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Salary for a senior software engineer in Poland



Marsupial - | 925    
19 Mar 2017  #121

Ong i used to get in trouble for not coming home till night. In trouble for going out in snowstorms. In trouble for paddling a styrofoam boat acrros the oder. In trouble for going into bunkers, scating on frozen lakes, playing on the army base. Aliens.


peter_olsztyn 6 | 1,094    
19 Mar 2017  #122

With the 7.5k-8K zloty gross for a single person, how much would I be saving at the end of each month?

If you are really tough guy you can save about 2000zł

I have never been to Poland.

That's a pity.
fappper    
19 Mar 2017  #123

@peter_olsztyn I don't party, drink or smoke. I prefer quality food (nothing fancy or resturants - may be once or twice in a month I eat out).

I usually buy new cloths after 4-5 months.

I just need a good internet connection (anything with 8-12MB speed is good enough), heat and electricity.


I don't watch TV since I watch movies and TV shows on my computer.

How much would I save if I live in a studio appartment i-e; 1 bedroom, 1 bathroom & 1 kitchen & do stuff that I mentioned above?

The employer has offered me7.5K but I'm trying to extend it to 8.5-9K.

I want to save at least 3000-3500 zloty a month.
Marsupial - | 925    
19 Mar 2017  #124

Sorry if i was rude about the nasty pollen. It just seems funny to me that a plant actually effect anyone aside from providing oxygen. I guess some people have evolved to concrete living. No disrespect intended.
fappper    
19 Mar 2017  #125

@Marsupial It's perfectly fine. Actually developing allergies has nothing to do with lifestyle or place of living. In fact where I currently live is riddled with trees and dust.

Can you please provide some information regarding the last question I asked. That would be really helpful.
peter_olsztyn 6 | 1,094    
19 Mar 2017  #126

The employer has offered me7.5K but I'm trying to extend it to 8.5-9K.I want to save at least 3000-3500 zloty a month.

8K gross is 5640 netto, You will spend about 2000 for a flat, 700 for food, 70 for internet 120 Mb/s, 50 - 100 mobile phone. It may be difficult to save 3000zł.
fappper    
19 Mar 2017  #127

@peter_olsztyn Thanks for your valuable feedback. Does this 2000 zloty amount for a 1 bedroom,1 bathroom & 1 kitchen apartment includes electricity, water, heat and misc cost for living in Poznan, Poland?
DominicB - | 2,259    
20 Mar 2017  #128

@fappper

If you're hoping on saving 3000 to 3500 PLN a month, then you're barking up the wrong tree in considering Poland, where savings potential is very low.

Your BASIC costs per month will be:

Off the top, your relocation costs: travel to and from your home country, visa and residency permit. This has to be deducted from your monthly wage, as it is a cost associated with working in Poland.

Housing: 2000 PLN all inclusive (rent, fees and all utilities except internet/phone/TV).

Everyday living expenses (food, household supplies, cell phone and transportation): at least 1000 PLN a month for a rather frugal lifestyle for a non-smoking, non-drinking, non-dating single person that cooks all meals at home from in-season local ingredients). Considerably more if you want a better quality of life.

That's about 4000 PLN right there, without expenses like clothing and shoes, travel and entertainment.

So if you wanted to save 3500 PLN a month, you would have to earn at least 8000 PLN a month net, or 12,000 gross.
fappper    
20 Mar 2017  #129

@DominicB I have asked my employer about the studio apartment, food and misc costs per month and he has quoted that

an apartment costs around 500-700 zloty
Electricity, Heat & other bills cost 200 zloty
He didn't mention anything about Food costs though
Mobile costs are around 50 zloty
He says internet is already available in mobile costs.

Should I believe him? Is the apartment, bills and other costs he has mentioned are correct?
Atch 12 | 1,723    
20 Mar 2017  #130

Firstly Fapper Poles don't use the term 'bedroom'. They describe apartments by the number of rooms apart from kitchen and bathroom, so you're looking in local language for a one room apartment which is how they describe a studio.

Sorry but your employer is talking rubbish. Here's a link to a Polish website showing 1 room apartments in Poznań. As you can see one of the cheapest is 700zł but if you click on the ad you'll see that there's a czynsz of 400. The cynsz is a service charge which usually covers water, rubbish collection and sometimes central heating. It's often very high. The czynsz is always going to be at least 400 on top of the advertised rent. So your total cost will be 1100 per month. There is also what they call 'minor charges' for electricity and gas every two months. Beware of such vague contracts. The minor charges can turn out to be considerably more than minor and you're locked into a lease agreement.

otodom.pl/wynajem/mieszkanie/poznan/?search%5Bfilter_enum_rooms_num%5D%5B0%5D=1&search%5Bdescription%5D=1&search%5Bdist%5D=0
fappper    
20 Mar 2017  #131

@Atch So you mean that if he pays me 7.5k Gross per month, I won't be able to live a handsome/respectable life? What do you think I would be able to save at the end of the month if I don't drink, smoke or party?
Ziemowit 8 | 2,520    
20 Mar 2017  #132

There is also what they call 'minor charges' for electricity and gas every two months. Beware of such vague contracts.

But these charges are paid accordingly to the reading of the meters. If the charges "turn out to be considerably more than the minor", it means the person uses a lot of gas or electricity.
fappper    
20 Mar 2017  #133

@Ziemowit I'm extremely confused now. What will be rent of a 30m2 1 bedroom apartment including the electricity, rubbish collection, heat, wifi and furniture?
Atch 12 | 1,723    
20 Mar 2017  #134

The problem is that it's hard to determine exactly how much you'll pay for rent and bills as sometimes the cynsz covers gas and electricity and sometimes it doesn't. But you would certainly need to budget around 1500 per month for rent and bills. Food, I suppose a thousand would cover it and allow another 200 for internet, phone and transport. So your bare minimum expenses at just survival level each month would be 2,700. You can save whatever is left over but you will have to dip into it at some point for clothes (especially for the Polish winter), maybe a vist to the dentist or doctor or some other emergency. You certainly won't live a 'handsome' life and bear in mind you will be living alone in a foreign country so add that to lack of money and you have a recipe for quite a miserable existence. Peter Olsztyn was pretty much spot on when he said if you're very tough you could save 2,000zł. No matter how many times you ask the same question, you'll keep getting the same answer because it's the truth! You're being offered a very low salary for somebody with five years experience. My advice would be that if you're not in urgent need of changing your present job, keep searching until somebody offers you 10,000 gross.
Ziemowit 8 | 2,520    
20 Mar 2017  #135

It depends on the contract. The czynsz may be either included in the rent or not The czynsz is typically included, so it is the owner who pays it, thus he adds this to the amount of the rent. It shshould be inscribed into the contract.
fappper    
20 Mar 2017  #136

@Atch so this means I should decline his offer or ask him for 6500 net or 9000+ gross for living handsomely.

What I have taken from this discussion is the monthly cost for a 30m2 apartment, food, internet, mobile services, transportation and misc, I will spending around 3000-3500 zloty if I am really tough on myself or 4000 zloty if I live a little better life.
Atch 12 | 1,723    
20 Mar 2017  #137

The czynsz may be either included in the rent or not

I'm afraid that will confuse the OP even further! The bottom line is that when you go to a website and look at details for an apartment they usually show two separate figures, one for rent and the other for czynsz and the two added together is what the tenant will have to pay each month.

@ Fappper, yes, as the job is advertised at 9,000-10,000 zł then I would say definitely press for the 9,000. Now the thing is obviously I haven't seen your CV, don't know your skill set and I don't know how you answered the interview questions or whether they gave you a techincal test and if so, how you did. Any of those things could have influenced their offer of 7.5. Perhaps they really feel that it's a fair offer, but they could just be trying it on to see how cheap they can get you. Polish employers are not generous even with their own so don't take it too personally :)

If the offer falls through, then as I say, keep looking and if you keep getting the same low offers, then maybe look at your skills and consider adding to them in your spare time by teaching yourself another programming language or something.
fappper    
20 Mar 2017  #138

@Atch I have 5 years experience in Software Engineering with several popular apps. I cleared all the tests and techincal assignments with flying colors. All the questions in the interview went extremely smooth.

I didn't quote the salary amount myself. At first they quoted 3000zloty then they bumped it upto 6500 zloty and now they have bumped it upto 7500zloty. I have asked for 9k-10k zloty.

I am quite aware of the low salary they are quoting and if they keep the offer to 7.5k then I know I won't be saving as much as I am saving in my home country. :)
Ziemowit 8 | 2,520    
20 Mar 2017  #139

At first they quoted 3000zloty then they bumped it upto 6500 zloty and now they have bumped it upto 7500zloty. I have asked for 9k-10k zloty

Now, that's pretty amusing. If they can increase their offer from 3,000 to 7,500, the company isn't particularly serious. You may well expect them to increase it yet another 2,5-fold now, that is to 18,750 zloty.
Atch 12 | 1,723    
20 Mar 2017  #140

Now that's very interesting. 3000 zł is an absolute joke. Clearly they underestimate your intelligence if they think they could get away with offering you peanuts like that so I'm not sure you'd be very happy working for them in any case. Just ask yourself, what sort of people are they to make an insulting offer like that? Anyway it sounds like you have every chance of getting a good job with a decent salary if you just keep plugging away at it. Good luck!
Ziemowit 8 | 2,520    
20 Mar 2017  #141

Good luck!

Now if he tells us the name of the company, we can investigate it a little further and tell the OP what sort of ******** it is. I agree that offering someone 3,000 while in reality they are prepared to offer 2,5 times more than that is a joke. I myself would stop talking to them at that point.
DominicB - | 2,259    
20 Mar 2017  #142

Should I believe him?

No. They are vastly underestimating the cost of the apartment, and not telling you about the hidden costs. First of all, good studio apartments (one-room apartments) are very hard to find. They are very much in demand, and the supply is not so good. Most of them that I have seen have kitchens that are basically useless, so that means that you will have a hard time cooking at home. A good studio apartment is going to cost from 1500 to 1800 PLN all inclusive (rent, hidden administration fees, and all utilities except internet/phone/TV). If it costs less than that, there is something wrong: bad kitchen, bad windows, bad location, bad neighbors, etc. That is why you need the help of an OLDER experienced Polish colleague to find a good apartment.

My guess is that you will not be able to find a good one-room apartment and will have to rent a good two-room apartment, which are much easier to find. The total cost for that will be between 1800 and 2200 PLN, all inclusive.

If you are making 7500 PLN gross, that means about 5000 PLN after taxes. After deducting the cost of your relocation, your apartment costs and your living expenses, the most you would be able to save is 1500 PLN, and that is if you live like a monk. You won't be satisfied with that lifestyle for long and so you will dip into those savings to avoid going crazy. Even then, it will not be a comfortable life.

Like I said, if you want to save 3500 PLN a month, you will need to earn 12,000 gross. I doubt an employer that initially offered you 3000 PLN is going to go that high. I would never work for an employer who made an initial offer of 3000 PLN. They are obviously either unethical, or just plain stupid, and it is not pleasant having either as an employer.

Again, if you are interested in saving money, Poland is not a country you should even be considering. Wages are very low, cost of living relative to wages is very high, and savings potential is downright abysmal.

You will never find a good job if you depend on recruiters and internet sites. Good jobs are advertised exclusively face-to-face in the real world. Recruiters and internet sites get the table scraps. If you want a good job, use your network of real-life contacts to find one, especially those people who have worked in richer countries where the savings potential is much higher than in Poland.

This job is not the dream job you are looking for. Stop wasting time on it and look for better opportunities elsewhere. They certainly exist.

As for pollen in Poland, it is a big problem. Often, there is so much pollen in the air that it forms patches on the roads and covers cars with a thick layer of "dust" after a rain. I was surprised when I first saw it. If pollen is a problem for you, then anywhere with wet weather is pretty much out of the question because of the abundant vegetation. Try to find a job in Saudi Arabia or the Emirates.
DavidZeal    
23 Mar 2017  #143

Hi,
Have got an offer in Gdynia, Poland and will be moving once I get my VISA and work permit done.
I've gone through this forum and found it very helpful to know things, didn't find one thing here.
I would appreciate if someone can provide me some information about below questions-
May I please know, how much an apartment rent costs in Gdank or Gdynia. Looking for 1bedroom, living room, kitchen.?
And what is the best way to rent an apartment in these cities?
Whats the procedure of booking an apartment for rent - how much I need to pay in first month?
How much time does it take for getting VISA and work permit in General?
Can I apply for EU Blue card - I am from non-EU country.

Thanks in advance!
fappper    
24 Apr 2017  #144

PLEASE HELP!!!

I have been offered employment by a Polish company and everything was going smooth until now. The employer told me that they will be sending work permit to me in a few days so that I can apply for visa in my country. However today I received their email stating something extremely disappointing. I'm kinda shattered now. Anyways here is their response:

"Our lawyer told me that our grant do not allow to have ppl from the outside EU.Problem is in terms we used in our grant application. We have pointed EU as "source" of ppl - this is EU grant, so there is no issue with polish law, but with source of our money. We could try to ask AU commity to allow us to use that money for you, but it will take them about 3 months"

What can be workaround in this scenario? I'm extremely willing to work in Poland. And after 2 months of hope, thinking of leaving this opportunity is hurting me from inside.
Atch 12 | 1,723    
24 Apr 2017  #145

Fapper are these the same people who messed you around over the salary and were initially offering you 3000 zl? If so, forget about them.

But anyway even if it's a different company, a business who are so incompetent that they don't even know the terms on which they can employ someone and offer a job only to realise afterwards that you're not eligible for the visa, are a shower of tossers quite frankly and would be a nightmare to work for. Fapper, there are so many job opportunities in Europe, let alone in Poland, you don't need this kind of aggro. I'm afraid this kind of messing people around is typical of many Polish companies and they do it to their own people as well, not just foreigners. So just chalk it up to experience and be prepared for a lot more of it before you find the right job.

There is no advice anyone here can give you regarding how to work around the scenario. It's a purely internal affair that's up to the company to solve. But as I say, you're better off just moving on and looking elsewhere. Don't put your life on hold waiting around to see what happens. Good luck.
fappper    
24 Apr 2017  #146

@Atch,

Thanks for the kind words. Yes it's the same company and they eventually agreed to pay me a handsome salary according my skills that's when we proceeded to this work permit and visa stage. I'm amazed too that he didn't know the terms upon which he can recruite talent. What hurts me most is that reaching upto this stage has not been easy for me. I have applied at several companies around the Globe but unfortunately most of them didn't offer sponsorship, let alone the relocation package. I'm hell bent in landing a job in a foreign country because it's time I started expanding my skills on international level. I have literally given 100s of interviews in the past 2 months. I have made it to the final stage in quite alot of them but at the end they simply threw everything out of the window by statements like "You have very promising skillset and you are a talented guy but unfortunately this time we can't offer sponsorship/relocation package for this job. Have a great day". Only this employer seemed promising enough if we keep aside his carelessness and incompetency.

I'm not really sure what to do now. It has literally having a toll on me.

Anyways thanks for being so so helpful. I have utmost respect for you and many other good people here who have been of tremendous help!
Atch 12 | 1,723    
24 Apr 2017  #147

I'm not really sure what to do now.

Well based on the extra background story you've just provided, I would say, let the Polish company faff around trying to sort the visa and if it works out, then take the opportunity as a means to an end. Don't expect it to be your dream job but see it as an opportunity to start the next phase of your career. Get a year or so under your belt there and even if you hate it, grit your teeth and just think of your CV. Then start looking around for something better. In the meantime, if you're feeling exhausted from the job search, take a break from it now for a month or so. It's not going to make any great difference in the long term and you need to have a rest and you'll come back to it with renewed energy. Don't give up. Keep us posted won't you and let us know how things go :))
fappper    
24 Apr 2017  #148

@Atch This is exactly what I'm thinking. I'll take this opportunity has step stone. The only way I can avail this opportunity is by finding some sort of work around to the issue the employer has mentioned. He has shown interest in me time and again and a month back when I thought everything was going down the drain and they won't give me good salary, he approached me out of the blue and offered me a good salary because he said "He wants to work with me". Now I need to find a work around to this EU grant thing. Your help is highly appreciated :)
KnightHawk - | 1    
24 Apr 2017  #149

Hi, i'm from India, and have 4+ years of experience in IT. I have been offered a job in Gdansk with 6500zl gross. Also one way flight to Poland as a relocation package. As I understand, its not great amount considering I'm getting well paid in India at the moment. Is it a good amount to survive in Gdansk, as I read the cost of living in Gdansk is cheaper compared to other cities in Poland. Also, It would be great if someone can give an average time it takes for a company to get the work permit.
Atch 12 | 1,723    
24 Apr 2017  #150

offered me a good salary because he said "He wants to work with me"

That might be what he said but the truth is that they need your skills, he realised you weren't prepared to work for peanuts and he accepted the fact that he'd have to pay you a halfway reasonable salary.

I need to find a work around to this EU grant thing.

Like I said Fapper that's their job, to find a solution, not yours. It's an internal company matter which they have to resolve either by finding the money elsewhere in their budget or by some other means. Whatever you do, don't start racking your brains and trying to present them with possible ways round it. It will make you look desperate. Yes, you might be desperate to work for them, but dont let them know that! It comes across very badly to appear so anxious to work for a company. The situation which has arisen is entirely their fault and they must be the ones to fix it. Remember these people have misled you and messed you around for two months so if anything you should be expressing your annoyance to them, not soothing their feelings and offering to help them!

Just tell them you're disappointed as you were looking forward to working for them and that you would still consider doing so in the future if they manage to solve their budgeting issues and leave it at that. If they're that eager to hire you, they'll find a way.




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