HOW CAN POLISH PEOPLE AFFORD IT?? They are said to earn very little..?

You forgot RENT .
Rent is only about 15% of income. Ask Poles how much they pay for rent not foreigners. My one bedroom, 70 m2, is 150 USD, all utilities including internet and cable 60 USD and I can load full basket with food for 25 USD.

Moderate hotels are 50 USD

The difference with that is the USA has monthly payments and in Europe what you spend on the card that month is got to be paid full at the beginning of the next month. One of our friends here just bought a 2007 Galaxy minivan leased it for 4 or 5 yrs. paid over 122,000zl. and her payments is around 3,000zl. a month. Thats a lot I think but hey if she feels like she can afford it thats great.

Examples please? I mean 2007-2008, not the old stories about builders carrying a construction site away bit by bit (I know these things used to happen, I'm just not happy with the way you frame your thought).

Capitalism is just a tiny bit different from communism (or, rather, from a socialism rotten on the inside). You might want to keep that in mind.

That's cuz I've NEVER asked the Irish to provide me with employment icypole, plain and simple. I'm here bcoz of my girlfriend largely, I could have the pick of jobs back in the UK if I so desired. I could get much more money back home but I've decided against that option for the time being.

This was VERY common under communism. I have relatives who built houses during that era and since there was shortage of building supplies (like everything else but vinegar), they resorted to stealing from construction sites. It's not very common to steal from work. On my last trip to poland last year i noticed that construction sites had full time security guards (especially highway construction sites) on duty at night:) I've never seen this in Canada.

mith mith mith ...

Americans/Canadians with their views about Poland ...



it was just to show how some views are harming for Poles who live in Poland...

and opinions of "Poles" who emigrated somewhere looking for reasons to not comeback ...

Right now that is 337zl per month. There is no way the 'average' person Pole or not living in anyplace other than some village is RENTING a 70sqm 2 room flat for 337zl.

From a family member getting a deal? Only czynsz? maybe...but that is just not a realistic price for most people.

THANKS TO ALL who responded to my original post. I have a better understanding now. I am an American polish. My great grandfather came from Krakow and was a farmer. Its a shame the 2 world wars and communism did so much damage to their great country. I plan on visiting Poland in May if the dollar doesn't drop more and gas prices don't spike.

Bob

Super thread quite frankly!! Well thought up and full of substance. I hope it continues to run as it could unravel what I saw as a mystery. No conspiracy theories now, LOL

Some things have been mentioned here, so I'm sorry for repeating them.

The statistical average figures are rather misleading if you want to understand the problem. You simply have people who earn much for Polish conditions and those people can easily spend big, on the other hand you have people who earn 800 zł (~350 $) a month, those people don't go out to restaurants, don't travel abroad (or at all) for holiday etc.

Other factor (probably not mentioned here) - about 20% of Poland's population are small farmers who don't pay normal income tax, of course they pay something in different forms of indirect taxes (VAT, taxes on oil etc.), but they don't have to make their annual declarations for Urząd Skarbowy (Polish IRS), I'm not sure how they are counted, are they included in the average salary statistics or not?

15-20 years ago, a month of working abroad (picking fruits or some other jobs for non-qualified workers) was worth a year's income in Poland, whoever invested wisely (for example land, real estate) his money earned abroad has now some additional sources of income, sometimes quite big.

Unlike other communist countries, we didn't have much of collective farms, most of the land was in private hands, if you happened to own a small piece of agricultural land close enough to a big city, you could make some big money in the recent years, because for example people from Warsaw buy land and build their houses as far as 20-50 kms from the city.

Size matters :)
The size of the family. Living with your parents longer than a statistical Westerner, gives you a few extra years of saving lots of money. When you finish your university studies you may even have some cash on your account (provided you were working a bit), not a 50,000$ debt (well, maybe I'm completely wrong about that, buyt that's what I understand about student loans in the U.S. for example).

Mr Kowalski you pay rent to the government, you do not pay private rent.(that is why so cheap)
Food for 25 USD 60zl.....vodka 20zl beer 20zl.. not much for food, unless you feed yourself on canary food :))))

^
Yes, but notice that MOST housing is "government" rent. Most Poles pay 300 -600 PLN for rent. The same units on private rent are 3 times as much. That's why we have low mobility in Poland.

25 USD 60 PLN loads HAND HELD basket to be clear.

It is worth rememebering to separate those who dwell in the countryside and those who live in cities. There is a major income difference, I'm sure there are regional differences as well. Major buisness centers like Warsaw, Poznan, Krakow, Zacopana, have a higher median than other places.

I think there is a lot of cash in hand work, even more so in the countryside.
I was chatting to a friend yesterday who said many of the big expensive cars on the road, are written off against buisness costs (look for the grill in the back of the car).

Remember all the statistics we have are official stats. I'm sure many people simply do not declare half of what they get. Because it is under the counter.