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Should rape carry a life sentence in Poland?


hairball 20 | 313  
3 Oct 2008 /  #1
After a British court passed a double life sentence on a Pole after he brutally rapped and left a British woman for dead, on his transfer to a Polish prison, this has been reduced to a twelve year sentence; (so he can be released after nine years) because under Polish law rape isn't a serious enough crime to carry a life sentence.

It is Polish law - 12 years. This case is disputable and has been discussed by many forum members.

In Polish law we don't have "common laws".

lesser 4 | 1,311  
3 Oct 2008 /  #2
The EU arrest warrant turn ugly.
Lukasz 49 | 1,746  
3 Oct 2008 /  #3
That is why Britsih couldn't send full documantation of this case.

My private opinion is that it was farce.

Our court decided that it was causal case.

Polish law say 12 years is maximum for rape.

British are not going to change law in our country.

They have more problems with crime in their country.

Our law is better because we have lower crime rate in our country.
osiol 55 | 3,922  
3 Oct 2008 /  #4
Our law is better because we have lower crime rate in our country.

Poland has a higher murder rate than the UK, doesn't it?

nationmaster.com/graph/cri_mur_percap-crime-murders-per-capita
Seanus 15 | 19,706  
3 Oct 2008 /  #5
What a basic mistake £ukasz. Because you have a lower crime rate doesn't mean that u can attribute that wholly to the law being "better".
osiol 55 | 3,922  
3 Oct 2008 /  #6
The site I just linked does in fact report a lower crime rate in Poland, despite the murder rate being much higher than in the UK. However...

I picked on murder rate, partly because it is one of the most heinous of crimes, but also because murders are generally noticed. Rape victims often do not report the crime for reasons such as fear of having to give evidence, shame or whatever. Many other crimes can go unreported if it is felt that nothing will actually be done about it. The finding of a body or the unexplained disappearance of a person is more often than not, at least noticed and recorded.

The law is not the greatest deterrent. The knowledge by almost the wntire human race that acts such as murder, rape, theft and smoking in a designated non-smoking area, is a much greater deterrent.

Am I still drunk?
Lukasz 49 | 1,746  
3 Oct 2008 /  #7
osiol

read comments under article you have posted.

Seanus. Our law is our problem I don't think that rape should carry life centence. In general it is realy hard to get life centence in Poland. I'd rather suggest for British to concentrate on their law.

news.bbc.co.uk/cbbcnews/hi/uk/newsid_3753000/3753722.stm

Knife crime among young people is a growing problem in the UK according to a special BBC programme on Sunday.

In the last year more than 20 teenagers have died as a result of knife attacks in the UK - that's almost one teenager every two weeks.

(article form 2003)
Seanus 15 | 19,706  
3 Oct 2008 /  #8
I don't think rape should carry a life sentence here, no. Let's say the rapist is only 20 years old, should he be put away indefinitely? I'd say no. However, the crux is how standard sentences impact upon the perpetrator. Some can emerge reformed and others build up further resentment inside. Then, such academic discussions of whether it should be 25 or 45 years pale into relative insignificance. If it is clear that the rapist hasn't purged his sins and atoned then why release him? Yes, his sentence has come to an end but he will likely present a further danger to the public.

Arbitrarily attaching years without sufficient monitoring is taking the easy way out, lazily attaching labels without a full examination of the various factors involved.
osiol 55 | 3,922  
3 Oct 2008 /  #9
read comments under article you have posted

Which ones?

I know that the page I linked isn't the most reliable, but it is not easy to compare crime statistics of different countries.

In any country, crime is usually concentrated in areas, particularly cities.

I'd rather suggest for British to concentrate on their law.

Let's all talk about eachother's countries' laws. That way, we might see where our own countries are doing better or worse than others, and even if we can't make a difference to the legal systems of our own countries, we may at least learn something.
Seanus 15 | 19,706  
3 Oct 2008 /  #10
As a model, I suggest Scandinavian countries. Look at Sweden, social conditioning has taught them to be law abiding. Japan too.
miranda  
3 Oct 2008 /  #11
Look at Sweden, social conditioning has taught them to be law abiding. Japan too.

what do you mean by that. I think that Canadians are law abiding.
Lukasz 49 | 1,746  
3 Oct 2008 /  #12
Poland preferes shorter sentences (max 12 years) but in extreme cases pills reducing sexual drive seem to be ok. It is better to relief somebody and give for such person pills reducing sexula drive than hold all this people with life centences.

Yes crime rate is different in different areas but table you have presented is wrong and people are pointing it out under this article.
osiol 55 | 3,922  
3 Oct 2008 /  #13
table you have presented is wrong and people are pointing it out under this article

True, but how wrong? Poland isn't mentioned in the comments, and the UK is only mentioned there for the possibility of the crime rate being higher in Scotland than in England and Wales. It may be inaccurate, but it is still food for thought.

centences

Sentence.

I think that Canadians are law abiding.

There may be a difference. Germans, even German anarchists, wait for the green light before they walk across the road. In Britain, we just wander across when we think it's okay. The British, and certainly some others, are more inclined to do things because we, as individuals, believe it to be the right thing to do. That doesn't mean it is not always the same thing as obeying the law.
Seanus 15 | 19,706  
3 Oct 2008 /  #14
Reducing sexual drive, I almost fell off my chair. It's but one part of it, it can hardly be described as a foolproof treatment £ukasz. Rapists are ill psychologically Luke.

For drunk rapists, maybe you'd have a case. They are ordinarily not mentally ill and in need of treatment.
Lukasz 49 | 1,746  
3 Oct 2008 /  #15
Some people say that homosexuals are ill psychologicaly ... lets avoid this dioscussion in this topic

In modern world there are pills that reduce sexual drive and after them such persons are unable for anny sexual actions. Maybe UK preferes to hold this people in prisons...
Grzegorz_ 51 | 6,163  
3 Oct 2008 /  #16
Wasn't that guy sentenced for murder ?
Shawn_H  
3 Oct 2008 /  #17
I think that Canadians are law abiding.

You never saw me on the 401?
Seanus 15 | 19,706  
3 Oct 2008 /  #18
And u think homosexuals are ill psychologically? What an absurd stance if so. Because they are very much in the minority, doesn't mean they are ill.

It's not just the urge to have sex that drives rapists, £ukasz. The act and gratification don't always matter to them. The hurting and vengeance often does.

Sorry £ukasz, I respect many of ur analyses but u fall short here through oversimplification. Some guys have high libidos, do they need pills too, just in case they rape sb?

Come out of the Stone Age. Modern 4 u is the 1990's. Still in the last century. So it appears anyway
miranda  
3 Oct 2008 /  #19
You never saw me on the 401?

well, I should have mentioned that for the last 20 years no additional hwy has been built in Toronto (I am not counting 407, since it is paid one), so there is no reason why you should abide the crazy driving conditions, so it doesn't count;)

Or, I also didn't mention all the pot growers, I got a ticket for jay walking once (50 bucks) and I have been crossing at the same spot ever since to get the value of my ticket back:)
Dice 15 | 452  
3 Oct 2008 /  #20
Some people say that homosexuals are ill psychologicaly ... lets avoid this dioscussion in this topic

In modern world there are pills that reduce sexual drive and after them such persons are unable for anny sexual actions. Maybe UK preferes to hold this people in prisons...

UR soo fcked up, it's beyond...
Lukasz 49 | 1,746  
3 Oct 2008 /  #21
And u think homosexuals are ill psychologically? What an absurd stance if so. Because they are very much in the minority, doesn't mean they are ill.It's not just the urge to have sex that drives rapists, £ukasz. The act and gratification don't always matter to them. The hurting and vengeance often does.Sorry £ukasz, I respect many of ur analyses but u fall short here through oversimplification. Some guys have high libidos, do they need pills too, just in case they rape sb?

There are different theories about gay For sure it is sin I am not gay but I am not going to catch them or something like that..

Your argumentation doesn't convict me. I prefere our law.
Seanus 15 | 19,706  
3 Oct 2008 /  #22
It is a SIN to be gay, wtf? Dude, return to this age. Look at America, they have started to allow gay marriages. Are they behind? Doesn't their argumentation convince u?

Have u known any gays £ukasz? My good friend at Uni was gay but he couldn't come to terms with it for so long. Do u really think he wanted to be gay? No, he didn't. His family, being conservative, rejected him. How do u suppose he felt? It was in his genes, please get that into ur head. Does he harm himself or other people? NO. He is aware of the risks of what he does.

Rapists FORCE the issue. Homosexuals CONSENT.

Oh, I don't want to convict u my son, just convince u!! ;)
lesser 4 | 1,311  
3 Oct 2008 /  #23
British are not going to change law in our country.

The crime was committed in the UK, so their law should be applied. He should be in British prison. Initiative of the EU bureaucrats caused this ridiculous mess.

It is a SIN to be gay, wtf?

According to the CC, homosexual act is a sin, not homosexuality itself.

Look at America, they have started to allow gay marriages.

Marriage is a relationship of man and woman by definition. You need to figure out some new word to call permanent relationship between people of the same sex.

Are they behind? Doesn't their argumentation convince u?

Behind what? Behind the times? "Times" happens to be more or less ugly from time to time. My above comment overthrow their argumentation.
Lukasz 49 | 1,746  
3 Oct 2008 /  #24
I am not talking if I know anny gays. Actualy I know one. I don't care about his private life. I know a lot of other people who live in sin it is their problem I have the right to point it out.
EbonyandBathory 5 | 249  
3 Oct 2008 /  #25
Quite right, Seanus. This is a fundamental issue that people miss. In the eyes of the law it SHOULDN'T MATTER if being gay is "right or wrong." The law shouldn't be concerned with right or wrong, only "fair and unfair," "just and unjust." If you think it's a sin for gay people to be gay, that's fine, let God deal with that, but a court should only rule on what is fair and unfair. Rape, is unfair, not only to the victim but to tax payers who must pay for rape kits and investigations, the victim's family, so on and so forth.

In response to the thread's title, I am weary to put a blanket statement over ANYTHING as their are always degrees and shades of gray and special circumstances. I will say that rape is one of the most vile and hurtfully violent things one person can do to another and should carry a maximum sentence longer than 12 years.
Seanus 15 | 19,706  
3 Oct 2008 /  #26
The point is, it ISN'T sin £ukasz. I don't care about what people do in private either. Yes, we know that certain people live in sin, no revelation there. If a doctor inserted 'the gay gene' into u, u'd be one confused laddie.

Lesser, u r right, territorial jurisdiction usually applies. If a Bulgar murders a German in France, whose law applies? Generally French law, despite the vested interests of the 2 other countries in meting out punishment.

Lesser, u r also wrong. The CC DOESN'T think that the act of homosexual sex, sodomy, is a sin now. It was considered as such but it changed. Check it out. Also, there is a new title, GAY marriage. Marriage is a process of putting 2 people together formally. This seems to fit the bill. There can be different types under one umbrella heading.

Marriage can mean a fusion of sth, like a marriage of ideals or schools of thought. U r living in the Stone Age too. I wish I could wind the clock forward to see how u'd be. I'd probably die laughing
Dice 15 | 452  
3 Oct 2008 /  #27
Lukasz, are you trying to tell me you can't see a difference between free and consensual gay relationship and a Tomczak-type rapist who beats and rapes women till they dead? What's wrong with you man?
lesser 4 | 1,311  
3 Oct 2008 /  #28
Do you can read English by any chance?
Dice 15 | 452  
3 Oct 2008 /  #29
I am not talking if I know anny gays

Hah?

Do you can read English by any chance?

Hah?
Lukasz 49 | 1,746  
3 Oct 2008 /  #30
Lukasz, are you trying to tell me you can't see a difference between free and consensual gay relationship and a Tomczak-type rapist who beat and rape women till they dead? What's wrong with you man?

If you don't understand what I am talking about ...

The point is, it ISN'T sin £ukasz. I don't care about what people do in private either. Yes, we know that certain people live in sin, no revelation there. If a doctor inserted 'the gay gene' into u, u'd be one confused laddie.Lesser, u r right, territorial jurisdiction usually applies. If a Bulgar murders a German in France, whose law applies? Generally French law, despite the vested interests of the 2 other countries in meting out punishment.

It has been proven that kids adopted by two homosexuals often start their sexual life from contacts with person with the same sex. It isn't always DNA.

If somebody is homosexual ... what we can do ... nothing ... but two homosexuals arent normal family.

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