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Moving to Lodz - will my 2500 PLN salary be enough?


DedeBR
16 Jul 2013 #1
Hello ladies and gentleman :)

How are you? Has the summer struck Poland yet? Coz here in the Netherlands is not that warm =D

well, I have a question and I hope you can help me.

I got a job offer in Lodz and I would like to know if the salary I will get (2900PLN Gross) is enough to have a normal life (not struggling every month to survive and stuff like that).

The company also offers reimbursement of agency housing brokerage provision (Applicable only for the real estate agency cooperating with the Company) and also reimbursement of the flat rent up to 2500 PLN monthly (incl. rental cost and owner rental fee) for the first quarter of each employment year.

Or I could live in one of the companies' flats sharing kitchen and stuff and I would have 300PLN deducted from my salary.

Would I have a normal life or would I be suffering to get my way around? (I barely drink. I don't smoke. I cook my own mean, at least most of the times)

Thanks for all the help :))
Monitor 14 | 1,820
16 Jul 2013 #2
If your company will pay for the flat, then you will have comfortable live with 2900PLN Gross. For 2500 you can rent cool flat in £odź, as it's one of the cheapest big cities in Poland. See here:

gumtree.pl/fp-domy-i-mieszkania-do-wynajecia/lodzkie/c9008l3200004

2900 gross is 2087 net according to kalkulatorbruttonetto.pl

With this salary you can afford to eat and drink in the city, because Bar Mleczny prices start from 3eur per lunch and beer prices starts from 1.2eur in pubs :) No luxuries here though. What you'll probably not afford is to save and travel abroad.

numbeo.com/cost-of-living/compare_cities.jsp?country1=Netherlands&country2=Poland
smurf 39 | 1,981
16 Jul 2013 #3
(2900PLN Gross)

That's only 1000zl more than minimum wage (Tesco shelf-stacker type of job).
You'll really struggle on that type of money.
You'll live, but you won't enjoy living here on it.

You'd want at least double what they're offering.

They're planning to give you back 2500zl for the first quarter of every year you rent?
So, you'll prob spend around 800-1000zl per month on rent and so after a year you'll have spent 12,000 and they'll give you back 2,500?

How generous of them!
Tell them to stick the job offer where the sun don't shine. They're trying to rip you off.
Monitor 14 | 1,820
16 Jul 2013 #4
They're planning to give you back 2500zl for the first quarter of every year you rent?

oh, I missed that. Ask them for at least 1000net more then if you're ok with living in studio (average price of 35 - 50 m2 in £ódź is 1188pln)

You could also accept this offer If you're working for charity and money are not the most important.
OP DedeBR
16 Jul 2013 #5
Well, I understood that they would pay me 2500PLN every month for a quarter of a year (so 10 000PLN a year). Wouldn't that be a bit better? And ofc, the other option would be living in one of the companies flats and paying 300PLN every month.

and it is definitely not for charitiy. the position would be Senior Process Executive (Starszy Księgowy)
Monitor 14 | 1,820
16 Jul 2013 #6
How much do you earn in Netherlands (net), that you're considering this offer?
OP DedeBR
16 Jul 2013 #7
€ 396/monthly, but it is a part-time job (11 hours/weekly) and no chance to get promoted for full-time job...
Monitor 14 | 1,820
16 Jul 2013 #8
10 000 per year is 833 per month + 2087 net basic salary = 2,920 net = 4100 gross
And according to Hayes report median gross salary for the accountant in poorest reviewed Voivodeships in Śląskie and Pomorskie equals to 3500 and 4000 respectively:
in hays.pl/prd_consump/groups/hays_common/documents/digitalasset/hays_465124.pdf (page 7)
Independent accountant is 5500.

They don't write anything about £ódzkie Voivodeship, but it should be very similar amount i think.

And you apply for senior position with Dutch language, so I think that you can easily demand 1000 more including this bonus.
OP DedeBR
16 Jul 2013 #9
Got it. In those 2900PLN are already included a bonus of 400PLN for the language, but I believe I will ask about the possibilities of having 1000 or at least 500 more.

Thanks for your help anyways :)
smurf 39 | 1,981
16 Jul 2013 #10
every month

Ah OK, sorry I didn't realise that.

So lets say, worse case your rent i s 12000 per year (but will prob be cheaper) they'll pay 10,000zl, now it's looking much better.

You're pretty much rent free!
That would make a huge difference.

Still though be careful, go through the contract with a fine tooth comb and insist they you're given it in Polish and Dutch (or at least English - so you can get it cheaply translated into Dutch)

If.....and only if you're living where you're rent will be reimbursed, then you'll enjoy living here a bit more. However, you won't save much 2900 isn't a great monthly salary.

According to 2010 figures, the average salary in Poland is around 3400zl. But it depends on where you live. In Warsaw it would be higher (4800). In fact the highest is in the south in Katowice (around 5000zl)

So as you can see 2900zl isn't wonderful, even if they do pay your rent. It's not minimum wage, but it's still well below the average.

If I was you I'd demand more.
Monitor 14 | 1,820
16 Jul 2013 #11
But the average for Poland, which you quoted is gross and his salary is net. proper comparison would be 3500 (Poland gross 2013) vs 4100 (DedeBR gross). But it's worth to relate it with average Warsaw salary which is 6000 gross this year.
OP DedeBR
16 Jul 2013 #12
If I was you I'd demand more.

I see. Well, I've never demanded/asked to increase the salary a bit, however there is a first time for everything I believe. And I am just a bit hesitant coz you never know whether they perceive this as a bad/not nice gesture/action. I could argue that it is below average though.
smurf 39 | 1,981
16 Jul 2013 #13
I wouldn't worry too much about it.
I know from doing interviews here that they always offer the lowest they can at first.

Just tell them you've been doing some research on wages in £odz and you believe that for your position you should be earning more.

The worst that can happen is they say no....and if that happens you'll have avoided working for a low paying job.

I could be wrong here, but if they are hiring you for your Dutch skills then you're in control?
I can't imagine that there are many Dutch speakers living in £odz, looks to me like they need you more than you need them.

Don't be shy about asking for more money from an employer, you're the one that's going to be doing the actual job, not them.
OP DedeBR
16 Jul 2013 #14
Thanks smurf.

as a matter of fact i will have to use Dutch as well as Spanish, so maybe I could use that in my advantage.

Thanks again and I will keep u guys updated!
pam
16 Jul 2013 #15
reimbursement of the flat rent up to 2500 PLN monthly (incl. rental cost and owner rental fee) for the first quarter of each employment year.

Apologies if I'm wrong, but how I would read this is that the company would pay the 1st quarters rent of UP TO 2500 pln. 2500 pln being maximum amount they would pay for your accommodation. If you rent somewhere for e.g 1500 pln, would this be the maximum amount they would pay? In other words, they would pay whatever cost your rent is for the 1st 3 months providing you don't rent anywhere that costs over 2500 pln.It doesn't actually specify that if you rent somewhere cheaper, they will make up the difference to 2500 pln a month. Check everything first.
OP DedeBR
16 Jul 2013 #16
Pam,

I believe you are right. Since it is up to 2500pln, I believe they would not pay the differente between, for example, 1500pln and 2500pln....

but I will check everything b4 having the final word
DedeBR 2 | 14
22 Jul 2013 #17
Hi again, guys!

I've talked to the person who offered me the job position and they said that based on my experience and position they can only offer me 3200pln (gross). I believe I'll accept it. It is gonna be a new experience for me. Although part of me is scared (especially because I am leaving from my comfort zone), I think it is gonna be worth for my international career. Besides, Polish people seem to be friendly in general :)
Kass
22 Jul 2013 #19
Wow all the best hope it works out for you :)
Monitor 14 | 1,820
22 Jul 2013 #20
Wish you well. keep us updated :) £ódź can scare you. It's very neglected place. It has beautiful architecture in the center, but over 50% of building cry for renovation. Similar with roads. And it's full of commiblocks anywhere out of center. The most famous saying about £ódź is from Polish comedy: "£ódź kurwa"

youtube.com/watch?v=IJ2kvZpJ_BU
and it describes the character of the city very well.

Check this article to get to know £ódź a little bit:
wikitravel.org/en/%C5%81%C3%B3d%C5%BA
DominicB - | 2,709
22 Jul 2013 #21
It has beautiful architecture in the center, but over 50% of building cry for renovation.

More like over 95%. Even in Wrocław, more than 80% of the prewar architecture is neglected and needs major attention.

£ódź does have a lot of fine art-deco buildings, most, unfortunately, dilapidated. However, if you read up on art-deco in £ódź, you'll appreciate the city more for what it once was. I used to like visiting my friend in Bałuty. The view from his balcony was interesting: the surrounding buildings were shored up with telephone poles. Here's a picture:

nieznana-epoka.com/s/cc_images/cache_3714080504.jpg?t=1354681607

However, it had a certain charm, like a de Chirico painting. Created a eerie atmosphere in the early morning when I would go out to drink my coffee.
Monitor 14 | 1,820
22 Jul 2013 #22
link script of this forum is broken
jon357 67 | 17,512
22 Jul 2013 #23
More like over 95%. Even in Wrocław, more than 80% of the prewar architecture is neglected and needs major attention.

That's part of the charm in £ódź. If all the buildings were freshly painted with those bloody awful plastic windows that are popular in PL, £ódź would lose a lot of its charm.

However, it had a certain charm, like a de Chirico painting. Created a eerie atmosphere in the early morning when I would go out to drink my coffee.

There's something wonderful about the place. De Chirico is a perfect analogy. Also the feeling that you're in the westernmost city of the old Russian Empire with all the faded elegance of something that's mostly now lost.
DedeBR 2 | 14
22 Jul 2013 #24
wish you the best :)

Wow all the best hope it works out for you :)

thank u guys!

"£ódź kurwa"

Kurwa means, slut, right? =D and yes, I will keep u guys updated. I just need to find a good website where I can search for rooms/flats/studio to rent.

nieznana-epoka.com/s/cc_images/cache_3714080504.jpg?t=1354 681607

This picture reminds me of some parts in Tbilisi, Georgia. But for me was very very ok. I am so flexible that I will hardly get shocked with something like that.

Btw, I am also an English teacher. Is it possible to find students who want to have private lessons? Or also schools where I could teach?
Monitor 14 | 1,820
22 Jul 2013 #25
online you can rent something through:

9flats.com
airbnb.com

or Polish:

lokalo.pl

When you search there for flat/room to rent for whole month, then prices are cheaper.
When you come to Lodz you can rent personally with gumtree.pl/fp-domy-i-mieszkania-do-wynajecia/lodzkie/c9008l3200004
DedeBR 2 | 14
22 Jul 2013 #26
Thanks, Monitor, I will take a look

I really appreciate it.
Maryus - | 5
14 Aug 2014 #27
Merged: 2700 PLN net enough to survive in Lodz?

Hello all,

I have received an offer of employment from a company in Lodz. My question to all of you is:

Are 2700 PLN net enough to survive in Lodz, if the company provides you with a place to stay?

Thank you.
Ziemowit 13 | 4,480
14 Aug 2014 #28
It is even more than enough to survive if the company provides you with a place to stay. But I would advise you to buy your own beer.
Maryus - | 5
14 Aug 2014 #29
Thanks Ziemowit. I only trust myself when I'm buying beer :)
smurf 39 | 1,981
14 Aug 2014 #30
Are 2700 PLN net enough to survive in Lodz

As above: It's only 1000zl more than minimum wage.
I don't particularly drive much, mostly 20-30min journeys to and from work 5 days and week and shopping on weekends etc. and my diesel is roughly 500zl per month...add a phone bill of 250zl to that and you're left with 250zl from that extra 1000zl.

Naw, buddy, the money they are offering is an insult.

You'll live, but you won't save much and you won't be able to treat yourself from time to time.
Tell them you want 4200 + rent and if they offer 3700 take it.


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