth centuries. They were a constituent tribe of the Obodrite confederacy.
In the Slavic uprisings of 983 and c. 1040 under Gottschalk, Wagria was wasted and ruined. Many German towns and churches were destroyed and the region was largely depopulated. In 1066, the Wagri allied with the Wilzi in storming the line of Saxon burgwarden from Mecklenburg to Schwerin and into German territory as deep as Hamburg. Around 1090, the still pagan Wagri and Liutizi came under the sway of the Rani-born Kruto. Each tribe elected its own chief who was subordinate to Kruto. In 1093, the Christian Obodrites under Henry, aided by some Saxons and the local Low German population, defeated Kruto at the Battle of Schmilau near Ratzeburg. The Wagri were brought to tributary status once more.
The Christianisation of Wagria began under Unwan, Archbishop of Bremen, in the 1020s. Vicelin of Oldenburg, a Christian priest, first began to evangelise the Wagri and Wilzi with the permission of Henry, who was reigning from Lübeck, around 1126. In the years which followed Vicelin's mission, the Emperor Lothair II thoroughly encastellated Wagria and Canute Lavard and the Holsteiners invaded it and took Pribislav and Niklot, the Wagrian leaders, away in chains.
In 1142, Henry the Lion and Adolf II of Holstein divided the newly conquered Slav lands between them.[1] Wagria with its castle of Sigberg went to Adolf, while Polabia with Ratzeburg went to Henry. The Trave divided the regions. There followed this division a great influx of German colonists. During the Wendish Crusade of 1147, the Wagri attacked recently founded colonies of Flemings and Frisians, but this is the last that is heard of their resistance to Germanisation.
Slavs inhabited also Eastern parts of modern Kiel city.
In the Slavic uprisings of 983 and c. 1040 under Gottschalk, Wagria was wasted and ruined. Many German towns and churches were destroyed and the region was largely depopulated. In 1066, the Wagri allied with the Wilzi in storming the line of Saxon burgwarden from Mecklenburg to Schwerin and into German territory as deep as Hamburg. Around 1090, the still pagan Wagri and Liutizi came under the sway of the Rani-born Kruto. Each tribe elected its own chief who was subordinate to Kruto. In 1093, the Christian Obodrites under Henry, aided by some Saxons and the local Low German population, defeated Kruto at the Battle of Schmilau near Ratzeburg. The Wagri were brought to tributary status once more.
The Christianisation of Wagria began under Unwan, Archbishop of Bremen, in the 1020s. Vicelin of Oldenburg, a Christian priest, first began to evangelise the Wagri and Wilzi with the permission of Henry, who was reigning from Lübeck, around 1126. In the years which followed Vicelin's mission, the Emperor Lothair II thoroughly encastellated Wagria and Canute Lavard and the Holsteiners invaded it and took Pribislav and Niklot, the Wagrian leaders, away in chains.
In 1142, Henry the Lion and Adolf II of Holstein divided the newly conquered Slav lands between them.[1] Wagria with its castle of Sigberg went to Adolf, while Polabia with Ratzeburg went to Henry. The Trave divided the regions. There followed this division a great influx of German colonists. During the Wendish Crusade of 1147, the Wagri attacked recently founded colonies of Flemings and Frisians, but this is the last that is heard of their resistance to Germanisation.
Slavs inhabited also Eastern parts of modern Kiel city.
I used to lurk these forums a while ago. I distinctly remember a guy named Crow or something that kept spamming the forums with Slavic stuff. I suspect Vlad is Crow avoiding suspension.
When I posted links showing that Poles could have as much as 30% R1b frequency, he only dismissed all the links and only chose the one with the minimum. Crow is someone who wouldn't like the idea of evidence showing Poles are not purely Slavic.
When I posted links showing that Poles could have as much as 30% R1b frequency, he only dismissed all the links and only chose the one with the minimum. Crow is someone who wouldn't like the idea of evidence showing Poles are not purely Slavic.
Marek11111 9 | 807
10 Jul 2013 / #106
How come Poles like Russians but not Germans?
because Poles and Russians like vodka and Germans like beer, personally I like Mexicans as I like tequila
because Poles and Russians like vodka and Germans like beer, personally I like Mexicans as I like tequila
Vast majority of Poles are beer drinkers
Ukrainians, probably, drink beer and vine not less frequently than vodka.
Duh, maybe coz the Germans set up concentration camps all over Poland and murdered millions of Poles. Even though the Russians are more stupid, they are not as evil as the freaking Germans.
have to disagree with you here. Only the Chinese killed more people than the Soviets.
goofy_the_dog
10 Jul 2013 / #111
A name for a russian concentraion camp is gulag.
How come Poles like Russians but not Germans?
I don't think that's true I think Germany and Germans are slightly ahead. Poles say what bad things both nations did but Germany is look upon with envy and as a model, successful nation. According to the new stats Germans like Poles more than Russians. " The social acceptance of Poles in Germany has increased substantially. 79 percent of Germans would be willing to accept a Pole as a colleague at work (65 percent for Russian.), 77 percent as a neighbor (60 percent Russian.), 62 percent as a citizen of their country (47 percent Russian.), 57 percent as a friend (41 percent.), 53 percent as their boss (38 percent.), and 49 per cent a son-in law (a Russian in this role is accepted by 33 per cent.)."
Germany view more favorably Poles than Russians. According to a report by the Bertelsmann Foundation and the Institute of Public Affairs old stereotype of the Pole-thief still exists, but only approx. 15 percent of Germans. Pole is accepted - as a colleague, neighbor, boss, friend, or even ... in-law. This is - contrary to the stereotype of a backward muddler - friendly, hard working and enterprising.
According to a report by Bertelsmann and ISP only 47 percent. Germans welcomes German-Russian relations, and as much as 70 percent. praises the Polish-German relations. This is an increase of 24 percentage points. since 2008,., when only 46 percent. Germans positively evaluated the relationship between Warsaw and Berlin.
The social acceptance of Poles in Germany has increased substantially. 79 per cent. Germans would be willing to accept a Pole as a colleague at work (65 percent Russian.), 77 percent. as a neighbor (60 percent Russian.), 62 percent. as a citizen of your country (47 percent Russian.), 57 percent. as a friend (41 percent.), 53 percent. as the head (38 percent.) and 49 per cent. a son-in (Russian in this role accept 33 per cent.).
According to a report by Bertelsmann and ISP only 47 percent. Germans welcomes German-Russian relations, and as much as 70 percent. praises the Polish-German relations. This is an increase of 24 percentage points. since 2008,., when only 46 percent. Germans positively evaluated the relationship between Warsaw and Berlin.
The social acceptance of Poles in Germany has increased substantially. 79 per cent. Germans would be willing to accept a Pole as a colleague at work (65 percent Russian.), 77 percent. as a neighbor (60 percent Russian.), 62 percent. as a citizen of your country (47 percent Russian.), 57 percent. as a friend (41 percent.), 53 percent. as the head (38 percent.) and 49 per cent. a son-in (Russian in this role accept 33 per cent.).
According to the new stats Germans like Poles more than Russians.
Interesting, but it will add more reliability if such statistics would be conducted by German
authors and published in German sources. Recently I asked the same question on
forum to person who represented as an ethnic German. His answer was:
I'm not going to lie now, East Europeans in general are seen as backward and pathetic. Not something anyone wants to identify with voluntarily. And in contrast to reality, East Europeans are not seen as any good-looking either. Which is petty dumb of course, as anyone who has eyes can see that most East Europeans are far better looking than Germans, unless they are some poor drunkards, but that is exactly what Germans focus on. Many Germans are not even aware of their stereotypes, it happens mostly subconsciously.
Just a few days ago I've heard a car driver screaming at another driver: "Where did you get your driving licence from? From Poland?" As if anything made in Poland is less worth. From my own experience I know that the quality of studies and expertise of Polish, Czech and Russian employees is on the same level as the German, but often enough it is not appreciated in the same way. Moreover, many parts of Slavic central Europe are better developed than many parts of eastern Germany.
And no, many Germans don't differentiate between Poles, Russians and even Romanians, for them it is all the same.
Just a few days ago I've heard a car driver screaming at another driver: "Where did you get your driving licence from? From Poland?" As if anything made in Poland is less worth. From my own experience I know that the quality of studies and expertise of Polish, Czech and Russian employees is on the same level as the German, but often enough it is not appreciated in the same way. Moreover, many parts of Slavic central Europe are better developed than many parts of eastern Germany.
And no, many Germans don't differentiate between Poles, Russians and even Romanians, for them it is all the same.
I reviewed Sorbian language. Their self name seem to be the "Serbs"? There is many similar words with Russian. For example Sorbian hymn:
Rjana £užica,
sprawna, přećelna,
mojich serbskich wótcow kraj,
mojich zbóžnych sonow raj,
swjate su mi twoje hona!
Časo přichodny,
zakćěj radostny!
Ow, zo bychu z twojehoklina wušli mužojo,
hódni wěènoh wopomnjeća!
I guess Poles will understand some words too.
Recently I asked the same question on forum to person who represented as an ethnic German.
Looking at the answer you've quoted, I'm quite confident that this person was not a German.
According to the new stats
I said it in a different thread already: the so-called "hate" between Germans and Poles that some people on PF fantasize about is a non-issue.
Frequency of R1a haplogroup by German cities according to Wikipedia.
City - R1a%
Berlin - 22.3
Leipzig - 27.1
Rostock - 31.3
Magdeburg - 21
Hamburg - 16.8
Greifswald - 19.2
Cologne - 15.6
Munich - 14.3
Mainz - 8.4
Munster - 7.8
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_R-M420_frequency_by_population
Majority of samples taking per city = 95 - 161
Germany average R1a frequency - 17.9 %. Number of samples taken = 1215
City - R1a%
Berlin - 22.3
Leipzig - 27.1
Rostock - 31.3
Magdeburg - 21
Hamburg - 16.8
Greifswald - 19.2
Cologne - 15.6
Munich - 14.3
Mainz - 8.4
Munster - 7.8
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_R-M420_frequency_by_population
Majority of samples taking per city = 95 - 161
Germany average R1a frequency - 17.9 %. Number of samples taken = 1215
what is this thread about ?
i'd just like to know before i clean it.
i'd just like to know before i clean it.
If I no make mistake genetic similarities between Poles and Germans as well as their mutual relation to each other could be directly related to the theme.
Jollla
30 Mar 2014 / #118
So I wonder why Poles forgave Russia but not Germany, when both used to be brutal nations. Is there something important in the history of the relations with those two that I missed?
The main reason is that during "soviet occupation" they (Russians) did a brain wash of Polish people telling them that Russians are friends and Germans are bad Nazis. I remember from my childhood that I even believed that they are real friends and that they defeated our enemy (Nazis). There were only two tv programs in Polish tv in 70's and almost everyday I was watching Soviet war drama films about how Germans are bad. I was about 5-10 years old so as you see I didnt watch Teletubies or something so innocent. I was in Auschwitz museum when I was a teenager. Education system in Poland was focused mainly on "How bad are Germans" and nothing about Soviets. That all created Polish people's minds. I also remember from my childhood - I have heard many times when someone said to a kid something like that: " If you will behavior like that (whatever bad behaviour) then bad German will come and will kill you. So believe it or not but those scary things were reality and I experienced them all. Maybe this is the answer on your question.
gucio
30 Mar 2014 / #119
What Polish people may detest most,is deception. So whoever want to be Polands friend there is a fairly straightforeward way to go about it. Personally, I think the times have moved on, and those Faulty Towers stereotypes are only good for a laugh over a drink, nothing else. Each country produces decent professionals in similar quantity, unless governed by some demented fanatics.
The main reason is that during "soviet occupation" they (Russians) did a brain wash of Polish people telling them that Russians are friends and Germans are bad Nazis.
I very much doubt that. Simply take the number of Poles slaughtered by the Nazis during WWII and compare that with the Soviets: the ratio is probably in the range of 90% to 10%. Russians, like it or not, are our fellow Slavic cousins sharing common language roots and customs, and along with the Czechs, are the three legendary brother nations: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lech,_%C4%8Cech,_and_Rus. Such close historic ties simply do not exist with the Germans.