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31 year old Polish man causes accident under influence of alcohol and kills 8


mafketis 17 | 6,902
7 Mar 2018  #181
No one denied the post is about a drunk lorry driver. No one defended him.

Agenda, agenda, agenda.

His new kick is trying to make Poles feel collective guilt (so that can be tied to WWII and reparations to a certain group unhappy at a recent law)

Agenda, agenda, agenda.
jon357 64 | 14,382
7 Mar 2018  #182
Poles feel collective guilt

Why would anyone feel 'collective guilt' about something as trivial as nationality? I don't feel guilty about the Ripper, and a Pole shouldn't feel guilty about drunken Polish lorry drivers.

I think there should be some tests both for British drivers entering Europe and the other way round.

For lorry drivers, yes, certainly there should be.

The difference between driving standards in Europe (for example, the low standards in Poland as evidenced by acciudent stats) is certainly a cross-border issue that needs resolving.
SigSauer 4 | 443
7 Mar 2018  #183
Agree no one should feel a collective guilt for anything they haven't done personally. However, nationality (like borders) is very real. If its not, destroy your UK passport, get hold of a Phillipino or Bangladeshi passport, and try to apply to some of those contracts you've been working with one of those. Probably end up cleaning the toilets, even with a PhD.
jon357 64 | 14,382
7 Mar 2018  #184
Don't confuse nationality with citizenship; they are very different things.
mafketis 17 | 6,902
7 Mar 2018  #185
In American usage 'nationality' tends to refer to citizenship and a phrase like "a French national" means someone with French citizenship (not necessarily from native stock)
Ziemowit 12 | 3,390
7 Mar 2018  #186
'nationality'

Agreed, this is not only American usage, but Western European also. In Poland, however, nationality and citizenship are meant separately. The term 'nationality' in Poland and Eastern Europe is roughly what 'ethnicity' is in the so-called "rotten" West.

I may be wrong, but in the old type of identity card (the one in the form of a booklet), people were assigned their declared nationality, despite the booklet itself being proof of Polish citizenship.
Chemikiem 5 | 1,596
23 Mar 2018  #187
Sentencing hasn't happened yet. presumably it will be a hefty one. The same for the other guy if he is found guilty.

Pretty much. Masierak got 14 years, and the FedEx driver, Wagstaff, got 3 years and 4 months:

dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5536481/Lorry-drivers-jailed-pile-killed-eight-people.html
Ironside 47 | 9,574
24 Mar 2018  #188
hmm basically a foreigner has been punished four time harsher.
jon357 64 | 14,382
24 Mar 2018  #189
No, I-S, the cases were separate, the evidence not the same, and both were sentenced under the same set of guidelines. Nationality has nothing to do with it.
Ironside 47 | 9,574
24 Mar 2018  #190
If you say so. I mean using you own yard stick that seems to be inequality there so injustices is implied.
I get it. A White male cannot be a victim of oppression, not on your victim list anyhow.

I mean if that would have happened in Poland and there would be a Jew or a Arab in his stead. You wouldn't hastate to scream foul about anti-Semitism or racism. Plus some innuendos.
jon357 64 | 14,382
24 Mar 2018  #191
you own yard stick

The law. Sentencing follows the crimes people are guilty of within a very prescribed framework

I mean if that would have happened

If, if, if....
An entire family were killed, the evidence was presented in court, those guilty were sentenced according to the severity of their crimes.
Chemikiem 5 | 1,596
24 Mar 2018  #192
basically a foreigner has been punished four time harsher.

That has nothing to do with his nationality. Maseriak was charged with 8 counts of causing death by dangerous driving and 4 of injury by dangerous driving. That offence currently carries a 14 year sentence,with plans to increase it to life. In his case the maximum sentence was applied. Wagstaff was charged with 8 counts of causing death by careless driving and 4 of injury by careless driving. This is a less serious offence, hence the difference in sentencing.
Ironside 47 | 9,574
24 Mar 2018  #193
That has nothing to do with his nationality

I never claimed that it does. It was only a simple observation.
peterweg 36 | 2,315
24 Mar 2018  #194
"Polish national Masierak, of Evesham, Worcestershire, had been stationary in the slow line for more than 12 minutes, despite miles of hard shoulder being available to him.

At trial, it emerged he did not have a professional licence after it was revoked by the authorities for multiple driving offences including speeding in his HGV, driving his lorry in the fast lane, running a red light and ignoring driving hours limits.

The court heard that Masierak had been driving erratically for more than two hours before the accident, including driving the wrong way around a major roundabout, driving the wrong way down a motorway slip way and then turning on the slip way to retrace his path.

Multiple witnesses reported beeping or flashing their lights at Masierak while he was stationary on the M1, which he ignored, indicating he was either asleep or unconscious at the time.

Cider cans were found in the cab of his lorry, suggesting that he had been drinking while at the wheel.

Judge Francis Sheridan said to Maseriak: "What you have tried to do is blame everyone and everybody except yourself.

"In short, you are a persistent, unmitigated, if not very accomplished, liar."

He said he had shown "no remorse" and that there was "no mitigation" in his case."Masierak had described himself to the jury as a "careful driver" and claimed he had attempted to pull over onto the hard shoulder as he felt unwell, but passed out and could not remember anything.

The court heard that he had not told his employers AIM of any of his previous driving convictions.

He denied he was drunk, claiming the cider cans had been left by a previous driver even though they had his finger prints on them.
jon357 64 | 14,382
24 Mar 2018  #195
Cider cans were found in the cab of his lorry, suggesting that he had been drinking while at the wheel.

I'm surprised he didn't get much longer since the situation is that bad. Was he charged for driving a lorry without a licence?

What you have tried to do is blame everyone and everybody except yourself.

Certainly not unknown in Poland to blame other everyone other than oneself. I wonder if he voted PiS, (when he was still able to vote).
peterweg 36 | 2,315
25 Mar 2018  #196
I wonder if he voted PiS,

Really? You have to stoop that low to slag off PiS?
Ironside 47 | 9,574
25 Mar 2018  #197
If, if, if....

So you admit that you would. Thank you.

to blame other everyone other than onesel

must be a commie mentality. You would know something about it wouldn't you?
jon357 64 | 14,382
25 Mar 2018  #198
So you admit that you would.

Looks like you've intentionally misread that one. The facts are plain, the trial conducted scrupulously, and the perpetrators jailed with sentences proportionate to their crimes.


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