THEY WOULDN'T LISTEN TO WISE OLD PIŁSUDSKI!!!!

Some of them and he seemed like a sensible fellow. However, he does
seem to bear some kind of a grudge against Poland. Oh, well - he's not
the first and probably not the last.

Piłsudski captured the Polish spirit will but he died having unfulfilled some of his ambitions. He knew tough times lay ahead but he just didn't have the means at his disposal to instigate changes.

He is an Ukrainian fascist, who never condemned Wolyn massacres and he is defending UPA and their actions !

:(

Dissapointing...

For Poles when they lose it is a massacre. Then you add there kids, women and old men. Smart idea to wind up oneself. Recall how many women, kids and old men you murdered on Ukrainian lands. I would say "I am sorry" if it happened in Poland and only if you did the same as you were murdering Ukrainians for centuries and in their home. UPA warriors were those who fought your AK army and strzelcy mfs, along the way some families were killed - it is a war. But you like to blow things up out of the proportion to put yourself in good light and be like f* angels. What is the worst you teach your kids that BS. Yes UPA soldiers are heros for me because they fought Polish, Russian and German occupants. Disapponting? Kiss my arsenal.

from what i have heard, Ukrainians are very proud of how they butchered women and children and old men, and proud of how brutal they could be. chopping out eyeballs, making a family member eat it, etc.. i have read a bit on this, and know some facts. from what i see, the brutal nature, vicious nature, animalistic savagery, is far and beyond and crimes done by poles to ukrainians during the hundreds of years, where mainly men were targetted during uprisings etc.. i dont think you can really defend this beasts nathan.

they operated in same way as albo+serbian butchers in kosovo.

You read what? Albano-Polish porn books on history? Or you are interested in butchering in general and bring your fantasy here. Show me the source where you have read it. If you don't do it, I'll just understand who you are. And don't try to tell me more without source.

I'm not disappointed Nathan, I'm proud of you as you come out of the closet and openly preach your fascistic views.
As for kissing your arsenal - you wish you rascal - or are you gay too?
Don't say:)

As for your UPA heroes - they were cowards who could fight only with unarmed civilians and later they flee to Canada - heroes my ass!They should be hang as war criminals their were, but not they hide in Canada and spit their venom ....

When they were fighting Germans ? In they dreams maybe as they were Germans allies .

Ye, and AK soldiers are warriors of Jesus. Do you have monasteries of Armija Krajowa Lord Warriors along Brothers Carmelites? I wouldn't be surprised.

I am not gay, I have to disappoint you, Ironside. My arsenal is not for you ;), sorry...

As I said before I'm not disappointed, don't be ashamed of being gay, and don't try to tease me, as it wont work:) I'm not interested.


Warriors of the Lord against forces of darkness like fascist, communist and some scum locally grown .
What wrong with that?

Or maybe not, if Piłsudski really was more concerned about Russia than Germany why would he be thinking of a pre-emptive strike against Hitler's re-emerging Germany rather than a pre-emptive strike against Stalin and the USSR? Piłsudski had previously conjured up one 'miracle' over the Red Army so why not conjure up another against Stalin's and the USSR whom you say he perceived as the greater concern?

BTW. Hitler very much admired the Britain for her empire—the way a tiny speck of a country could dominate a vast area of the world—in many cases by using the local indigenous population to help subjugate and control its conquered colonies, a model Hitler thought could work for him in the future Nazi occupied countries. Hitler wanted a partnership between any emerging German "empire' and the British Empire (it was Roosvelt that wanted the old Colonial empires of Britain, France etc dismantled in exchange for US participation the European war). Hitler didn't believe Britain would go to war with Germany over Poland just as Britain didn't believe Hitler would go to war with Britain over Poland—both proved wrong.

You are not very serious, Nathan.


en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Massacres_of_Poles_in_Volhynia

What shouldn't make you feel better is that UPA murdered thousands of Ukranians too.

You seem comfortable with this also: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/14th_Waffen_Grenadier_Division_of_the_SS_Galicia_(1st_Ukrainian)

The Warsaw Uprising, Huta Pieniacka, death camp guards. Ring a bell?

Looks like you're changing your views every quarter, Nathan.
Remember this thread?

polishforums.com/archives/2009/news-4/relationship-ukraine-poland-healed-17105/5/

Now you're asking for sources because you don't like some opinions presented by Polish forum members ?
Your anti-Polish rants here are harmful for both Ukrainians and Poles.

Driven by some false ambition or grudge you don't want to accept the obvious fact:
Ukrainians are facing hard times by means of economy and politics.
Poland is your ONLY ally.
Not because we love you so much.
We need your existence.
Nobody else in the entire universe does care.
Except for our eternal friend, helper and liberator Matushka R. of course.

Borrka

Great post.

Sometimes it's necessary to state the obvious.

Ok, I have to answer to all of you at the same time. Here you go. I never denied that UPA fought POlish, Russian and German occupants. Families died along the way the same way as Ukrainian families with kids and women were killed by Russians and Polish. I don't understand what we argue about. UPA fought communists between which were Ukrainians as well, so what is your point, Jola? If there wasn't UPA and Ukrainians who fought Polish occupation and politics of national annihilation, there would never be an independant country. Isn't it obvious? The only thing I didn't like in thebear's thread was that he said that they enjoyed cutting kids and murdering women. What a BS! I bet Polish AK and strzelcy liked to catch Ukrainians and suck their brains out and slowly pull the eyes out of the orbits. Haha. Retarded.


Listen, the only ally. You care about what? My existance? You tried to erase me from the surface of the world 70 years ago as well as centuries before that. You are an ally? Haha, you are a business partner at best. Poland is nobody in EU, as you know. And if Ukraine will ever decide to become a part of EU, it will do it not through help of a "friend", but through its own political and economical changes. It is your usual view of the world - "saviors of Europe and humanity". But who you are behind that facade of BS? You are a good barrier against German expansion as well. I think we can profit from each other's existance.

Poland with GDP of $667.4 billion is the 6th economy of EU, with GDP twice as high
as Ukrainian despite the fact that Poland is a smaller country than Ukraine.

With your GDP per capita...

...just above Albania but unfortunately below Algeria, Jamaica, Tunisia and Palau,
you have to ask yourself who are you to say that Poland is nobody.

Maybe when you catch up with Angola (113th place - 13 places ABOVE Ukraine),
you will be able to come here and lecture us on our insignificance :)

Do you have any detailed dates for this proposal to the British? Names of British diplomats Piłsudski met with to discuss his proposal? As I can't find specific reference to this issue amongst the British cabinet or Foreign office papers on Piłsudski at National Archives in London?

Don't be silly! It's just another in the long chain of 'us Poles are brilliant but we got completely betrayed by the cowardly Brits' statements which some Poles love to make. Of course the reality is that after Poland's disgraceful back stab of its 1920s ally, it got a lot better than it deserved from its WWII allies.

If I remember correctly from my history classes in highschool (which was a long
time ago - some dinosaurs were still around at that time ;)) Piłsudski proposed the
pre-emptive strike to the French. It had nothing to do with Great Britain.

Care to explain this one?

[quote=Torq]Maybe when you catch up with Angola (113th place - 13 places ABOVE Ukraine),
Why do you lie? Ukraine takes 45th place in the world's GDP ranking. Nothing to be proud of, but at least this is not a lie you are used to sell all the time. I don't understand why you picked Angola which is doing pretty good at 62nd place ahead of Slovenia, Bulgaria,Croatia. But we don't talk about GDP here, we are talking about Poland pretending it is an ally and caring of Ukraine and other BS, "nobody, but we care" diarrhea. Tell this somebody else, not me. Next time try a bit better with math. ;) My previous answer was as usually erased by PF admin. I am not surprised, though. I am not Polish. Yes and next time pick year 1945 instead of 2004, you will look even better ;)

Did you bother to read the red text in your moved post? It lists the reasons your post was moved. Nationality wasn't one of them.

Your post was sent to the Random Chat as was Torq's and it has nothing to do with you being a Uki, but rather lack of any sources to your "facts." You will be taken slightly more seriously if you provide links. See your post above.

Follow the link that I gave in my post, boy. It's GDP per capita - you are on the 126th place,
13 places BELOW Angola.



You really are a sorry tosser. Just follow the link. It's data from 2008.

cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/rankorder/2004rank.html?countryName=Ukraine&countryCode=UP&regionCode=eu#UP

Good luck catching up with Angola with GDP per capita. It's only 13 places - you can do it.

Go Ukraine!

I have another couple of days booked at the National Archives later in this month so am going to copy all the Cabinet office and Foreign office papers related to the Poles and the 1946 victory parade invitation(s) while I am there.

Come on, Boris. You were doing good as well. ;)


So you claim they signed agreement in Bielowezhskaja puscha? :) I wonder when you stop whitewashing UPA. Yes they fought "communists" but this was similar to how Soviets definition of "vrag naroda" (public enemy) - it might vary largely depending on particular conditions.

Sure. Just contrast the actions of Poland in 1921 and Britain in 1940. After ‘circumstances changed’ (to use ironside’s immortal phrase), if Britain had wanted to follow the Polish example, she would have joined Germany in the occupation of Poland, interned Polish servicemen, burned down hundreds Catholic churches and converted others to CoE, closed all Polish language schools and ordered all official business to be done in English only, and opened a ‘place-set-up-at-the-suggestion-of-Goering-(who-had-instigated-such-a- center-at-Dachau)-where-people-are-held-indefinitely-without-charge-or -trial-and-are-held-70-to-a-cell-and-frequently-tortured-but-this-isn’ t-a-concentration’ camp for anybody who opposed their regime.


Even if you bring a scan of the invitation, RacistDan, sorry, I mean OziDan, will no doubt call it a fake!

It's true that the British betrayal was not quite so terrible as the earlier Polish one.
Which is not to say that there was no betrayal by Britain, either. The fact that Poland did a terrible thing to the Ukrainians hardly excuses the British with regards to the Polish. It's worth noting that a lot more deaths resulted from the latter.

What did the British do to the Polish? What do you mean?

Do list the ways in which Britain betrayed Poland in WWII. Pay particular attention to the wording of the relevant treaty.

ARTICLE I.

Should one of the Contracting Parties become engaged in hostilities with a European Power in consequence of aggression by the latter against that Contracting Party, the other Contracting Party will at once give the Contracting Party engaged in hostilities all the support and assistance in its power.

ARTICLE 4.

The methods of applying the undertakings of mutual assistance provided for by the present Agreement are established between the competent naval, military and air authorities of the Contracting Parties.

The British did not provide any assistance at one. They decrared war on Germany after 3 days. That's not at once.

The British did not use "all the support and assistance in its power" but rather insignificant token of action meant for the press.

ARTICLE 8.

(1) The present Agreement shall remain in force for a period of five years.

(2) Unless denounced six months before the expiry of this period it shall continue in force, each Contracting Party having thereafter the right to denounce it at any time by giving six months' notice to that effect.

The British violated the entire agreement by entering a conflicting agreement with the Soviets against Poland, and without first denouncing the Treaty.

That is a classical case of betrayal and even the British government of those years and today realized that. Only you, consumed by hatred, and living in the delusion of the horrible Poland that is viciously persecuting all who are not Poles.

Edited to remove offensive content.