The slow, whiny death of British Christianity

The church of England was created, due to one mans desire of another.So it is quite strange that it has lasted so long.

Skysoulmate, those people are mean,selfish and stupid because they have no moral backbone. If you are a parent it is your duty to prepare your child for the future. Most parents fail because they believe it is down to the education system.

The problem I have with religion is that it tells you what to believe. Just look at abortion. We can make informed choices without being told so directly.

Morality is a byproduct of religion?

Morality is undoubtedly connected. Just look at the Ten Commandments and all those proverbs.

Those commandments
bible.oremus.org/?passage=exodus+20:2-20:17&version=nrsvae
are a really messed up basis for morality...
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Golden_Rule

Well, they are moral pronouncements but things go beyond that in this day and age. For their time, they were useful and still are to a certain extent. Still, strict adherence isn't always realistic. What about those that are not poor of their own accord and must steal to put food on their family? (to quote a Bushism, lol, to feed their family).

Unfortunately, you're at least two of the things on that list. Brainwashed from youth, as that's a demand of the Church, starting with baptism. Not your fault, but undeniable nevertheless. And ignorant by wilfully refusing to acknowledge reason, as you put in your post. Crazy, I can't comment on, but I do feel it's a sickness to refuse to admit you have some sort of problem. Religion is like a self-imposed schizophrenia; you actually want your brain to see fantasies and illusions that aren't there at all.

Believe what you like, but please don't delude yourself with the statement I have quoted above. You have chosen to switch off a significant part of your brain: that area responsible for logic and rationality. Which is a real shame.


I'm not sure we're thinking on the same lines. I meant that the new generation of Britons will grow up thinking rationally, based on logic, evidence and reason, rather than actually changing the minds of the presently religious (which is impossible, due to their sickness.) But are you suggesting the Rational Generation will be suffocated by immigrants with their own religions? Maybe you're right.


How utterly ridiculous; possibly the most foolish thing I've read in a while. The sheer inanity of the statement demands a flood of vitriolic explanation as to just how staggeringly stupid that comment is, but it will have to wait while I cut some common sense into small enough pieces for your feeble mind to digest.


George Carlin commented on this much better than I could
youtube.com/watch?v=YzEs2nj7iZM

I'm sure we have our agreements sometimes?


What else do you expect then? The top seven baby boys' names recently were Mohamed, Adam, Rayan, Ayoub, Mehdi, Amine and Hamza. (Sorry, but that's reality for you.)

;)

Certain people would love to see an implosion from within. By renouncing, and indeed denouncing our Christianity, we are just making the job of Islamic elements that bit easier. Britain, over the years, has allied itself closely with Arabic powers. It is more distant towards Israel than the US. There is also evidence that it colluded with Saudi Arabia on 9/11. They are digging their own grave and the people need to question it is what stickers they are wearing.

Are you sure about that? Look at all the people in this video, (which starts at 40 seconds). This is a Christian concert and all of those people made the decision to follow Christ. It sounds like the churches are different in the U.S. ? Don't they have things like this overseas?

youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=yymHIYyqcKY

...
This is an interesting movie about this topic. I recommend u watch it.

those are probably called megachurches, a fairly new phenomena in the US.

In my opinion religion serves some basic human needs: sense of belonging, sense of hope, need for having sense in life, the need for guidance, and finally, religion is a large degree a tool of social control. All those things are needed within the society, otherwise there would be a total chaos.

For those who are interested, the sociology of religion is something to look into.

Seems like a couple more people like the other guys...

youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=izK5MdjbWkk

I'm convinced some people have lost their minds completely. I mean, even the silent majority of Arabians hates Islam and never asked for it, but some people here believe that they have to respect religious oppression. I'm sorry, but I don't see how I am racist for pointing out the obvious. I'm speaking up for our freedom, and of course I'm worried about the future.


Nonsense. Renouncing Christianity has nothing to do with our immigration policies. Can you please explain to me why any Atheist or Agnost would like to invite the most intolerant religion of the world to his or her country? I'm sorry, but I don't think your comment makes any sense.

:S

Which one would that be? Just being curious.

good point, religion has not vanished, the Gods changed.

Yes.


3000 people. I think there are about 310.006.372 Americans.


Do you even hear what he says? He says: ''Let's pray; Lord Jesus, I know I'm a sinner.'' Oh really? Since when did you know? Who told you?


No, they don't. They organise art expositions in most churches around here. They even have banners on some churches, which read: ''God still believes in you.'' I think this describes the state of our churches perfectly. I also have a video for you to watch:

youtu.be/2b01yvOlXn8

You can ask M-G or any other Dutch person about these guys if you don't believe me or think I'm overexaggarating. Okay? You can see about 300.000 people here, attending a concert for the first Dutch hardcore-rap group ever, which actively spread the message of the new generation. They've opposed Christianity for almost two decades. These guys are living legends, and have influenced and inspired whole generations. You can ask any Dutch person around thirty or younger how they feel about organised religion, and about 95% of them will tell you it has no place in their lives anymore.


My condolences.


In my opinion it surpresses some basic human needs. It condemns sexual desires and stigmatizes people who happen to have a mind of their own.


We don't need your control. We have laws. We don't need your guidance, because we're adults who can think for themselves. We don't need your hope, because we aren't afraid of your non-existing Boogieman. We belong in our country, and we all share the same blood.


Oh really? Care to explain why our generation is the least violent of all generations before us? Care to explain why our generation is the least criminal of all generations before us? Of course I'm talking about the indigenous Dutch population there, not the immigrants from religious countries who are making a mess of our society, not even mentioning how many of them like to rape and assault young girls. Yeah, religion is really necessary here. We really need it.


I guess I'll politely decline.

:)

We all know this, which is the point to the thread but to say that Christianity is a dying thing is not realistic. It's probably like that in some countries but not in the U.S. The stadium in California has 45,000 seats, and people in the parking lot watching on a screen who couldn't get in. That's just one night in one small part of the world.


No one is denying that there are a lot of people who don't follow religion. We all know that. It exists in the U.S., too, but Christianity is alive and well in the world regardless. Otherwise, all the churches, mega churches, and Christian concerts would not have thousands upon thousands of people in them on a regular basis. (some churches have several services per day on Sundays because there are so many people)

If Xianity is dying in the UK its because people who dont believe in God, just dont go, unlike in Poland, where people go out of some duty but really have better things to do. Take those out of the church in Poland who really dont want to be there, and you will find very low congregations.

why, I am not in the US, Canada does not have such newborn wave of religion, we pray in nature:)


no, it does not. It is still your choice to manage your sexual desires or think on your own.
With consequences of course that you might be not accepted in certain circles or you are breaking the rules of conduct of a particular group, but this is something you need to make peace with.


my control? I am not trying to control anybody. I am just making an educated observation that religion can be a tool to control the society.


I was speaking in general terms Arien:), not about what I believe. If you are an adult, you make your choices and there is no need to feel pressured by any religious groups.

I was merely speaking in general terms about what I have learnt about the role of religion in a society, but I think that my point of view is not emotional enough for you at the moment. As for rapes, they have nothing to do with religion (mind you Christians raped many non- CHristian women during the colonial times), but with the inferior position assumed by some males who rape women. Rape is all about regaining control, nothing to do with religion.


fair enough. I like the rational approach :).

A J, let me explain. It was drawn to my attention last night in a credible article from The Guardian. The previous census data from 2001 had the belief rate in Scotland at 67%. I took part in the 1991 one (as a gatherer) so I know it's every 10 years. Therefore, we don't have a reasonably accurate statistical figure from a census so we have to make do with other methods. However, an extensive study came to the conclusion that it was 53% and with many not practising in 2009. The point is, it's dwindling. They have closed many Sunday schools and many claim to be disillusioned with religion. Plus, the rat race has been accelerated due to the influx of new 2004 EU members. Other factors have meant that people are working harder to keep their jobs. When I used the word 'renouncing', I meant that they are not practising their faith in churches. Some do indeed abandon their faith completely.

My point was simply this. If we continue down this path of moving away from the Christian faith, and Islamicisation continue unabated, the predictions of sociologists from demographic analyses of 2050 will be taken back even closer. It's not a question of inviting either, A J. They have the right to come and freedom of religion is sth that Obama and likely Cameron will do. No offence, but you live in Holland and not the UK. The War on Terror totally stirred the hornets nest and Islamists really came out of the caves if you forgive the pun. They breed like rabbits and their faith is not one where you can be half-hearted. Pick a country in Europe and you will likely see a vast disparity between those that label themselves and those that actually practise. Look no further than Poland. 95% by label and not even 60% practise. It just isn't that way with Muslims who are far more devoted to their faith. It's a way of life for most.

Now tell me my comment doesn't make sense ;) ;)

Politicians are stirring things up. Islam is the constant, we are the variable. I'm glad that France took a stand on the niqab/burka. I'm also worried about the future but the ball is in our court as to maintaining our faith.

Very nicely articulated Seanus. The irony to me is this: Those who fully indulge in the freedoms tolerated generally by the people of Christian faith are those who will be most adversely affected by the culture shift! The secular/feminist/homosexual-type ideologies will truly miss the days when they could revel in their pretend oppression and taunt the Christians..... Shortly before they are beheaded.

LOL, succinctly put :) :) At least with Christians there is an incremental process at work. And why not? It gives people sth to chip away at and strive towards. Most positive changes don't happen overnight. They are the culmination of a lot of perseverance and moving from step to step. Good luck in getting off of home base with some of the Islamists we see on the go ;) ;) Like it or not, it's Us Vs Them on the macro scale. On a micro scale, there are those Muslims that I've gotten along with but we have to accept that you are guilty by association in some places.

Gotcha, only Christians can oppose repressive religion ideology? How does Christianity on the decline = triumph of Islam? Do you realize that the there is a reason that secularists want to split religion from government? It's not your religion, it's all religion. They change.

And if anyone does take it upon themselves to attempt to impose their religious will on me, I will react. Right now it's with my mouth and my vote, who knows, maybe later with a gun.

Secularist societies FTW!

Christianity is not dying, and won't...This is the fervent wish of atheists, haters of God and others on the Forum...But don't hold your breath waiting because of what some smarmy British atheist tells you...Remember the old saw: 'There are no atheists in foxholes'...And when you go down into your own personal foxhole, you will understand the truth of this...If your belly is full, you have some 'jingle' in your pocket, and the cable TV works, who needs God, right?...Maybe you have some books by French post-modernists or deconstructionists, too...Good luck, baby.

It's maybe not dying, no, but waning in popularity according to the stats, Joe.

When is the last time some Christians beat you up for being a fag? Christians seek not to impose anything on you my good man. My point is that your kind has flourished under the tolerance of a Christian majority. I'm not too worried about you taking arms against me. You neither own nor can buy a weapon most likely. :)


No it most certainly is not, maybe in Europe but not worldwide. Christianity is being accepted at incredible rates amongst the Chinese and lower castes of India. Even "Best Korea" has seen exponential growth. There is a great hunger in the world for the freedom that Jesus provides.

Yup, you've got it all figured out. Anyway, keep following those voices in your head.


Or that whole promise of an afterlife that will be amazing compared to this terrible one. People need something to believe in I guess, that's as good a fantasy as any.

I'll take my flying spaghetti monster over your nothing any day.

Hey, do me a favor and explain the logic behind your belief that there was nothing and then something happened to nothing and now we have everything. I must be mentally deficient to not see how perfectly logical that is. Could you tell me how a artic hare realized that it was brown during the winter and assessed the risk, formulated the solution, and by shear will changed its color to white? Call me crazy, but I'm seeing some design here. Unless I'm badly mistaken.

Sure, if you want to leave it at that. Not knowing why it happened is a bit different than accepting a vague answer along with a stack of dogma that affects different areas of thought not even related to the initial question of "where did it all come from"?

Why not just leave a question mark there and explore it when you've got time?