I'M SO SURPRISED BY THIS SALARY FOR IBM in WROCLAW 3000 ZL gross

Oy, "expat" was proven to talk nonsense, so help is coming, another "very nice" expat :)))


Excellent advice, ayee :)))

maximum
they know they can get a fresh supply every year of unemployed 'humanitistic' graduates
why pay more?

this is why i think wroclaw
is built on very uncertain foundations

It is ok, I don't mind.

But the numbers don't add up. Perhaps Warsaw is a vacuum city. I do know the starting salary for the office and support staff in my husbands office is 4500 pln netto per month.

Who is buying the millions of cars on the roads? There are expensive cars in Poland. These are not all company cars. Who is shopping? Who is buying houses and apartments? Who are taking holidays to the south?

The picture painted here is that Poland is very dire and everybody is poor.. and it is complete b.s. There are poor here, like there are in every country but some on this board, and we all know who they are, describe Poland as if it is a third world country and it is not accurate. English teachers do not make a lot of money, I used to work in one in Warsaw in the late 90's, so I have a pretty good idea of the salary. And perhaps these people paint the saddest picture of Poland because they are worried about their job? Don't know. But I think I have a pretty good understanding of how this country works and how much money people make. Maybe my guess of 6,000 pln per month is off by a few thousand but - it doesn't make sense that the citizens here are buying like it is the end of the world if they don't have the money. And please don't say loans and credit- because that is not accurate either.

Yes, it is.

Law firms, debt collectors and auction houses are raking it in right now, starving graduates are not working as telemarketers anymore, but as debt collectors. Bankruptcies are up by 50% (biznes.onet.pl/kuke-w-2013-r-moze-upasc-ponad-1300-firm,18490, 5410300,1,news-detal). Debt has risen by 11%!! (manager.money.pl/news/artykul/zalegle;dlugi;polakow;na;koniec; 2012;r;ponad;38;mld;zl,206,0,1229006.html)


Step outside of your bubble. There is no new car market in Poland. The used car market is at an absolute standstill and truly pathological at the moment. The cars may look expensive, but trust me, they're not. I can find you a 2010 BMW for 50000zl. Guess why. The rest are, in fact, leased. And quite honestly when I go "shopping" I see empty floor space at most malls, a lot of window shopping and teenagers just hanging out. Not much shopping shopping. As for the housing market, well, I don't know why you're asking as everyone knows it's tanked.

3rd World country is not accurate Pip, Poland is a 2nd World country.


personally i was always amazed at how the fancy shops managed to stay open when nobody ever seemed to buy anything.

hey guys dont fight over me!In the end it was 2000 net... I really dont think i will accept it even if im desperate in Greece for now.maybe next year or sthng but not yet... havent lost as much hope

Nevertheless it is a SHAME to be offering such salaries!Even if Poland is cheaper than Greece how can u live with paying rent with 590 euros???!!!

Thanks again!
Take care
Maria

why is it a shame
poland has a culture of rapid pay rises with promotion
its a first level job
nothing that actually requires much skill


dunno which shopping malls you visit
perhaps youd like to tell me
lets say wroclaw
i dont remember seeing any empty units in magnolia dominikanska korona grunwalska

obviously another lie


has it
i dont think so

as my name says
i smell nonsense

if it had tanked
i would be buying in cash with pleasure
except it hasnt

well sorry but i am skilled i have 3 yrs experience in call centers,2 university degrees and i speak 4 languages.Do you think i deserve 590 euros?Plus my first job ever back on 2002, i was paid 600 euros... So i guess after 10 years i shouldnt be offered the same amount of money, no??


Well i guess it would take me about 150 years to reach the 850 euros i was paid in my last job...

why did you apply for a first line position then

They wouldnt tell me the salary(and i really tried hard!), we dont have this "entry level" here in Greece even now with the 60% unemployement and the crisis.If you have a degree and experience you will not get the basic salary(that now sucks ass anyways about 500 euros)/Nevertheless,they want avid speakers, possibly native ones or with great proficiency, in this company also ask for experience and they offer 590 euros??!!!I think its ridiculous!!!

I didn't expect it to be that bad... Try looking for a position with fluent Greek required, French is quite common here, Greek is not, in SSC/BPO sector people with rare language skills tend to be paid better than those only with English/German/French/Italian/Spanish/Russian.

you dont have entry level jobs in greece?
no wonder the country is ruined if everyone wants to be managers
and not workers


as i said
poland has a steep career path society
prove yourself and you can earn 10x that

I agree, take the job. Once there you can work your way up/around, IBM can afford to pay you a lot more and its a brilliant thing to have on your CV. C# programmers earn 5-7k in Krakow, BTW, but most office workers seem to be on 2.5-4K

Two years unemployment is worse than useless. Keep it up and your next job offer will be even less..


Maybe you are living in even smaller bubble, don't you live in a million Zloty house? There can't be more and a couple of thousand people in Poland earning enough to afford that on a mortgage.

What house can you buy in Warsaw proper which is less than a Million PLN, the average house price in Warsaw would be 2.5 Mil at the moment.


The people for IBM seem to exist in a bubble, I got to know an IBM transition Manger from the UK, he was open about IBM pay structures even in the UK the salaries are very low by comparison, the incentives are given by way of travel or upgrade of cars, there is a salary ceiling at IBM, if you do not like it - you leave. Many people get trapped by the culture not the salary.

Indeed. It's possible to do very well in PL. Warsaw salaries, in particular, are quite good.

Which why many of the IT jobs are in Krakow and Wroclaw

two years in today's eu
no reason whatsoever
i also wonder why she is applying for first line work
if shes so experienced and qualified


i only know a little thing
but i know ibm are famous for promoting people into obscurity
you get a nice title office travel car etc
but you actually have a non job
and people end up leaving because of it

strange company strange practices

I suppose it is about first line of support, it is not engineering position. It is mostly about shovelling issues and beeing nice to people.


Yeah... and how much do you know about IBM xseries? On the one hand I do think their offer was to low, on the other hand - this tells a lot about the market today. Without something extra in IT field, you are just fluent in some foreign language for them. But maybe some story to think about: my colleague, whose only IT skill was knowing French + a few months on a call in some IT company, took a job in IBM in Wroclaw couple of years ago (I think that he got a little more money though at the start). Anyway, in a year he managed to get some promotion, a bunch of trainings, and... left IBM and took some job in Spain, doing exactly the same but for around 2500 euros... The moral of this story is: get back to the work market, and abtain some new skills - don't wait for a white knight...

To be totally honest though, I think 2000 net is hardly enough to survive for foreigner in Wroclaw. Possible, but very modest.

You know, whatever offer they are giving you it's better than to continue to be unemployed!
Get busy..

I'd say it's close to impossible.


Indeed.

You don't me to do your internet foraging.
Now, if that's a car you want to buy, it'll show you're just as big of an idiot as most Poles.


That's fine, but do clarify, you say that the majority of Poles dropp hundreds and even thousands in one shot while doing clothes shopping in a shopping mall? We are talking about what you see the majority of Poles doing. Ale napewno wchodzisz do galerii i sie gapisz jak stara krowa ;)


I don't teach English, and I do own property in Poland. I am currently in the process of renovating one house and also buying 17 ha of farmland. So what could I know...

Yes, I lie for my benefit, especially when I can be proven wrong. I saw empty stores in Magnolia, Sky Tower, Korona and CH Borek. Galeria Grunwaldska and Dominikańska, no, they are the best located and therefore most profitable.


Sure it has. Prices have dropped 20% and more and continue to fall. For a seller, you could say the market has tanked. For a buyer, you could say the market hasn't fallen enough. Doesn't matter, the market sucks for everyone, i.e., it has tanked.

that you seem to tell tall tales
for a start
you posted previously about teaching in universities
and driving an old car
now you suddenly have become a property baron

i. smell. nonsense.

you can be honest
we know that youre just another foreigner who hates the fact that he cant earn enough in poland
unlike the locals

i know many like you
all of them pretend to be much more than they are

tefl


but if they were to do the normal thing
flatshare
etc
if they had experience and were genuinely good
they would get promoted easily

something tells me that theres something wrong with them if theyre applying for first level jobs

No problem, I've got time to waste. Why with you, I dunno, but here ya go:

You got me there. I lie on internet forums to boost my pitiful ego and make up for the fact I have a small penis. I'm in Poland to score with girls that I'd never have a chance with back "home". I make only 2k net and my life consists of bouts of drinking Tesco beer and offering half-assed "conversation lessons".

But your detective skills are impressive - *click* username, *click* Latest Threads. Yes, I have a very old car. In fact, three. I used to teach English in PL. And no baron as of yet, just a house and tentatively planning on buying some farmland.

In conclusion, I don't know what I'm talking about, I make lots of stuff up and I evidently have some inferiority complex that compels me to reply and defend myself to asinine internet forum posts that attack my character.

As I wrote in another topic:

Call center salaries are from
Median 2500 gross per month in Polish and 4000 gross for person knowing foreign language in Mazowieckie (meaning Warsaw)
to:
respectively 2000 - 3000 in Dolnoslaskie (Meaning Wrocław).
Minimum is 1500 gross.
- this salary is full time job.

hays.pl/prd_consump/groups/hays_common/documents/digitalasset/hays_465124.pdf

- here you can also read Min, max for few other places

Merged: IBM will lay-off their employees


dailymail/news/article-2927172/Biggest-corporate-lay-history-expected-days-IBM-believed-scrapping-110-000-430-000-workforce-world.html#comments

for people working in IBM, how much time the interview process takes, and how much time it took to process your Visa after making an offer?

Merged: Salary for Subject Matter expert in IBM IT Service Desk in Wroclaw?

What would be the salary for Subject Matter expert in IBM IT Service Desk in Wroclaw? Any idea guys? I have to negotiate about my salary expectations. Any suggestions would be much appreciated.

... and no, Poland is not much much cheaper than Greece

@Spidersixthsens,

It took me two rounds of interviews and two weeks later after the second interview for they to communicate the offer to me.

My work permit took exactly two months for it to be ready.

Hope it help!

NLeRoy.

NLeRoy; i was also offered a position in Wroclaw by IBM too. They wanted me to send them my diploma, transcript and passport. They said they will check if my education is equivalent to Polish or not. We talked about salary i wanted at first meeting, then they also didn't offer me a contract. We had 2 meetings then they wanted these docs. What do you think about this process? Does it mean that they are agree with salary i wanted? What will be next? I dont want to ask them, just waiting.