History / What has Poland contributed to the Western civilisation? [69]

Yes, and Jan of Lublin was one of the earliest composers in Western Europe.

It might interest people to know that the great Johann Senastian Bach had a Polish friend, and expressed interest in taking up a church music position in Gdansk!

UK, Ireland / BEWARE when coming over UK [363]

As an Englishman, I would advise any Pole coming to England to join a trade-union, because if things go wrong, they can be a very useful source of information and help.

Most of the Poles I have so far met, have been really nice people who work hard and do not expect special privileges, and it hurts me to think that a small percentage will be exploited by a few bad people; many of whom will be rogue employers or rogue agencies.

I sincerely wish that greater support was made available to people (and especially young people) who find themselves in difficulties or homeless in the UK, because I admire anyone who bravely goes to a foreign country, finds a job and tries to make a future for themselves.

That stated, I find that many Poles are quite happy and settled, and earning quite good money.

UK, Ireland / BEWARE when coming over UK [363]

Well, there are clever people and not so clever people in the UK, just as there are anywhere else.

Mr Uk is presumably one of the less clever people, who understands nothing about economics, skill shortages, demographic balance or the principles of European free trade and movement of labour.

For a start, the Poles are NOT foreigners, but fellow european citizens who come from a member country. An English person is just as free to go to Holland, Italy, Germany or Spain (for example), and in the case of Spain, many people in the UK do just that in large numbers.

Many of the Poles with whom I come into contact, work at night, as I do. I don't suppose they actually enjoy working nights when they are young, but they do it and they work well.

Compare this to the vast pool of moronic, drug-addicted, alcoholic reprobates who skulk around England's green and pleasant land by day, and thieve by night, (when it isn't raining or too cold for them), and I would personally replace them all with central and eastern europeans, who know how to behave, know how to be polite and can usually be trusted.

If you want to know which people "drain the health-service and the benefits system," then you need look no further than the awful yobs who blight the housing estates in the inner-city areas, among whom many central and eatern europeans unfortunately find themselves.

If there is ONE good thing which might emerge from this, it may be the fact that the migrants can teach the yobs of the UK how to be proper human beings, and not how to be benefit scroungers and addicts.

Law / What are the current market gaps in Polish business? [18]

I'm a little late answering this, but I can think of one business which has great potential, but would require fluent Polish and English to set up. It would involve international trading and transport, but would offer quick returns on initial investment rather than a long lead-in period. More importantly, it is a business idea which could expand or contract on a very flexible basis, without suffering any great loss of capital.

I know it would work, because it is what a friend of mine has done in the UK, and which has earned him around £2m in the past five years.

Furthermore, it is a business idea which could work in many different way, involving perhaps partners, some sort of consortium or, as a last resort, even on a franchise basis utilising centralised services and know-how.

Business profit is all about differentials between demand and supply, and that is, for the moment, the ace-card in Poland.

I'm not prepared to say what it is, but if people are interested, they could get in touch with me.

Life / How do Polish view others [116]

I hope (and think) that you may be wrong about the 50 year developmet of Poland.

The young Poles I have met are sooooo energetic, such natural winners in the workplace and often extremely well educated, they hold the key to the future. OK....we may have to loan Poland a few from here in the UK....but you know what I mean.

The EC development funding could do for Poland what it did for Ireland, and that hasn't taken very long.

I also think that the Polish/English connection is going to be very strong in the financial and banking sectors, and that will hand Poland a great deal of real expertise on a plate.

If only you could get rid of the terrible twins!!

UK, Ireland / BEWARE when coming over UK [363]



For the sake of balance and a degree of "solidarnosk" with the grafters of this world, I accept that some of my comments could be construed as lacking understanding. Point taken, but not entirely.

As for knowing "our side of the story" I don't think you could get much wider of the mark, because I do. In fact, I am in a fairly unique position, in that I have worked at the bottom of the ladder, educated myself, went to uni, qualified, worked my way up to senior management and now....wait for it....drive a truck because I got fed up with companies closing or going bust, and I like trucks.

If I were to work myself to an early grave, I could pull £30,000 a year, but as it is, I manage about £25,000 a year, plus a bit of music, a bit of writing and other odd bits here and there. (I've also written a novel, as yet unpublished....but working on it).

The interesting thing is, anyone can drive a truck if they can raise about £1,000 to get the licence.

The problems always occur at the bottom end of the jobs market, and I absolutely accept that many, many people can never aspire to anything better. There is no sin in that, and yes, there has to be a safety net for people in that situation.

I also accept that there are unscrupulous employers and agencies who will exploit migrant workers and pay them nothing more than minimum wage, and often less, quite illegally. Elsewhere, I have mentioned this problem, and warned people about it. The fact is, there IS a minimum wage, which should apply equally across the board, and there should NOT be the situation in which a Polish worker can undercut an English worker, but it happens, as we know.

However, going back to the "yob culture" thing, there is no doubt in my mind that there is a benefit culture in the UK, and it is most exploited by quite a substantial number of addicted, aimless or criminal classes....sometimes all three at the same time. I know some of the next generation....kids around 14 and 15, who are just like the adults with whom they live or come into contact.

Sadly, many of these youths approach the workplace with criminal records as long as their arm, and no employer will take the risk of employing them; knowing that they would probably be off to jail a few weeks after being set on to work. Apart from that, what employer would want kids with a drug habit, when they are surrounded by dangerous machinery or other risks? Would you want to leave your belongings lying around, knowing that the kid they've just set on is a well known thief with a record?

That is the nature of the problem, and whilst I accept that I may have generalised, I think it would be difficult to disprove.

I'm quite sure there are some especially horrible Polish people, but fortunately, I have yet to bump into them in the workplace.

The whole of Europe has a labour-market problem and an unemployment problem, but the UK fares better tha most, possibly because of an aggressive pursuit of business regeneration and a generous benefits system which enables us to have a flexible work-force.

This is very much the twin result of communist collapse on the one hand, where full-employment was always the aim, and on the other, the side effect to globalisation, as industry drifts towards the Far East and India; making it much more difficult for workers to find ordinary jobs outisde the retail or warehousing sectors.

Lastly, I would admit that I was being a little provocative, but that was my attempt to redress the lurid nonsense uttered by Mr UK, which seemed to be almost drawn from the utterances of the BNP extreme-right wing.

Travel / Why is Poland so Un-Sexy? [84]


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I may like Poles, and I would probably enjoy Poland, but I am horrified by the above prejudices.

I think I would argue that of all European countries, the UK is possibly the least religious of any, closely followed by France......most of the churches have closed anyway.

Knowing a gay Slovakian, I can tell you that he is very religious, and it is not long since the Czech Republic and Slovakia were one and the same.

I can also state with authority, that Czechoslovakia (as was), was the fourth wealthiest country in the world until 1930, with brilliant scientists and engineers who have contributed (and still contribute) much to world knowledge and development. Musically, the region is one of the most exciting in the world, with a vibrant culture known and respected throughout the world. I don't know too much about literary history, but the fact that the first democratically elected President was a poet, suggests that he was something of a popular hero.

I wouldn't want to draw comparisons with Poland....a country and people I respect, but which has suffered many difficulties as everyone knows. The difference is, I suspect, one of good governance over a considerable period of time.

I think that by claiming moral superiority for the very religious Poles, and comparing them with "modern/plastic/overnight followers" (who may not subscribe to strictly catholic and very Polish religious values), the author mirrors the sort of ideology best represented by skinheads and "the terrible twins" who now rule in Poland.

As the son of a fine man who went to war over Poland and the rise of Nazi Germany in Europe, I find that sort of thinly veiled nationalism offensive.

Of all the countries in Europe, I would have thought that the Poles would be last to welcome brutal skinheads onto the streets, and then play the role of cheerleaders in the anti-gay onslaught. For a country which desperately needs EU development money and a new lease of life, I can think of nothing which more offends everything which the EU stands for in terms of citizenship and human-rights.

If Poland is perceived as "anti democratic" and "anti human rights," does it deserve respect (and financial support) from those of us Europeans who value such things and are prepared to defend them?

UK, Ireland / Anti-Polish sentiment of England [253]


So am I, and I'm British.

Of course there is prejudice, just as there was with the many immigrants (not migrants) who arrived in the Uk after the last world-war, but I can tell you this, the Poles are very popular in the workplace and get on with English people very well.

A British official, talking about migrants from Europe, said something very interesting. I'll paraphrase what he said, but it was something lie, "Migrants from Poland will not be a problem, because within a generation, they will only be recognised by the fact that no-one will be able to easily pronounce their names."

The problem with forums such as this, is the fact that many "little Englanders" who support the extreme-right BNP party, tend to subscribe their ignorant and prejudiced views; usually

from a totally uneducated point of view.

If all the Poles in England decided to leave "en masse" tomorrow, the bloody BNP would then turn on the "Pakis", the Indians and "blacks." Another day: another scapegoat!

They're no different to the Polish Youth who attack gay people on the streets of Warsaw, but they fortunately don't carry much clout in England and have no political credibility.

That said, mass migration has created problems, but not any great hostility thus far. We're quite good at sorting out problems in the UK, and we'll adapt to it.

UK, Ireland / BEWARE when coming over UK [363]

I'm not a "she" thank you very much!

The word 'Dulciana' is that of an organ-stop, and I play the organ. (Organi......my Polish is improving in leaps and bounds!)

To the person who says that they have never met a graduate on the shop-floor, I'm a grdauate truck-driver........by choice......but I haven't always done that.

:)

UK, Ireland / BEWARE when coming over UK [363]

The BNP skinheads came around to my home, asking if I would ever consider voting for them.

I thought for a moment and delighted them with a ,"Yes."

After a pause, I added, "....but only if Robert Mugabwe becomes our Prime Minister."


====================

Sadly, I've had to take an enormous drop in income in order to drive a truck, but by making economies, I find I can live on £30K per year. The Jaguar just had to go!

:)

Life / How do Polish view others [116]


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That's interesting, because I've had a few bad experiences with Czechs as an Englishman.

One turned out to be quite a thief and a liar.

What amused me was the fact that the thief and liar called Polish people, "More stupid than chickens"

When working last year with many young Poles, I was very popular because I talked to them about Poland and always listened to any problems they had.

One boy would stand in the background saying nothing, and I guessed he was just shy or something. The one day he walked up to time and asked, "Do you like little Lithuania?"

"Yes, I'm sure I would," I replied.

"Oh good! I need CV in English writing!"

He got it done of course....how could I refuse?

Travel / Why is Poland so Un-Sexy? [84]


===========================

I don't think I am being a drama queen, having seen footage of the incidents I mentioned.

The point I was making is not concerned with politcal correctness at all. I am entitled to my prejudices just as anyone else is, and to an extent, I am free to express them anywhere in Europe so far as the law allows.

What you can NEVER have is institusionalised prejudice in the EU; no matter what happens on the streets.

The fact that there is obvious conflict between traditional catholic Poland, and those of a more liberal outlook, is not very important.....that's life. However, when things become political, then there is immediate conflict which divides, bids for power and then sets the future agenda. That way, the very foundation of democracy comes under threat.

Human Rights legislation is therefore more powerful and more important than the beliefs of one person, one party, one faith or one country.

Part of the EU Constitution outlines the freedom to express and exchange information, and it is for this fundamental reason that the beloved, and rather odd (in my view) President of Poland, was dragged across the carpet by the EU.

If the Polish President (or his twin brother) doesn't uphold EU principles, then Poland has a problem, because he DOES speak for Poland on the world stage.

UK, Ireland / Anti-Polish sentiment of England [253]

It's so amusing (and perhaps a little sad) to see so much "prjudice" being expressed about so many things.

Tha fact is, we are all prejudiced in some way or other, and that is because no-one can ever have he total picture or possess infinite knowledge: fear of the unknown being the end result.

Since time began people have migrated, and it is hardly a new phenomenon. How many Poles are part German, part Russian, part Slavic or part anything?

How many British people are truly English.....none perhaps?

Even the UK Royal Family is of German origin, while England itself is the product of a French invasion.

Contrary to what Hitler and the BNP (is there a difference?) proposed or propose, there is simply no such thing as a pure bred human being. Even culture is multi-lingual and multi-ethnic, and always has been.

How many supporters of the BNP would support the idea of a "Christian" country, which derives from Roman/Greek/Judaic origins, with a lot of medieval RC and Reformation influence included?

I am, of course, appalled by the idea of 7,000 baby Poles being born in the UK this year. How would I identify them, so that they can be "sent home" in due course? Do they have Eagle birth-marks, or are they the only ones who are actually delivered by migrating Storks? Perhaps they all have blond hair and blue eyes and little almond shape faces? (Sounds fun to me!) Will they automatically speak only Polish, and steal the cribs in the hospitals from British babies? Will their parents receive more or less in the way of child support? Will they go to English schools, and grow up as English teenagers, or will they live in a ghetto and steal pretty English girls (or boys). When they go to work, will they pay taxes to support only a Polish community, or will they be supporting the NHS, the economy, the elderly and British business? Will they have English friends, fall in love and be good citizens? God forbid, would any of them join the military and become a fifth column?

The simple fact is, the supporters of the BNP are almost always stupid, almost always uneducated, almost always bullies and almost unversally losers.

UK, Ireland / Anti-Polish sentiment of England [253]


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This is true, but if Europe means anything, it doesn't really matter does it?

Europe is a great place to be on the whole, and is proving economically very strong. With more or less open borders, actual nationality is becoming less important as time goes by.

UK, Ireland / Anti-Polish sentiment of England [253]

Aniah wrote:-

And how do you know I am a woman? I could be a man hiding behind a woman's id just to fool you clever men out there

======================

The BNP have transvestities in their midst?

Well that's one step towards liberalism, I suppose. Do they have to wear a pink triangle at the conference?

:) :) :) :)

UK, Ireland / Anti-Polish sentiment of England [253]


======================

My apologies.....a case of mistaken identity when I was going through the posts.

UK, Ireland / 5.5m Britons 'opt to live abroad' [25]


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As usual, Mr UK misses the point completely.

If you are going to make an assessment of demographics and the patterns of work and economic productivity; it pays to have something better than BNP handouts and a liberal dose of prejudice.

It is said that 2m Brits now live abroad, which means that the native resident population (whatever that means) has been falling year on year, but as a proportion of the population, old people now assume a far greater proprtion than they once did; largely thanks to improved health-care and life-expectancy. The chances are (and I do not know the answer) that many of 2m Brits abroad will be retired, and Spain is possibly the most popular choice for such people.

The fact that the birth-rate in the UK has fallen, means that there are less and less native Brits available to sustain the growing numbers of elderly people and the demands made by them on the health service. Once the "baby boom" generation reach retiring age, demand for resources will far exceed the available funding as a stable proportion of GDP.

THAT is the problem the UK (and other EU countries) face in the future, and the very reason why the pension age is now to be increased to 68 rather than 65.

Unfortunately, a once hugely productive manufacturing economy has, (like so many other countries), not become a service-industry and warehouse-economy society, and because of that, there is a considerable demand for relatively unskilled and cheap workers, which simply cannot be found from the ranks of native Brits capable of work, and who aren't druggies and criminals.

Migrant workers therefore plug the gap in the unskilled sector, and therefore beneift the overall economy to a considerable extent; making actual growth possible.

Higher up the food chain, there are definite skill shortages, and that is a much more complex situation; to some extent created by a lack of investment in training and generally falling educational standards, no matter what the officials tell us to the contrary.

Digressing slightly, when I was at school 40 years ago, we paid due respect and talked with hushed reverence about engineers, scientists and men of substance. Nowadays, school-children talk about pop-idols and dream of being celebrities!

No wonder there are skill shortages, because business has not encouraged the sort of in-job training which gives rise to skills; a classic example being truck-drivers, where there was a shortfall of 10,000 capable people 8 years ago!

No economy can thrive, adapt and grow, unless there are the right numbers of people, and the right balance between unskilled, part-skilled and skilled/professional workers.

The financial markets not only demand people of high-skill, but people who are multi-lingual; and we know how bad the Brits are at languages. As a consequence, we NEED French, and Italian, and Polish, Slovakian, Czech, German (etc etc) people to bring those skills to bear. The fact is, even the financial world has changed dramatically, and now much of the financial and technological work is increasingly done between the UK and Eurpe/Far East, and to a lesser extent, America.

It is precisely because the UK is very dynamic, and very business orientated, that many thousands of immigrant/migrant workers, at all skill levels, have been welcomed.

Like it or not, the glabilisation phenomenon is here to stay for the forseeable future, and if that be the case, then the UK (and any developed nation) desparately needs people who know the markets and have contacts there.

Project things forward 10 to 15 years, when money has been injected into Poland and Slovakia, and when car-production is perfectly placed in central-Europe (as an example), there will be numerous UK companies involved there, at all levels of business....financial, marketing, computing, distribution, logistics etc etc. If we in the UK do not have the right people, with the right skills, in the right places, then we fall behind our competitors.

Perhaps by that time, Russia will become a vital market/energy provider also, and then a new wave of very necessary migrants may come to the UK and other parts of Europe.

This is why I believe Europe to be vitally important in all aspects of our futures, because not only does it permit strategic and financial stability in a competitive world, but it will also create a pool of knowledge second to none, in spite of what the Americans would have us believe. The future may well see America drift towards South America as a source of potential partnership and economic growth; as is happening already.

As in all things, the economic map is being re-drawn and re-shaped, and for the moment, the UK is a huge player on the financial world-stage, with approximately one quarter of the world's money supply passing through the City of London every single day!!!!!

So when I see many young central and eastern Europeans slogging away doing fairly meanial jobs, I have nothing but respect for them. They have courage, determination, hope in the future and ambition.....they are the future. In the meantime, they are doing a lot for people in the UK, and helping to support the elderly and the NHS.

Now if anyone REALLY wants to take issue, perhaps they might turn their attention to the young who only want to import drugs and sell it on the streets; who never work in UK companies, but who miraculously afford to run Subaru Imprezas from the profits of the corner-shop or the take-away.

And if I come across a couple of young Poles fighting over a 50p Coke at MacDonalds, I'll buy them one each out of my own pocket!

UK, Ireland / BEWARE when coming over UK [363]


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I couldn't agree more!

London is great if you have a really good job, as I did. The pace is fast, but for those fortunate enough to have highly skilled jobs, it has its rewards.

For anyone coming to the UK, the North of England/Scotland is by far the best place to be, because that's where the ordinary jobs are, and the cost of living is a third or less of that in London.

Life / Polish Christmas customs and food [20]

Well, I think I understand Okazji........

I think I will have to cut and paste this into my files, because I will never learn to write it before New Year!

:)

UK, Ireland / Anyone here from Morecambe? [7]

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Don't go cockle-picking!

I'm 96Kms (60 miles) from Morecambe, which isn't close at all, is it?

:)

UK, Ireland / BEWARE when coming over UK [363]


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I'm surprised that no-one has yet mentioned the fact that, at the ceasation of hostilities, Churchill tried to warn of the USSR communist ambitions. He didn't like or trust Stalin, and tried to prosecute the peace.

The UK was shattered by this time, and could do nothing without allied help.

It was Truman who allowed Europe to be carved up the way it was, and not the UK, but can we really blame anyone, after such devastation and loss of life?

People wanted peace, at almost any price.

UK, Ireland / BEWARE when coming over UK [363]

I wish Freddy would get the quotes right. I didn't write what he quoted. That came from the pen of 'Saffron,' and not me!

UK, Ireland / BEWARE when coming over UK [363]


There has been so much rubbish written under this heading, I almost lost the above quote in the barrage.

Something which is quite relevant is the lack of a proper UK constitution; even though we are part of the EU. Many people from other countries do not understand how it all works, which is possibly due to the fact that we in the UK don't know also.

Let's assume, for the sake of argument, that the BNP made massive in-roads on the UK political scene, and at least worked themselves into the position of holding the balance pf power. (They could never achieve anything more than that for the forseeable future)

Let's further assume that they wanted to stop migration and immigration, and even wished to send people home, it that applies.

How could they do this?

EU law and human rights would have a lot to say, but more importantly, the British Constitution (or lack of it) actually denies power to any one sector; whether it be the military, the police, parliamentary parties, the House of Lords, the Church or the Crown.

Because the monarchy is constituted the way it is, it must be faithful to all people, at the same time as upholding articles of faith. In other words, the monarchy must take into consideration all things spiritual and political. The monarch is technically the supreme Bishop in the Church of England, and the church has representation in the House of Lords, who hold a power which far exceeds their number.

Parliament must be formed with the approval of the Monarch, and as subjects and commoners, they are charged with upholding the institution of the Monarchy, with reference to the above spiritual dimension and the church.

Both the Police and the Miltary are crown organisations, who operate under the auspices of the civil authorities by permission, and not by right.

Parliament, as a commoner's legislature, must have its statutes approved by the upper House of Lords, who are appointed by the crown, but in consultation with the House of Commons (Commoners).

In practice, it means that no single interest group or political organisation can hold total power, and there are checks and balances in place which make this impossible; short of a complete revolution.

In addition to all this is a permanent civil-service, who run around trying to hold everything together, and who advise all parties on the merits or demerits of particular policies.

Now look at the rabble they call the BNP.....largely uneducated, inexperienced, inept and on the fringes of legality.

Of one thing I am sure, and that is the fact that the occasional erudite document carrying the BNP seal of approval, is very much the exception rather than the rule, and as such, it is a party which no right-minded civil-servant, lawyer, Lord or Monarch could ever take seriously.

The underbelly of British politics is very adept at dragging its heels, and they have a history of skullduggery which is quite impressive. It is not that long ago that a Monarch was brought down by the establishment, simply because his views did not find approval

with the institutions of state and parliament.

What chance the BNP?

They would be defeated even as they assumed the balance of power.

UK, Ireland / We welcome Polish people to Britain! [224]


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Steady on!

Welcoming Poles is one thing, but ...........there are limits to our tolerance you know!

Food / Mushroom Picking Parties (Poland tradition) [74]


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You have mushroom picking parties????????????

That's almost as eccentric as lawn-mower racing in the UK.

News / England and Poland are friends [28]

Let's get our facts right. England was a NAVAL power above all else, and it's a bit difficult to sail ships across Europe.

The Nazi war-machine grew at a prodigious pace, and whilst the alarm-bells may have sounded, very few ever thought that Hitler would incite and then wage war on Europe, as he did.

So soon after WW1, the thought of German aggression after such a defeat, was not taken as seriously as it should have been.

When England declared war on Germany, the UK was not terribly well-equipped to actually go to battle, and an immediate foray into Eastern Europe would have been a complete military disaster.

Before going to war, it pays to assess the likely outcome, and simply running around with sticks and stones is not a very good battle plan.

Once England got going, and with allied help, it started to go the right way, but the fate of Poland had been sealed by that time.

Language / difficult English words for Polish speakers? [119]

No, no no! To get the "th" sound, you don't bite the end of your tongue, it gets trapped. We don't want partially tongued Poles walking around!

You place the tip of the tongue behind your upper teeth and blow out.....that's all there is to it!

Now how the hell do I pronounce Wroclaw.....Breslau was a lot easier!