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Scots better than Poles?


Polonius3 1,000 | 12,449
8 Jun 2013  #1
A few years back a Scots (Scottish -- which term is preferable?) journalist remarked that tiny Scotland had contribtued more to world civilisation (personalities, inventions, literature, culture, etc.) than a big country such as Poland. If you agree with that statemennt, why do you think that's the case? If not, why not?
rozumiemnic 8 | 3,660
8 Jun 2013  #2
interesting question tho polonius, many if not most of the so called "British" inventors were Scottish, Logie Baird, Robert Stevenson, Alexander Fleming..et etc repeat til fade ...have often wondered why this is so...possibly the Protestant work ethic, possibly the decision not to prioritise their language politically (unlike the Welsh for example).....

I am sure someone else might have some suggestions....
OP Polonius3 1,000 | 12,449
8 Jun 2013  #3
Good point! Could geography have also played some role? Using English and hanging on to Britain's coat-tails as it were. I mean if Scotland neighboured Nicaragua or was an island in the Atlatnic, would they have fared as well?

And what about Poland? What would account for the Poles' comparatively poor showing?.
delphiandomine 83 | 17,531
8 Jun 2013  #4
I am sure someone else might have some suggestions....

I have none :(

Could it be that Scotland always had education as a priority? It's a often repeated tale that at one point, Aberdeen had the same amount of universities as England had - and it's no secret that Scotland was really pushing education before many other countries.

And what about Poland? What would account for the Poles' comparatively poor showing?.

Nothing much - the country didn't exist when many inventions were taking place, then the II RP was far more interested in the military than civilian ideas. No point even talking about the PRL.

I suspect that this generation may really break through - many Polish people are starting to achieve recognition for their efforts abroad, for instance.
rozumiemnic 8 | 3,660
8 Jun 2013  #5
Wasn't a large chunk of Poland's intellegencja killed off or exiled?
Marek11111 9 | 816
8 Jun 2013  #6
history around the world by majority is written by Anglo-Saxon disregarding to all other cultures and do not forget who wrote the history books.
ifor bach 11 | 152
8 Jun 2013  #8
Are turnips better than cabbages? I've oftrn pondered this question.
OP Polonius3 1,000 | 12,449
8 Jun 2013  #9
But neither was Scotland and independent country. It was under English rule for centuries.
Paulina 9 | 1,448
8 Jun 2013  #10
(personalities, inventions, literature, culture, etc.)

Maybe it's true about inventions (I honestly don't know, I don't know which inventors were Scottish and what they invented), but personalities, literature, culture?

As for literature - we live in a world where English is a lingua franca, so I guess that could be a reason?
The only Scottish writer that comes to my mind at the moment is Walter Scott.
What did the Scottish people contribute to the world culture beside him? (sorry, I don't want to be rude or petty, I simply don't know much about the Scottish contribution).
gregy741 4 | 1,204
8 Jun 2013  #11
scottish culture...lol
they dont even have their own language,speaking English after 800 years of being under their rule.they woke up after watching "braveheart"movie...lol

surely you meant vomiting in krakow square as Scottish culture,i cant think of anything else
Paulina 9 | 1,448
8 Jun 2013  #12
There's no need to be rude, gregy741.

Polonius3, honestly, I do wonder sometimes why do you create such threads?
dtaylor5632 18 | 2,007
8 Jun 2013  #13
Just a wee list of some: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scottish_inventions_and_discoveries
ifor bach 11 | 152
8 Jun 2013  #14
I don't really regard Gaelic as being the 'Scottish' language, any more than either Scots or Brythoneg.
OP Polonius3 1,000 | 12,449
8 Jun 2013  #15
Imrpessive list. If you're a Scotsman you've indeed got a lot to be proud of.

Besides the partitions and the destruction of the intelligentsia under both the Nazis and Soviets, perhaps one reason was also hte lopsided nature of Polish society with hardly a native burgher (middle) class, the towns being dominated by Germans and Jews. There was a 10% noble class and the rest, maybe 85% were peasant farmers or way back even serfs. They tilled the soil but did not go to school or read, let alone write books. And of course there was the geograophic situation between two mortal enemies with others (Swedes, Cossacks, Bohemians, Muscovites, Mongolians and others) taking turns to make life miserable. The harsh northern climate was also less conducive to creativity, although Scotland isn't exactly the Mediterranean.
Grzegorz_ 51 | 6,163
8 Jun 2013  #16
tiny Scotland had contribtued more to world civilisation (personalities, inventions, literature, culture, etc.) than a big country such as Poland.

LOL ! I really wonder what point he was trying to make. There were really a lot of famous Scots but, what makes it even more interesting, nearly all of them were people living in 18th/19th century -> the times of colonial expansion and industrial revolution, when pink people where at the peak of their influence and Scots being part of that world, made use of the rich opportunities. Before that period who's the most famous Scotish (?) person ? William Wallace... ? In modern times Scotland has became rather 2nd rate area even inside of GB, so If anything, this perfectly shows how quickly countries gain and lose their power.
rozumiemnic 8 | 3,660
8 Jun 2013  #17
In modern times Scotland has became rather 2nd rate area even inside of GB

l
don't underestimate the Jocks they are (often) the ruling class and have oil.....
Ironside 47 | 9,538
9 Jun 2013  #18
A few years back a Scots journalist remarked that tiny Scotland had contributed more to world civilization than a big country such as Poland.

What? When Poland was contributing to European history Scots were reaming free with their butts naked.Tell him that Polonous.
Jardinero 1 | 394
9 Jun 2013  #19
Without a shadow of a doubt the Scots have made numerous groundbreaking contributions in all areas of life, science, and politics... for more details I would highly recommend this eye opening book:

How the Scots Invented the Modern World by Arthur Herman amazon.co.uk/How-Scots-Invented-Modern-World/dp/0609606352
Ironside 47 | 9,538
9 Jun 2013  #20
How the Scots Invented the Modern World by Arthur Herman

Hey people! WE know who is to blame now!!!
OP Polonius3 1,000 | 12,449
9 Jun 2013  #21
In view of the above, the amazing thing is that Scotland's population is just over 5 million, hence comparable to that of Slovaklia and Denmark.

The Czech Republic has twice that. So does Portugal, but geography also plays a role. Atlantic access, exploration and colonialism have enabled the Portuguese to spread their lanuage and culture far and wide, whilst landlocked and foreign-occupied Bohemia lacked such opportunities. And maybe also the urge and desire.
delphiandomine 83 | 17,531
9 Jun 2013  #22
But neither was Scotland and independent country. It was under English rule for centuries.

Completely different. Scots had no barriers (at least, after the 18th century) to taking part in the full life of the country, they were in union and not discriminated against, nor subject to abuses. Poles on the other hand were treated differently at different times and were never really fully encouraged.

In modern times Scotland has became rather 2nd rate area even inside of GB

Oh dear. All the economic data shows otherwise.

I don't really regard Gaelic as being the 'Scottish' language, any more than either Scots or Brythoneg.

We have three languages. Neither has any claim to being superior over the other.

perhaps one reason was also hte lopsided nature of Polish society with hardly a native burgher (middle) class

And the lack of universal education. It's a often missed point, but the Communists were the first to introduce free universal State education for all. The Jesuit education in the II RP was certainly of a high standard, but it was also exclusive.
Ironside 47 | 9,538
9 Jun 2013  #23
What? What are even talking about?
szkotja2007 27 | 1,500
9 Jun 2013  #24
If you agree with that statemennt,

Have you got a reference for this ? Just sounds like a wee troll statement without one.
However, any excuse to promote Scotland so......
Impressive list from Mr Taylor yet just touches on the list of famous Scots. Here is a favourite of mine..
James Croll who discovered Ice Ages whilst working as a Janitor. A kind of original "Good Will Hunting".

In modern times Scotland has became rather 2nd rate area even inside of GB

This is entirely intentional by the Westminister Government. (Yes I can provide links etc).

have oil..

....half of Scotlands oil revenues came from overseas last year.
Scotlands expertise in deep sea exploration is being exported around the world - Falklands, Vietnam, Angola, Gulf of Mexico, Alaska, Mauritania etc etc

Scotland, the largest Oil producer in the EU., is the only country in the world to strike oil and become poorer !!

hanging on to Britain's coat-tails as it were

When Scotland gets Independence in 2014, without Scotlands oil revenues will the rest of the UK still be in the G8 ? G20?

history around the world by majority is written by Anglo-Saxon disregarding to all other cultures and do not forget who wrote the history books.

True.
Foreigner4 12 | 1,769
9 Jun 2013  #25
tiny Scotland had contribtued more to world civilisation (personalities, inventions, literature, culture, etc.) than a big country such as Poland.

This ought to be rephrased as "Scottish society has apparently contributed more to world civilization in terms of literature and inventions (culture and personalities? wtf does that mean?) than Polish society.

So what if it's true? So what if it's false?
There's really too much misplaced pride and shame in the deeds of others these days.
There's nothing wrong with promoting a national identity but please find one other than "who's better than us?"
poland_
9 Jun 2013  #26
Could it be that Scotland always had education as a priority?

More to do with the Scottish Enlightenment.

Scots were among the most literate citizens of Europe, with an estimated 75% level of literacy The culture was orientated towards books.
citizen67 6 | 191
9 Jun 2013  #27
Scots better than Poles? Definitely!
poland_
10 Jun 2013  #28
Novelist Iain Banks, who enlivened Scottish literature for three decades with his dark humour, has died from cancer.
Paulina 9 | 1,448
10 Jun 2013  #29
This ought to be rephrased as "Scottish society has apparently contributed more than Polish society.

I was wondering if anyone would comment on this.

That's great that Scotland had inventors and all but I have one problem with this thread: it's title.
There are no "better" and "worse" nations. That's a Nazi-like thinking.
I can imagine what would happen if Polonius3 gave a thread a title like: "Poles better than Jews?" lol

Btw, I didn't know about most of those people on the list and those whom I know - I thought they were English! lol Maybe you guys should somehow promote Scottish achievements? Because people have no idea (I think). All they know about Scotland is Highlands, William Wallace, bagpipes and men in skirts ;)
Grzegorz_ 51 | 6,163
10 Jun 2013  #30
Scots were reaming free with their butts naked.

At some point they invented skirts to cover them.


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