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INKA 1946 - a tragic story of a 17 year old patriot executed by communist traitors in 1946 Poland


1jola  
27 Aug 2009 /  #1
This is a tragic story of a 17 year old patriot executed by communist traitors in 1946.

Unfortunately, I can't find the English subtitle copy, so if anyone has one, please upload it.

You can read about her here:

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Danuta_Siedzik%C3%B3wna

doomedsoldiers.com/polish-secret-police-murders.html

After the fall of communism in Poland, the main Stalinist prosecutor in Danuta's trial who demanded the death penalty, Wacław Krzyżanowski, was brought up on charges of judicial murder twice (in 1993 and 2001). However, both times he was declared innocent of the charges (Krzyżanowski argued that he was only marginally involved with the case).[3

There are no guilty in any of these cases. The Polish justice system has not been reformed. Shame!
Harry  
27 Aug 2009 /  #2
Wacław Krzyżanowski

That's weird, his name doesn't sound Jewish.
OP 1jola  
27 Aug 2009 /  #3
Trust me, Jews were well overrepresented among Stalinist judges, prosecutors and other UB functionaries. But, you already knew that.

Today, they are refered to as 'Holocaust survivors.'
Harry  
27 Aug 2009 /  #4
Trust me, Jews were well overrepresented among Stalinist judges, prosecutors and other UB functionaries.

That is somewhat unlikely, given that in winter trials would very often have gone past sunset on Fridays. But, you already knew that.

I was mostly commenting on the way that Poland seems to chase Jewish people who were communist-era criminals rather harder than it chases non-Jewish people who were the same. But, you already knew that.
OP 1jola  
27 Aug 2009 /  #5
, given that in winter trials would very often have gone past sunset on Fridays.

Stop repeating this nonsense that all Jews are only adherants of Judaism. You know this is not true so what is your point? When it comes to Jewish victims no one is questioning whether they were religious or not. 6 million Jews were victims of the so called holocaust. Were they all religious?

Poland seems to chase Jewish people who were communist-era criminals rather harder than it chases non-Jewish people who were the same.

Nonsense. Back up your lies or shut up. Funny that you are the one who mentioned Jews on this thread out of the blue. Who are you shilling for?

harder than it chases non-Jewish people who were the same.

The prosecutor in this case was Polish. Where do you get this paranoia?
Harry  
28 Aug 2009 /  #6
Stop repeating this nonsense that all Jews are only adherants of Judaism

You seem to have a fundamental problem understanding the difference between the noun "Jew" and the adjective "Jewish". A Jew practises Judaism. A Jewish person is somebody who is descended from Jews but who may or may not practise Judaism. Somebody who does not practise Judaism is not a Jew (but they can of course be Jewish).

Therefore your statement that "6 million Jews were victims of the so called holocaust" is obviously incorrect (and that use of the phrase "so-called" is really not needed; if you don't keep your anti-semitic rantings in check, I'm going to have to roll out the nuclear option: the 'T' word, and neither of us want that, do we?). Saying "There were six million Jewish victims of the holocaust" or "The holocaust took six million Jewish lives" would be correct.

Nonsense. Back up your lies or shut up.

Compare and contrast Helena Wolińska-Brus with Maria Gurowska. One is chased to her grave and the other is allowed to simply not bother to turn up at court. Although one could equally easily contrast Wolińska-Brus with any of the other participants in the Fieldorf murder who currently live in Poland (i.e. the ones who aren't Jewish).

Also compare and contrast Salomon Morel and Czesław Gęborski. The Jewish guy has to do a runner to Israel and rely on their government not to extradite him, the non-Jewish guy gets let off completely because he's feeling a bit ill.

The prosecutor in this case was Polish.

Yes, I am aware of that: it is why I said " weird, his name doesn't sound Jewish" in response to the fact that he'd twice been brought up on charges of judicial murder.
OP 1jola  
28 Aug 2009 /  #7
Compare and contrast Helena Wolińska-Brus with Maria Gurowska.

They were both Jewish, Harry.

contrast Wolińska-Brus with any of the other participants in the Fieldorf murder who currently live in Poland (i.e. the ones who aren't Jewish).

All eight involved in Fieldorf's trial were Jewish as well.

Also compare and contrast Salomon Morel and Czesław Gęborski.

You finally found one Pole out of a dozen.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not favoring the Poles in this case. All were guilty of what we term 'court murder.' After living so many years here, you should have some understanding why no one has ever been convicted. I'd like to hear your opinion on that.

As to the Jewish/Jew nuance, Jews themselves would not agree with you, except when they try to distance themselves from crimes committed. How can they be victims and oppressors.

Let a Jew, or if you like, a Jewish person explain it to you:

The Jews active in official communist terror apparatuses (In the Soviet Union and abroad) and who at times led them, did not do this, obviously, as Jews, but rather, as Stalinists, communists, and "Soviet people." Therefore, we find it easy to ignore their origin and "play dumb": What do we have to do with them? But let's not forget them. My own view is different. I find it unacceptable that a person will be considered a member of the Jewish people when he does great things, but not considered part of our people when he does amazingly despicable things.

Even if we deny it, we cannot escape the Jewishness of "our hangmen," who served the Red Terror with loyalty and dedication from its establishment. After all, others will always remind us of their origin.

ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3342999,00.html

Instead, why don't you find the film with English subtitles so everyone can watch it.
Harry  
28 Aug 2009 /  #8
All eight involved in Fieldorf's trial were Jewish as well.

You see Jews everywhere! Perhaps your tinfoil hat is in need of fine-tuning?

After living so many years here, you should have some understanding why no one has ever been convicted. I'd like to hear your opinion on that.

Because it is not actually in anybody's interest that anybody is convicted. Poland has made a quiet spectacularly bad job of dealing with her communist past and the whole thing has become a Pandora's box. If we go after the judges, we would need to go after their accomplices too and then where do we stop? I'd still like to see South African style truth and reconciliation commissions here but frankly there's no chance.

Jews themselves would not agree with you, except when they try to distance themselves from crimes committed.

Some do, some don't. Although it seems to me that the author of the article you quote from actually agrees with me: "[they] did not do this, obviously, as Jews, but rather, as Stalinists, communists, and "Soviet people." " and "a person will be considered a member of the Jewish people" and "the Jewishness of "our hangmen," ". I did read an interesting sant from a rabbi: he used the 'atheism is a religious position' argument to say that even a Jewish person who does not practise Judaism is still a Jew.
OP 1jola  
28 Aug 2009 /  #9
You see Jews everywhere! Perhaps your tinfoil hat is in need of fine-tuning?

Well, well. It is you who walked into your own trap. Perhaps it's not fair since I have a lot more information available to me on Polish matters, not that I am a better reasercher than you, but simply because I read Polish.

Even the wiki entry on Fieldorf in English fails to mention the names involved. Typical. If you listen to Fieldorf's daughter, and she should know very well who was involved in her father's murder, you will see that all were Jews. She has stated that on public TV and it is known.

Górewska, Gurewska, Sand(all one person) was Jewish and similarly to Wolińska screamed anti-semitism(sic!). Look it up. There are articles in the Polish press.

No tin foil hat needed here.

Because it is not actually in anybody's interest that anybody is convicted.

Justice is not in anybody's interest???

If we go after the judges, we would need to go after their accomplices too and then where do we stop?

At the scaffold, perhaps?

The understanding of the Polish justice system is difficult for non-Poles. I'll give you a hint: the system has not been reformed therefore there no one can be guilty of any communist crimes.
Harry  
28 Aug 2009 /  #10
If you listen to Fieldorf's daughter, and she should know very well who was involved in her father's murder, you will see that all were Jews.

Igor Andrejew was Jewish? Alicja Graff? Gustaw Auscaler?

Justice is not in anybody's interest???

Depends what you mean by justice.

At the scaffold, perhaps?

So we execute the judges. Then obviously we execute the executioner. And then the torturers. And then the prison guards. And then the people who drove the prison transport. And then the prison cooks. And then the people who built the prison. And then the people who made the handcuff. And then the people who taught the people who made the handcuffs how to make the handcuffs. And then the people who sold clothes to the people who taught the people who made the handcuffs how to make the handcuffs. All share the guilt.
OP 1jola  
28 Aug 2009 /  #11
Igor Andrejew was Jewish? Alicja Graff? Gustaw Auscaler?

Anrdejew was Russian. Graff was Jewish and Auscaler too-emmigrated to Israel in 57.

Andrejew's Criminal Code was used in Poland until...1998.

No one is calling for executing these beasts, the alive ones, but clearly the crime of multiple murder has gone unpunished. You do see the difference between a prosecutor asking for a death penalty on completely made up charges and a judge rubber stamping it, and the prosecutor's tailor. Or do you? See your post above.
Harry  
28 Aug 2009 /  #12
Anrdejew was Russian.

Vilnius is in Russia? Or do you mean that he was Russian because he was born in what was then Russia? If so, be careful. One thing though: if he was Russian, why did he go to a Polish university? And come to think of it, why did he spend 70 of the 77 years he could have spent in Poland in Poland?

difference between a prosecutor asking for a death penalty on completely made up charges and a judge rubber stamping it, and the prosecutor's tailor.

OK, I'll give you the tailor. But as for the rest of the people: if they hadn't done their part, executions wouldn't have happened. The guilt is spread a lot wider than you appear to say. Yes the crime of mass murder has gone unpunished, and not for the first time (the name Czesław Gęborski springs to mind). But frankly, Poland has got more than enough to be getting on with, isn't the future more important than settling scores from generations ago?
OP 1jola  
28 Aug 2009 /  #13
Or do you mean that he was Russian because he was born in what was then Russia

He came from a polonized Russian family.

But frankly, Poland has got more than enough to be getting on with, isn't the future more important than settling scores from generations ago?

This is a poor argument. It's like saying we should not punish any crime because it was obviously done in the past, so let's not dwell on it, let's move on. Besides, some of the communist crimes(murders of priests, young activists) were not so long ago. None punished, but there are plenty of ex-communists and their children defending them.

What is disturbing is that many of these people were/are collecting hefty pensions while their victims had their health ruined or were outright executed and dumped in unmarked graves.

I can't find at the moment a TV interview with a IPN historian who talks about one of the Stalinist prosecutors living in Israel who asked for Polish government to confirm in writing his years as a prosecutor for his Isreali pension, and he was very involved in "court murder."
Harry  
28 Aug 2009 /  #14
He came from a polonized Russian family.

So he's a Pole. Fair enough.

Besides, some of the communist crimes(murders of priests, young activists) were not so long ago.

Almost all of them were at least a generation ago. Most were more like two generations ago.

I do actually support the idea of there being a reckoning for past crimes but I'd prefer to see a SA-style truth and reconciliation commission at which people could publicly own up to their crimes in exchange for immunity.

Personally I'd be starting by removing the living from the effects of past crimes, i.e. give people their property back.
OP 1jola  
28 Aug 2009 /  #15
I'd prefer to see a SA-style truth and reconciliation commission at which people could publicly own up to their crimes in exchange for immunity.

Why don't we just sing KUMBAYA together. As often, you're a disappointment. Have a good weekend.
Harry  
28 Aug 2009 /  #16
Alright, let's do it your way: you find the bastards who drove the prison vans and I'll round up a firing squad.

Have a good weekend.

Certainly will. It's the last weekend before school starts again so even more people will be leaving Warsaw for the weekend. I love the place most when it's empty!

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