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British teacher stabbed in Poland


OP jon357 63 | 14,127
27 Dec 2013 #61
From these weird posts, I think any lack of understanding is very much on your part. A Christmas celebration among colleagues does not provoke a third party to stab someone to death.

What part of that don't you understand?
szczecinianin 4 | 345
27 Dec 2013 #62
It is quite a shame that some people have no sympathy for the dead and the wounded.

Kevin writes few posts with great economy of words.

But he's spot on.

There isn't a great deal to discuss here.

Anything beyond what has been written in the newspaper reports is just speculation.

It's a shame one person has been killed and another seriously injured.
Ironside 48 | 9,824
27 Dec 2013 #63
And yes, Warsaw's Praga would be such neighbourhood, I guess, from what I've heard.

Ostobramska do not really (or didn't) class as a bad neighbourhood but there are plenty of blocks of flats, so ...

What do you mean?

I mean that they do not call you people from your region scyzorki for nothing.
Paulina 9 | 1,448
27 Dec 2013 #64
Ty reading the article.

I've read the article and all it says is "stabbed at a Christmas party".

Not that work Christmas parties can't be through December.

?

Well, it doesn't say anything about "a work Christmas party". All it says is "a flat party" (in the Yorkshire Evening Post).

Polish articles were published on the 16th so the attack probably took place on the 15th or earlier.
Also, the Polish articles don't even say anything about "a party". They only say about 5 men drinking and being loud on a staircase.

At first, when I read about that "Christmas party" in the Yorkshire Evening Post I thought it's some kind of a British tradition (is it?). That's why I got curious about the dates.

I mean that they do not call you people from your region scyzorki for nothing.

Well, they call people from Kraków "centusie", and? lol
Liroy popularised this name with his rap song in the 90's :)
But, as I wrote, it's not the 90's anymore, sorry :))
OP jon357 63 | 14,127
27 Dec 2013 #65
stabbed at a Christmas party

Exactly.

Nothing about any provocation to be murdered.

?
Well, it doesn't say anything about "a work Christmas party".

Seasonal parties aren't only the night before Christmas. And it does specifically mention colleagues.

Btw, we don't know that those Polish articles even refer to the same crime. Oś. Ostrobramska is not exactly free from violent crime.
Paulina 9 | 1,448
27 Dec 2013 #66
Nothing about any provocation to be murdered.

Um... I'm not writing about any provocation o_O

Seasonal parties aren't only the night before Christmas. And it does specifically mention colleagues.

Jon357, I am not aware of anything called "seasonal parties" in Poland. If someone is throwing a party on, let's say, the 15th of December, then it's just a party, not a "Christmas party" or a "seasonal party". Christmas time in Poland is from 24 to 26 of December and that's it.

Btw, we don't know that those Polish articles even refer to the same crime.

True, but if they do, then I think calling it a "Christmas party" is probably a bit too much ;)
OP jon357 63 | 14,127
27 Dec 2013 #67
If go by the explanations given in the dictionarie

Life rarely checks the dictionary. Somebody about to burst into a flat and kill someone might, but it would be a first.

If someone is throwing a party on, let's say, the 15th of December, then it's just a party, not a "Christmas party" or a "seasonal party"

Perhaps in your experience. I've been to a seasonal party before then. A work one, for Christmas. In Poland.
INSPE - | 29
27 Dec 2013 #68
Life rarely checks the dictionary.

And you are wrong again, hehe . The written law is based on the meaning given in the dictionaries
You are surprising me very much
Paulina 9 | 1,448
27 Dec 2013 #69
Perhaps in your experience. I've been to a seasonal party before then. A work one, for Christmas. In Poland.

Well, of course I've attended a company's Christmas supper before, but it can't be really called a party, it's more like a Christmas Eve supper and it doesn't take place at someone's flat, but is organised by the company in some hotel and usually not in the middle of December.

Was your seasonal party organised at someone's flat? I'm curious who organised it - Poles or the British/Americans?

And what's the difference between a seasonal party and an ordinary party? Don't hit me, I'm curious ;)

(And don't worry, jon357, I'm not trying to justify the attack or sth :))

The written law is based on the meaning given in the dictionaries

Noone will interpret it in the way that being loud was somehow a provocation and that it somehow justified the attack with the use of knives.
INSPE - | 29
27 Dec 2013 #70
Noone will interpret it in the way that being loud was somehow a provocation and that it somehow justified the attack with the use of knives.

Dou you know who was the first to use the knives ?
OP jon357 63 | 14,127
27 Dec 2013 #71
@Paulina, I don't recall ever seeing a work Christmas supper. Hang on! Once, in mid December organised by a British company. I've been to company parties for the holidays from early December onwards, organised by a Polish company. Over the years in private homes and in hired restaurants. If it was a language school, earlier rather than later is a strong possibility with people being at home in their own country as soon as they can get away after the last lessons before Christmas.

A seasonal party? For Christmas!

Unfortunately this one seems to have been in a very wrong place.

Looking again at the YEP article and those Polish ones, I really do think they could be about different incidents.

Only one glimmer of hope in all this - the stabbed teacher is still alive, which is a good sign. Sad though about the person who died. Sad for the families of those arrested too.
WielkiPolak 58 | 1,034
27 Dec 2013 #72
Funny that the title of the topic says 'British teacher stabbed in Poland,' as if he might have been stabbed because he was British [it doesn't say it, but it suggests it, like saying 'black woman stabbed in Poland']. In the text it talks about a Polish friend of his dying after being stabbed, so it had nothing to do with nationality.
OP jon357 63 | 14,127
27 Dec 2013 #73
I don't know why you think there's anything funny about it. If it had happened in Thailand, France, Alaska they would have said so too.

Being away from home adds extra poignancy from the headline writer's point of view. Do you think they should have pretended it wasn't in Poland?
Paulina 9 | 1,448
27 Dec 2013 #74
Dou you know who was the first to use the knives ?

*sigh*

No, I don't.
My guess is that those who were stabbed weren't even carrying knives in the first place.
But it will be arbitrated by the court that will probably know more than we do, so don't worry.

A seasonal party? For Christmas!

So you're not wearing Santa Claus hats or sth? :) ;)

Looking again at the YEP article and those Polish ones, I really do think they could be about different incidents.

I think it's quite possible they are about the same incident.
If they weren't then there would be articles about the one described in the YEP too.
Are there?

Funny that the title of the topic says 'British teacher stabbed in Poland,' as if he might have been stabbed because he was British

I think you're reading too much into it. It's an expat forum, it's natural they're interested in what happens to their own people.
WielkiPolak 58 | 1,034
27 Dec 2013 #75
I think you're reading too much into it. It's an expat forum, it's natural they're interested in what happens to their own people.

I might be reading a bit too much in to it, it's true, but given some of the anti Polishness from some of these expats, I saw the title expecting it to try and show us that savage Polish people had attacked a poor civil British man, because he was a foreigner [or because he was British].
INSPE - | 29
27 Dec 2013 #76
Only one glimmer of hope in all this - the stabbed teacher is still alive, which is a good sign. Sad though about the person who died. Sad for the families of those arrested too.

And these flat parties are not so innocent as they may seem
I heared that in Sweden they have to get the permission from all the neighbours two weeks before the party. And it shows that they probably had more than enough of such cases

Funny that the title of the topic says 'British teacher stabbed in Poland,' as if he might have been stabbed because he was British [it doesn't say it, but it suggests it, like saying 'black woman stabbed in Poland']. In the text it talks about a Polish friend of his dying after being stabbed, so it had nothing to do with nationality.

Yes, right, I think this is all biased
Paulina 9 | 1,448
27 Dec 2013 #77
I might be reading a bit too much in to it, it's true, but given some of the anti Polishness from some of these expats, I saw the title expecting it to try and show us that savage Polish people had attacked a poor civil British man, because he was a foreigner [or because he was British].

Well, I understand, but it doesn't seem to be the case (or at least I hope it wasn't).
INSPE - | 29
27 Dec 2013 #78
My guess is that those who were stabbed weren't even carrying knives in the first place.

I guess you could also probably guess that they had some at the flat
OP jon357 63 | 14,127
27 Dec 2013 #79
If they weren't then there would be articles about the one described in the YEP too.

Why? The YEP is a provincial newspaper in the UK. It doesn't routinely cover crime stories from the suburbs of foreign cities.

And these flat parties are not so innocent as they may seem

Now that's just silliness. You haven't a clue what this mid-evening Christmas party attended by middle aged teachers was like.

Yes, right, I think this is all biased

Biased how? By mentioning where the crime took place?

So you're not wearing Santa Claus hats or sth?

The colour doesn't suit.

And looking again at the two different articles (shorthairthug posting links to several probably didn't notice or want to notice that they were all from the same press release!) it looks like two very different events.
Paulina 9 | 1,448
27 Dec 2013 #80
but it doesn't seem to be the case (or at least I hope it wasn't).

Just to clarify: I mean I don't think it was jon357's intention.

Why? The YEP is a provincial newspaper in the UK. It doesn't routinely cover crime stories from the suburbs of foreign capitals.

Jon357, I meant Polish newspapers :)) There would be articles in Polish media about a second attack if those were two different incidents.

The colour doesn't suit.

lol OK ;)

it looks like two very different events.

Not really, jon357...
INSPE - | 29
27 Dec 2013 #81
Now that's just silliness.

Yes really it is ... haha .... permission two weeks before the party. How funny... Ask those Sweeds about
it

Biased how? By mentioning where the crime took place?

Ihave already mentioned that the word unprovoked is redundant
(WE DO NOT KNOW WHO WAS THE FIRST TO USE THE KNIVES . IT IS SO SIMPLE, FUNNY TOO)
OP jon357 63 | 14,127
28 Dec 2013 #82
Yes really it is

Not in PL. There the rules are different.

Ihave already mentioned that the word unprovoked is redundant

Your mentioning it does not make it accurate.

WE DO NOT KNOW WHO WAS THE FIRST TO USE THE KNIVES

We do however know who has been arrested.
poland_
30 Dec 2013 #83
There would be articles in Polish media about a second attack if those were two different incidents

It does seem the UK and Polish news are about the same incident. I would be more inclined to believe the Polish news on this one, having said that it does not give people the right to make derogatory comments about a person who is in critical condition in hospital because of their nationality.
OP jon357 63 | 14,127
30 Dec 2013 #84
The problem is that neither is exhaustive. One seeme to be an interview with one of the victims' brother and the other ones are just the same press statement.

The courts in Poland move very slowly indeed so there may not be anything else for a while.
INSPE - | 29
30 Dec 2013 #85
We do however know who has been arrested.

But you do not know that a completed investigation is required and a trial too in such cases ... right ?
Harry
30 Dec 2013 #86
^ As you have already been told, if the men who have been arrested have been arrested without there being reasonable suspicion that they committed the crimes for which they have been arrested, they can sue the police for wrongful arrest.
INSPE - | 29
30 Dec 2013 #87
I know, Harry, you are right , thanks, but for jon357 the fact of being arrested is enough to make accusations as it follows from :

INSPE: WE DO NOT KNOW WHO WAS THE FIRST TO USE THE KNIVES
We do however know who has been arrested.

When one person makes an accusation, check to be sure he himself is not the guilty one.

(Joke HAHAHAHA )
ShawnH 8 | 1,498
30 Dec 2013 #88
Well the good news is that he seems to be coming around...

But, after 18 hours of surgery and more than a week unconscious in hospital, Mr Johnson regained consciousness and has been in contact with family at home

Crow 137 | 7,705
31 Dec 2013 #89
nice. i rejoice because of him

See, after all, its good that it was him. If it happened to somebody else, outcome maybe wouldn`t be that positive.
Ironside 48 | 9,824
31 Dec 2013 #90
it does not give people the right to make derogatory comments about a person who is in critical condition in hospital because of their nationality.

What are you talking about?


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