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Moving Back to Poland after living in Canada for 24 years. IT jobs market?


marcinptak 1 | 5
3 Feb 2011 #1
Hello Everyone

I am moving back to Krakow, Poland after living in Canada for past 24 years. I am a bit anxious about findind a job and would appreciate any advice. For the past 8 years I worked as an IT Manager for a financial firm in toronto, before that ran my own IT Consulting business for 6 years. What is a realistic pay that someone with my type of experience (IS deparment management, Windows /Linux Client/Server Admin and support, ITIL and governance/security compliance, Virtualization etc) can expect? Also what are the best companies to apply for? I speak and write both English and Polish fluently.

Thank you
Martin
convex 20 | 3,978
3 Feb 2011 #2
It depends on which company you're working for. Krakow isn't big on finance far as I can tell. All of the big consulting companies are there though. Might want to look at contracting while you're waiting for something decent to pop up.
OP marcinptak 1 | 5
3 Feb 2011 #3
Thank you for your reply. I am not so much looking for a job in finance as an IT position, the type of company doesn't matter. Can you recommend any consulting firms in Krakow? I looked through all the polish job sites and I was able to find a few.
Wroclaw Boy
3 Feb 2011 #4
May i ask why are you returning?

It appears that quite a few Poles are coming back form Canada lately, you would think there would be more returning from the UK or Ireland i mean almost 1,500,000 have left since 2004. I really cant understand this.
ShawnH 8 | 1,498
3 Feb 2011 #5
I really cant understand this.

Cold Winters, multi-culti, High Tax Rates, High unemployment, poor selection of Deli's (depending on which neighbourhood...), not enough Polish women, lack of cultural pursuits.....
Wroclaw Boy
3 Feb 2011 #6
I meant returning from the UK and Ireland, good answer to what you thought i asked anyway.
ShawnH 8 | 1,498
3 Feb 2011 #7
Having never set foot in the UK, maybe the same issues apply??
Wroclaw Boy
3 Feb 2011 #8
Hey all the others seem to love it.
OP marcinptak 1 | 5
3 Feb 2011 #9
Actually other than the high taxes none of the reasons you mention apply. Winters are same as in Europe . Unemployment is only a problem if you are in the auto industry and even that is improving rapidly.

There is no shortage of Polish women plus I am married to one :-) and we have many polish supermarkets here that carry all the same products as the stores in krakow.

We are going back due to family and personal reasons.
BTW Do any of You work in Krakow and can provide some pointers on salaries and reliable companies or IT consulting firms?
abbud
3 Feb 2011 #10
tempreature in poland is -10 Fahrenheit unemployment 20%
peter_olsztyn 6 | 1,098
4 Feb 2011 #11
for past 24 years. I am a bit anxious about findind a job and would appreciate any advice.

The most important thing in Poland when someone is looking for an employee is the candidate's age. We don't need experienced workers who know how to fight for their rights. We consider people 45+ as a waste. We are looking for young and naive people with mortgages or/and kids to exploit them ;)
ShawnH 8 | 1,498
4 Feb 2011 #12
Hey all the others seem to love it.

Greener grass over the fence? Problem is you always see your the weeds in your own back yard.

Unemployment is only a problem if you are in the auto industry and even that is improving rapidly.

Trust me, I know about that. You are right though, all things being said, Canada ain't too bad....

We are going back due to family and personal reasons.

Hope it works out for you! Good luck!
paulinska 9 | 86
4 Feb 2011 #13
HCL, IBM, Capgemini.....all offer IT consultancy work. Salaries are much lower as compared to what you've been earning in Canada. Seeing you've been living in Canada for a long time, are you familiar with French? Some IT consultancy jobs will require fluency in another European language on top of English and/or Polish.

What is a realistic pay that someone with my type of experience (IS deparment management, Windows /Linux Client/Server Admin and support, ITIL and governance/security compliance, Virtualization etc) can expect?

It's an employer's market, this. The rates are highly negotiable depending on your experience and skill set.
2 yrs ago, with a somewhat similar skill set - SDLC driven, I was offered about 4000 PLN Gross by a krakow based consultancy firm.
At the end of the day, it's a personal preference. For whatever reasons you've decided to finally move back to the old lady - finding work is always going to be a challenge. Best of wishes....
OP marcinptak 1 | 5
4 Feb 2011 #14
Thank you very much for the info. would you know what CV format is preferred ? Should I be using the EuroCV ? Also should I send it in Polish or English or both?

4000PLN Gross is roughly 3200 PLN net?
Wroclaw Boy
4 Feb 2011 #15
Should I be using the EuroCV ?

Never heard of a EuroCV before.

I would provide a CV in both languages accompanied with a recent photo, cover letter and as many references as you can get.
OP marcinptak 1 | 5
4 Feb 2011 #16
Never heard of a EuroCV before.

I found this online. It is the standardized CV format published by EU.

cvtips.com/resumes-and-cvs/eu-cv-format.html
delphiandomine 83 | 17,771
4 Feb 2011 #17
It is the standardized CV format published by EU.

Forget it - give your Canadian one, as well as one to the Polish standard in Polish.
BBman - | 344
4 Feb 2011 #18
Marcin,

I lived in Poland for a couple of years. I worked in engineering and made much, much less than in Canada but I only did it for the experience. It is possible, over time, to make decent money but you need nerves of steel to succeed in Poland - the work environment is tough in Poland.

IT people are in demand in Poland but wages can vary considerably. I have friends back in Poland who are making (entry level) anywhere from 3K PLN / month to 10K PLN - depends on a lot of factors.

The most important thing in Poland when someone is looking for an employee is the candidate's age. We don't need experienced workers who know how to fight for their rights. We consider people 45+ as a waste. We are looking for young and naive people with mortgages or/and kids to exploit them ;)

Sad but true. It's mind blowing how much discrimination exists in the Polish workplace (compared to Canada).
peter77 - | 3
23 Feb 2011 #19
Hello EveryoneI

Hi there,

I used to work in Krakow for IT Comarch company, my salary was 7500 pln (5 250 net). Also got company car and private health care (for whole family). But, you can work for ANY company really, if you're experienced in IT department management. There is a lack of SAP specialists in Poland, if you know the system then you should expect 10 000 or even higher.

You shouldn't go below 5000 PLN gross. Gross to net is 0,7. That 0,3 are tax and social insurance and health care. But be prepared. Whenever you buy anything you pay 23% VAT. If you buy a gas, alcohol or cigarettes - then you also pay an excise. If you have a house in Canada and you're going to sell it for, let's say 300-400k CAD, then you're are a millionaire in Poland :) Krakow is a beautiful city, with awesome old town, there are really a lot of must-see places. Avoid Nowa Huta district and everything we'll be just fine.

And now, here's the deal :) I'm thinking about moving to Canada, with my wife. We got 10 years of experience, me as a key account manager, my wife as an accountant. Could you please tell us how much we can expect in Toronto/Mississauga area? Thanks a lot in advance.

Regards, Piotr
grubas 12 | 1,391
23 Feb 2011 #20
I am moving back to Krakow, Poland after living in Canada for past 24 years.

Are you people crazy?Do you have it that bad in Canada to have to move to Bolanda?Bolanda is located in Europe but in reality this is an African country.For Christ sake stay were you are and enjoy your life.
Wroclaw Boy
24 Feb 2011 #21
Do you have it that bad in Canada to have to move to Bolanda?

Whats the matter grab a$$, you find it hard to believe that some peoples motivation maybe something other than money? thats the message im getting form you.

Get of the fence buddy.
grubas 12 | 1,391
25 Feb 2011 #22
Hard to believe this is the same poster who wrote things such as:

Is it really?Why is that?

Whats the matter grab a$$, you find it hard to believe that some peoples motivation maybe something other than money?

If it was only about money I would be back in Poland long time ago.It is more about corruption,nepotism,lack of justice and freedom.The whole system is as crooked as in African countries.And I don't think it's funny but lets call spade a spade, it's Potato Republic and one must be blind to don't see that.

Get of the fence buddy

I can't.Not until a revolution after which I get off the fence and go back to PL.
delphiandomine 83 | 17,771
25 Feb 2011 #23
Sad but true. It's mind blowing how much discrimination exists in the Polish workplace (compared to Canada).

It's refreshingly truthful as well.

If you want a young person, you can advertise for one. No questions asked.
OP marcinptak 1 | 5
28 Mar 2011 #24
Could you please tell us how much we can expect in Toronto/Mississauga area? Thanks a lot in advance.

Thank you for your reply.
I have been away for a while hence the lateness of my response.
The average salary for an accountant at the company I work for is around 60K dollars. If you are CGA certified it will be more

Thanks
Martin
Seanus 15 | 19,706
28 May 2011 #25
vimeo.com/1929402, this is a cautionary tale for foreigners doing jobs beyond English teaching here. IT jobs or any others could be hard if you don't have a strong command of Polish.
z_darius 14 | 3,968
28 May 2011 #26
Key account manager - starts at around $50K plus, but $60K-$70K is the middle of the road.
Accountants make good money too if they have local experience. $60K and up average, $80 to $$120K in well established businesses or senior government positions. With an accounting experience from outside of Canada don't expect your wife to get any better than $40K while she pursues local certifications. If the gets CGA and such then it's a decent dollar.

Life in GTA (greater toronto area) ain't cheap, or pleasant for that matter. It's a big garbage bin.

My house (just over 100km from Toronto) would cost 2 to 5 times more in TO than what I paid. In fact people routinely pay more than the asking price!!! Rental vacancy rate is very low (bounces around 1%) which puts a lot of pressure on renters. You can find a 2BR apt. for under $1000/mo but that would be in an area where you'd be best advised to hire a body guard.


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