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V4 (Poland) wants Serbia and 5 others in EU



Crow 138 | 5,835    
1 Dec 2016  #31

What was she doing there,

She was in Warsaw to prepare ground for conflict between Poland and Serbia. Absolutely. Sure, on Poland as host of event lay responsible for diplomatic failure to properly mark Kosovo with status neutral markings but you can bet that Federica Mogherini did it. She knew that would our FM Dacic respond to situation and she then calculated reply of Kosovo Albanians (most probably even instructed them). She could then easily calculate that would Serbian FM abandon conference and cut visit to Poland. That Federica. Hm, classical manipulation of one proper k***a.

Now we have what we have. Open and public conflict between official Poland and official Serbia. Still, silent conflict but it is conflict.


dolnoslask 2 | 1,154    
1 Dec 2016  #32

That Federica. Hm,

It would never of happened if Vincent was there moderating the meeting , he would have called order and got them back on topic.
Ironside 44 | 8,301    
1 Dec 2016  #33

Why? Because without annulled Kosovo recognition, Albanian appetites only rising and their dreams about Greater Albania becoming manic obsession

What do I care? That is your problem eh?
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Crow 138 | 5,835    
1 Dec 2016  #34

Why? What is in that for Poland?

what about guaranteed sovereignty of states by UN charters? If Serbia isn`t protected, why would any state have protection. Precedent is made. Everything is possible now, change of every border. Until recognized Kosovo, Poland was protected. Annul of recognition is only option for Poland to opt for legality in international relations. See, there is the direct interest of Poland.
Crow 138 | 5,835    
1 Dec 2016  #35

Why? What is in that for Poland?

how about, in order to prove itself as capable leader?

By annulling its recognition of Kosovo, Poland would prove that represent serious regional power, that promising much. And most importantly, prove that to those countries which potentially can see Poland as leader.
Ironside 44 | 8,301    
1 Dec 2016  #36

what about guaranteed sovereignty of states by UN charters? If Serbia isn`t protected, why would any state have protection.

Who told you that there is any protection for anyone? UN charters lol please.
--------

Until recognized Kosovo, Poland was protected

Not connection here.
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See, there is the direct interest of Poland.

No, I don't see.
---

By annulling its recognition of Kosovo, Poland would prove that represent serious regional power, that promising much. And most importantly, prove that to those countries which potentially can see Poland as leader.

----
Nonsense, you want support for your claim on Kosovo and that is all there is.
Crow 138 | 5,835    
1 Dec 2016  #37

Its not wise to any politician in Poland to betray Serbians. Its bad luck on the long run. Practically, political suicide.

Kornel Morawiecki krytykuje oderwanie Kosowa od Serbii



Kosowo jest serbskie! Pikieta - Kraków 2016



MW Kraków przeciwko rozbiorom Serbii



POLACY W OBRONIE SERBII - Polish support for Serbian brothers



ZAPROSZENIE PRZED AMBASADĘ SERBII


Ironside 44 | 8,301    
1 Dec 2016  #38

Its not wise to any politician in Poland to betray Serbians.

Poland doesn't own you anything. Betray? WTF? We're not even allies.

Sure, people can express their opinion on the issue. I can say that I think that Kosovo should belong to Serbia. Its my opinion. I don't think that Poland should do anything in that regard.
Crow 138 | 5,835    
1 Dec 2016  #39

Seams that those Poles who support Serbia thinks different then you Ironside.
Ironside 44 | 8,301    
1 Dec 2016  #40

They were protesting against something that was about to happen. Right now 99% of Poles doesn't give a flying copulation about Kosovo.
You're confusing two separate issues, opinions of individuals and an official policy of a state.
Crow 138 | 5,835    
1 Dec 2016  #41

Poland doesn't own you anything. Betray? WTF? We're not even allies.

But there were talks about Serbia`s Visegrad membership. I don`t know for perspective of it now.

Not to mention only one word that should be enough for official Poland to support Serbia - Racowie (Serbians in medieval Poland). They triggered Golden Age in Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth. On the other side, Poles were first to support Serbians against Ottoman Turks. So, stubbing Serbians in back is impossible for Poland. Its even immoral. If Poland stub Serbs in the back nobody would ever trust to Poland. At least, for sure not those, who are interesting for Poland`s natural expansion.

I can say that I think that Kosovo should belong to Serbia. Its my opinion. I don't think that Poland should do anything in that regard.

And what about Intermarium? You would like it around Poland? But why would Czechs or Slovaks, even Hungary, believe in Poland, if official Poland fails to support Serbia. See, public opinion about Poland in Czeska and Slovakia strongly depend from Poland`s stance on Serbia, especially in case if official Poland antagonize relations with Serbia. Man, during presidential campaign in Czech Republic, positive stance by candidates on Serbian question is considered as vital for success.

Mark my words, over night, from man of hope, Duda can turn into man of disaster. Not that he won`t initiate Intermarium. He would shaken Visegrad Group.
Ironside 44 | 8,301    
1 Dec 2016  #42

But there were talks about Serbia`s Visegrad membership.

Well, it's up to you. There is no must.
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I don`t know for perspective of it now.

Like what? You're saying that you would join V4 just to start a war to get Kosovo back? You must be crazy if you think that Poland would antagonise half the world and especially USA just to give Kosovo back to Serbia. Not gonna happen.

---

that should be enough for official Poland to support Serbia - Racowie (Serbians in medieval Poland).

You were supported Poland because Poland was the only hope for the Balkan countries to break free from the Ottoman oppression. You were serving your own interest not some favour.

Anyway never heard about official policy of a country aimed at returning favors for alleged services from middle ages. What are you talking about?
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If Poland stub Serbs in the back

What are you talking about? You f... up on your own. Poland had nothing to do with it. You f..it up alone and you never asked Poland for an advice. That is only your problem and Poland has nothing to do with it.

---

And what about Intermarium?

What about that? If countries of the region will see their own interest in building regional alliance then they'll join in. If not ....
Kosovo for Serbia you must be raving mad. Sure Russia would be happy to stir pot there and antagonize Poland with USA. Thank you Serbia - we pass.

--
Crow 138 | 5,835    
1 Dec 2016  #43

Well, it's up to you. There is no must.

but how? Kosovo is part of Serbia by our constitution. It was by force taken from Serbia.

Like what? You're saying that you would join V4 just to start a war to get Kosovo back?

We didn`t start first conflict, we won`t start second. We were attacked. From Albania and from local Kosovo Albanians, national minority that rebelled. Now, we expect another assault because of new phase of attempt for formation of Greater Albania.

You were supported Poland because Poland was the only hope for the Balkan countries to break free from the Ottoman oppression.

Its more like that are Poland and Serbia causally connected. Weak Serbia, weak Poland and vice versa. Behave of 99% of our political elites (and people) throughout history suggest that conclusion.

That is only your problem and Poland has nothing to do with it.

Apples? Take just that example. What about apples? Poland re-export it to Russia. Poland f... up it on its own and now Polish apple producers selling apples to Russia via Serbia. Enormous quantities. Sure, Serbians have interest in it but still, think, that`s what I talking about here all the time.

What about that? If countries of the region will see their own interest in building regional alliance then they'll join in. If not ....

If not, then Poland have only perspective in oblivion. You know that

Kosovo for Serbia you must be raving mad.

See, we won`t give THEM Kosovo. We just won`t.

Sure Russia would be happy to stir pot there and antagonize Poland with USA.

In a blink of an eye USA could sell Poland to Russia. You know it very well, that, too. But, Russia can`t digest Poland and Russia don`t wish Poland. They tried but they got sh**. So, instead to rule Poland, Russia is satisfied to have Poland on its western borders, by logic, better Poland then Magna Germania (ie EU). But Anglos as Anglos insist to fu** Russia using Poland as condom.

Anyway, for Russia`s approval of whole Intermarium (or new Commonwealth) project, Poland needs to convince Russia that Poland isn`t threat to Russia`s interests but rather partner. See, for that, Poland again needs Serbian mediation. Same as in case with apples.

No, no, don`t tell me that Intermarium can come to existence without Russia`s approval. It can`t. No Visegrad country would enter Intermarium around Poland knowing that entering alliance against Russia. Who sane would do that. So, crucial spice in Poland`s `most important soup ever` are Serbians. What to tell you man. Sorry pane ;)

Pane, pane :)
Crow 138 | 5,835    
1 Dec 2016  #44

You must be crazy if you think that Poland would antagonise half the world and especially USA just to give Kosovo back to Serbia

Anyway, I forgot to mention. Kosovo? Not just Kosovo. All Serbian lands in south-eastern Europe must be free and one with Serbia. I mean, that`s what Polish Prince Czartoryski promised to Serbia and Serbians, seeking support for Polish independence and against domination of Russia over other Slavs. I suppose, brat Czartoryski didn`t lied. You know, Polish poet Adam Mickiewicz was also involved in those deals with Serbs.

Yes, yes. All what was by force taken from Serbians should be nicely give back to Serbia. Plus, yes, it was the deal.
Ironside 44 | 8,301    
1 Dec 2016  #45

but how? Kosovo is part of Serbia by our constitution. It was by force taken from Serbia.

Take it back then. What are you waiting for smart ass?
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We didn`t start first conflict, we won`t start second.

Who cares? What are you a kid in a kindergarten?
----

Poland and Serbia causally connected. Weak Serbia, weak Poland and vice versa.

Not really. For the most part of the history Serbia was weak and Poland was strong.
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Poland re-export it to Russia.

Poland doesn't deal in export of apples. Its not Russia, traders are selling them. I think that from those apples in Poland they should make juice and cider - more profit in exporting those than in apples.

----

If not,

Serbians can kiss Russian ass and see where it'll get them. Good luck.
---

See, we won`t give THEM Kosovo. We just won`t.

Kiss it good bye! or think about a long term solution - as I said that it is your problem.
---

In a blink of an eye USA could sell Poland to Russia.

Could would should those are idle speculation. What is Serbia offering instead? where are your countless armies, nuclear weapons?
If Poland would to quit the NATO having what - Putin guarantees instead? The man whose jobs was to lie and deceive? Maybe Serbia who is unable t o take Kosovo back would take on all Russia? WTF? Are you even sane? Are you typing from asylum?

If Russia does as Serbia say - why bother looking for other allies, ask your friends to help you take Kosovo back. what happening they should do it no problem right? Unless you're telling porkies cause you're full of S..t!

Damn storyteller.
As Bill Burr says people are idiots.
---

for Russia`s approval of whole Intermarium

Crow that the whole point. Russia won't approve Intermarium.
---

No Visegrad country would enter Intermarium around Poland knowing that entering alliance against Russia.

You are mistaken that is not alliance gains Russia but Russia being paranoid would think that anyways. As for no other countries interested - speak for yourself.

--

All Serbian lands in south-eastern Europe must be free and one with Serbia.

All the very best to You and good luck. You have my moral support - go for it. Come back when you achieve it.
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Polish Prince Czartoryski promised to Serbia

He is dead. Mickiewicz too. Grab your Ouija board and sort it out between yourself.

You are dumb beyond mortal ken. Unless you're a poet.
Crow 138 | 5,835    
2 Dec 2016  #46

That`s the spirit. Moral support, without doing anything against Serbia? Ok. It is enough for me. You offering much more then official Poland. Thank you.
Crow 138 | 5,835    
2 Dec 2016  #47

While official Poland complicates relations with Serbia, other countries of Visegrad Group seek to establish as better as possible relations with Belgrade. These days Hungary provided a credit line of 61 million eur to finance cooperation between Hungarian and Serbian companies. Business, business, business!- that is main phrase in Serbia and Hungary. After all, economy is everything.

Here is what Hungarian PM Orban says about Serbia >

"Serbia's economy is on a growth trajectory, despite the fact that it isn't a member of the EU", he pointed out.

"The country's growth is still considerable and Hungary supports Serbia's accession to the European Union, which will open up further opportunities", Orbán said, adding that whoever establishes a presence on the Serbian market now will acquire a long-term, dependable business opportunity.

Comment by Serbian PM Vicic >

"over the past two years Serbia has made huge progress, which has also been recognised internationally; we have succeeded in reducing bureaucracy, accelerated the issue of licences and enabled more rapid trading. The Serbian economy is expanding significantly, with 3.5 percent growth planned for next year".

Source: Orbán In Serbia: "Central Europe And The Visegrad Group Will Be Great Success Stories" > visegradpost.com/en/2016/11/25/orban-in-serbia-central-europe-and-the-visegrad-group-will-be-great-success-stories/

v-o

Serbian PM Vucic and Hingarian PM Orban
OP Polonius3 1,019 | 12,555    
4 Feb 2017  #48

[moved from]

Polish and Serbian interest

Poland and Serbia have almost no common interests. That is pure fantasy.
Return to slavic innocnce, you mean like Russia's Cheka and NKVD? Or the Soviet Union which slaughtered and subjugated countless smaller nations?
The Italians, French and Spanish have given the world more culture, concepts and inventions including culinary delicacies than all the Slavic countries combined.
cms 9 | 1,049    
5 Feb 2017  #49

Romanian gdp and living standards have nów comfortably overtaken Serbia thanks to it being in the EU. It has some issues but it is looking forward and not back and I have always found it a good place to do business.

Meanwhile your Serb government won't take the steps needed to give its citizens a better life - too busy painting trains with childish slogans.
dovla    
5 Feb 2017  #50

Meanwhile your Serb government won't take the steps needed to give its citizens a better life - too busy painting trains with childish slogans.

But it is taking all the steps to give SNS party members a better life (SNS = party of the Serbian prime minister/dictator Vucic).

cms, you are fully right. I remember visiting Romania during Ceausescu times. Yugoslavia/Serbia was always a poor country, but nothing like Romania back then. Now Romania is a way ahead. I am glad for Romania. We Serbs have always looked at Romanians as good neighbors and friends.

The main reason why Serbia is in such a deep **** is because all smart people have either left the country or lost any hope that things can change so they don't vote, don't protest, just try to survive. On the other side we have loonies who vote for Vucic. There are two kinds of them: 1) those that swear to Slavdom, Russia, mythical Serbian greatness etc. and 2) those that believe that entering EU will solve all their problems, so all that Serbia needs to do is to please Brussels and get admitted. Pragmatic chameleon Vucic managed to get those two seemingly opposing groups of loonies to vote for him, skillfully balancing between them. EU doesn't mind him being corrupted dictator as long as he is obedient, and he fully is, in spite of some nationalist rhetoric to please the group 1).

I am not following political scene in Poland and Romania, but I guess we are all in similar **** now, with a difference that unlike Serbs Romanians and Poles still have the spine to go to the street and raise their voice.
Crow 138 | 5,835    
5 Feb 2017  #51

Romanian gdp and living standards have nów comfortably overtaken Serbia thanks to it being in the EU.

oh, no, no, no cry for Romanian ways of life. With all due respect. Believe me. We are still Merika for them.

As for our politicians. Morons. But well, what one can expect in a country that is under foreign occupation, subjugated by military force of NATO and ion the process suffered more then 100 mlrd USA dollars damage, in a country where are parts of territory portioned, with neighboring countries that have Nazi or Muslim Wahhabi regimes, in a region where foreign powers regularly urinate when they grab suitable moment, etc, etc. We are all happy to be alive and to note at least some economic progress comparing to previous periods.
Crow 138 | 5,835    
19 May 2017  #52

Merged:

Great business opportunity for Polish meat industry - via Serbia to China - spread the news to all Poles!



Rejoice Poles!

Important, extra class news. Serbia got contract to export meat to China and to Chinese army! Polish producers should contact their Serbian business partners! Point is- Serbia don`t have enough meat and definitely need partners for this, while Chinese knows this and accepting it. Good luck Poles. I hope you make it.

c

Same as Polish apple producers re-export apples to Russia via Serbia, there is now opportunity for Poles to re-export meat to China via Serbia.

In April it was still talk. Its confirmed now in TV news. I would provide new source links.

Meat export: New agreement with China
serbianmonitor.com/en/economy/30764/meat-export-new-agreement-with-china/

Kina zainteresovana da iz Srbije godišnje uveze 500.000 tona goveđeg mesa
bktvnews.com/info/ekonomija/kina-zainteresovana-da-iz-srbije-godisnje-uveze-500-000-tona-govedeg-mesa/105395
Crow 138 | 5,835    
2 Jun 2017  #53

Merged:

Should Poland, same as Russia, openly arise in support of Serbia ?



By all historical means, Serbia proved to be point of balance between Poland and Russia. Strategic point where two greatest Slavic (ie even European) powers don`t clash but have understanding for their spheres of influence. What is interesting, not only that Serbia represent point of balance for Poland and Russia but, represent rare example where Russia accepts and tolerate primate of Poland (considering that Serbians historically tend to achieve closer ties with Poland, when current reality allows it), at the moments when Poland show its willingness to expand Her influence, when She can compete with influences of Germanic, Anglo, Franco and Islamic factors.

What we in last 100-110 years were able to see is that Russia more openly support Serbia, while Poland shows signals that didn`t forget Serbia. Before, earlier in history, we seen times when Serbia represented `Margin of pain` for Poland. Now, what I want to ask you who are willing to discuss this political topic- Should Poland, same as Russia or to say again, openly arise in support of Serbia? Should Poland return to its traditional zone of influence, in Serbia? Is it moment?

We speak not only of signs by Polish public, which already giving great attention to Serbia but, we also speak about official Poland.
Crow 138 | 5,835    
4 Jun 2017  #54

Serbia to become even more important for V4

Something qualitatively change in international relations. Inauguration (at June 23) of new Serbian president elect Aleksandar Vucic, by all announces, would be turned into the summit of world leaders and countries from literally all meridians. As announced, among others, USA and Russia would send their highest ranking officials, what they don`t do usually when comes to inaugurations. First time in history, China sending delegation of Chinese government at one inauguration of president.

You know when I here told that Belgrade represent natural world center, natural seat of UN and EU? When I told you that if EU wants to survive, Brussels goes into past and that Belgrade is coming? See?

This is about world politics naturally starting to gravitate to point of its balance. Either world politics achieve balance, either civilization cease to exist replaced by chaos. So, Belgrade and Serbia, equilibrium between western and eastern Europe, between south and east of the globe. It is expected from Serbia to offer ultimate ground for mediation to the increasingly hostile world threatened by Islamic and other kinds of terrorism.

By its behavior Serbia already shows what is most important for peace in the world. Sovereignty and independence of states.
Crow 138 | 5,835    
20 Sep 2017  #55

[moved from]

well, western European powers collaborated with Islamic league and mujaheedines in order to destroy Yugoslavia and to weaken Serbia. Its just so natural now that Muslim extremists rape allover the western Europe. Its what western European governments did to its own populations, when took Islamic maniacs for ally partners.
Dirk diggler 4 | 1,200    
21 Sep 2017  #56

@Crow

Its a partnership of convenience with globalists

The eifel tower has installed additional security measures. Some kind of barriers to my understanding. I caught the tail end of the news segment as I was walking out the door.

Approx 15k soldiers are now stationed throughout France basically doing police patrol and guard type duties bc of all the Islamic terror attacks. Instead of doing training military operations etc they have to protect French people from Muslim extremists.
CasualObserver    
21 Sep 2017  #57

and to weaken Serbia

So why is Serbia so keen to join an alliance with western European nations, by being in negotiations to join the EU? It will then be subject to freedom of movement and equality laws. Isn't that policy of the current Serb govt? That must stick in your craw.
Crow 138 | 5,835    
22 Sep 2017  #58

So why is Serbia so keen to join an alliance with western European nations, by being in negotiations to join the EU?

when Serbia join EU it would be annexation, not membership. See, all these wars, bombardment with depleted uranium, unleash of Arab mujaheedines and German/Turkish regional satellites on us, political pressure, economic sanctions, trade embargoes, etc molesting for two decades, it all had purpose to force Serbia to accept EU (ie Magna Germania) as reality, that Serbians give up from Slavic conglomerates such was Yugoslavia and such could be Intermarium.

See, this is real EU. All other information that they gave to you, all those lies and anti-Serbian propaganda is just daily politics, a hoax.

It will then be subject to freedom of movement and equality laws. Isn't that policy of the current Serb govt?

Negotiations about membership (ie annexation) is part of theater for masses.

That must stick in your craw.

Not at all. I`m not that crazy. Annexation is better then total destruction. Then, when we Serbians recuperate, we shall continue from within. Like when AH annexed us in Bosnia.
Dirk diggler 4 | 1,200    
22 Sep 2017  #59

@Crow

How does the majority of Serbs feel about EU membership? I know that EU/NATO was very divisive topic in Macedonia.
Crow 138 | 5,835    
22 Sep 2017  #60

We Serbians known that Belgrade goes up, while Brussels goes down, if Serbia ever enters EU. Only that way, it could work, at least for some time. Too much eastern money stays behind Serbs. Truly, too much. Plus, not just eastern. Add to that cultural impact of Serbs on other Slavs.... Central and South-Eastern Europe are already pulled by Belgrade`s gravitational force.

In the meanwhile, ordinary people, don`t know what to think about EU. Some fear of high prices, some fear our economic disaster and slow down, some fear more migrants, some fear final assimilation, very few expect better life

I don`t fear anything in case with EU. Its all how have to be, in this global theater.




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