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Adam Michnik awarded for integrity, professionalism and high standards. Poland's No. 1 fascist?


NoToForeigners 10 | 1,054
30 Jun 2017 #301
He's still Poland's foremost independent journalis

AHahahaahahahahahahaha. You're full of crap
Dirk diggler 9 | 4,531
30 Jun 2017 #302
Well he is Poland's most celebrated (outside of pl) most awarded etc but all these awards, orders, honorary degrees he's received aren't from poland. That's extremely rare for a prominent world famous writer mathematician scientist whatever to receive tons of awards but yet none from their home country. All the awards that michnik got are from us, germany, france, holland, etc but none from poland. That just shows how polarizing figure he is in poland.

The western/central eu countries love him though.

Also for reasons I wrote earlier he's not exactly independent. Gw isn't owned by po or another party but its certainly a political instrument much like cnn was towards Hillary. Hence id say gw is about as 'independent' as cnn. Gw is definitely biased though there's no doubt about that
jon357 63 | 15,045
2 Jul 2017 #303
Well he is Poland's most celebrated (outside of pl)

Inside PL as well.

His publications still sell well, certainly outselling the various PiS mouthpieces.
Wulkan - | 3,251
2 Jul 2017 #304
The reality is that Michnik didn't say that.

He'd probably stammer himself to death.
jon357 63 | 15,045
2 Jul 2017 #305
stammer

Another challenge that he's overcome, like being jailed as a dissident.
Wulkan - | 3,251
2 Jul 2017 #306
Nah, he still stammers like a retard.
jon357 63 | 15,045
2 Jul 2017 #307
A silly and unpleasant thing to say. It says a lot more about you than him.
Wulkan - | 3,251
2 Jul 2017 #308
I can say unpleasant things about scum like him all day long, I can't change him by doing it but I also can't change him by not doing it either so what's the difference.
jon357 63 | 15,045
2 Jul 2017 #309
And that's all you can do. Nasty one-liners online, while he's laughing all the way to the bank.
Wulkan - | 3,251
2 Jul 2017 #310
Nasty one-liners online

Yes, you do plenty of those.

while he's laughing all the way to the bank.

I can't complain about my bank statement either so doesn't really bother me. At least unlike him I don't have to go to bed everyday knowing that many millions of people in the world hate me for a good reason.
jon357 63 | 15,045
2 Jul 2017 #311
many millions of people in the world hate m

Nor him, for that matter. Far more people admire him than dislike him.
Dirk diggler 9 | 4,531
2 Jul 2017 #312
@jon357

I never disagreed with the success or popularity of his papers. Hell I read wyborcza sometimes but that doesn't mean one has to approve of michnik. Wyborcza was around before pis even formed as a party. The fact is he's a commie whitewashing cfr zionist who will either suck up to his colleaguess or backstab them, depending on what's convenient at the time, like he did with walesa for example. Surprisingly he never backstabbed kuron or gross though. Neither will he ever criticise his brother or call for his extradition (he has a Europe wide arrest warrant) for sentencing the most patriotic poles to death. Although I don't expect an internationalist cfr zionist to have much patriotism for his home country. Israel where his dad lives on the other hand... Oh no critism is totally off limits. And the reason why he jailed in the 60s wasn't because he was anti-communist far from it. He advocated revisionist Marxism and Zionism- that's why he was jailed. The 2nd time around it was for helping stage strikes with solidarnosc which irked the commies since they were negotiating already in the 80s eventually leading to a power sharing agreement.

And no he as a person is not very celebrated in poland - that's why not a single of his 2 dozen or so awards came from poland. He's too polarizing for some school to give him an honorary degree or an institution to award him an order medal. Even po didn't award him any order medals when they were in power bc they understood how polarizing of a figure he is and they didn't want negative repercussions.

Very few people in poland laud Stalinists and protectors of communists like jaruzelski - esp if you or your family lived under martial law. Supporting a guy who tries to defend martial law is like a deadly sin. Poland is trying to do everything to forget about its commie past going as far to rename streets and destroy statues and whatnot - not whitewash it or celebrate it. Even if someone likes michnik jaruzelski kiszczak and that whole clique they won't openly admit it for fear of being criticised by every prl generation in their family, unless they were all party guys and actually believed the ideology.

If you lived in stan wojenny or your parents/grandparents did you'd probably have a different opinion of someone that protects the top criminals of that era and protects an AK slaughtering family member.
delphiandomine 85 | 18,254
2 Jul 2017 #313
that's why not a single of his 2 dozen or so awards came from poland.

Just a point, but you should have checked this properly.

He's a holder of two important decorations in Poland. He has the Order of the White Eagle (highest and oldest decoration for civilians in Poland) and the Medal for Merit to Culture. There's a picture of him receiving the first one here - pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adam_Michnik#/media/File:Wreczenie_Orderu_Orla_Bia%C5%82ego_2010-11-10_im6.jpg

Can't get any better than that as a civilian in Poland.
jon357 63 | 15,045
2 Jul 2017 #314
Just a point, but you should have checked this properly.

I don't think that truth always matters to some of the posters. Dirk suggested that people who lived in the PRL might have a more negative impression of Adam Michnik than someone who moved to Poland afterwards. The thing is, almost everyone who faithfully and regularly buys his publications lived in Poland during the PRL years...

the Order of the White Eagle

They don't give that out lightly - it's for the most distinguished Poles.
delphiandomine 85 | 18,254
2 Jul 2017 #315
The thing is, almost everyone who faithfully and regularly buys his publications lived in Poland during the PRL years...

Not only them - wyborcza.pl is very popular online among the post-PRL generation. As I recall, it's one of the few profitable paywall sites in Europe.

They don't give that out lightly - it's for the most distinguished Poles.

Yes, exactly. Worth looking at the recipients - these are really the elite of Polish society.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Order_of_the_White_Eagle_(Poland)
Dirk diggler 9 | 4,531
3 Jul 2017 #316
@jon357

I don't know how many times I can say this.. Reading wyborcza and liking adam michnik are two different things. You can like elon musk, as I do bc he has some great ideas, but hate his tesla cars because imo they're ugly inside and vice versa. You can hate the Wal-Mart family for being greedy ******** but still get your stuff there bc its so cheap. Same thing with wyborcza its the most popular paper because it was basically the first post prl one that was established. Just because someone reads the sports section or business in wyborcza doesn't automatically mean they like michnik. I read wyborcza on occasion too and most the articles are decent but oftentimes they hypocritically criticise poland and pis policies when Israel has the same type of policies especially when it comes to accepting Muslim migrants.

The majority of the prl generation by far don't like communists especially those responsible for stan wojenny which michnik whitewashes. Go and ask 10 random poles that are over 50 - I guarantee the majority will view michnik a commie traitor to poland if they know who he is. I actually did ask several people in wroclaw about their opinions on trump po pis michnik merkel etc to get their perspective on such topics. Honestly I can only recall one person - a young guy around 18 19 - that liked michnik.

I did look on the English wiki and don't see michniks name for that white eagle order or any other polish awards. However it appears you're right he was awarded it.

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adam_Michnik

Unfortunately we don't really have any surveys on how poles view michnik, again michnik the person not any of his publications. However I am pretty confident over half of poles don't like him - esp the prl ones who are familiar with who he is dont like him because poles are staunchly anti commie and dont like people who stand up for jaruzelski or who's brother killed ak members. They might read wyborcza as I do, but dislike michnik as a person like I do as well. Not to mention the catholic ones, the religion that most poles identify with (whether they go to church every Sunday is a different story - nonetheless that's by far the most popular religion in pl) which he overly criticised and some say even insulted. Same thing with polish partiots as he lambasts poland pis etc nonstop but yet is silent on criticising israel po etc. While he's pretty open minded and objective on most topics he is very biased and one sided when it comes to select topics like Israel, poland, migrant policies, etc.

So when you add up poles who don't like commies and people who defend commie crimes, poles who don't like the Roman Catholic church being insulted and dont like poland to be insulted you get a pretty high percent. Assuming that most poles know who he is they won't like him either. It would be interesting to do a survey though in poland on this question.
Wulkan - | 3,251
3 Jul 2017 #317
As I recall, it's one of the few profitable paywall sites in Europe.

but for some reason it wouldn't even exist without Soros loading money into it.
Dirk diggler 9 | 4,531
3 Jul 2017 #318
@jon357
@delphiandomine

Also yes Jon the truth does matter to me that's why I said you were right but as you'll see it didn't say anything on the English wiki hence it was an honest mistake. Unlike many posters I look at both perspectives of an issue. Like I said I respect michnik accomplishments but I do not like him for the reasons I wrote - mostly two things : the whitewashing of martial law cronies and his backstabbing of walesa only to support him again when convienent. The fact that his brother killed ak hero's, true polish hero's as michnik would never in his life pick up a gun and fight for poland, also irks me as michnik should have acknowledged the eu wide arrest warrant.
Wulkan - | 3,251
3 Jul 2017 #319
Nor him, for that matter. Far more people admire him than dislike him.

The internet suggests otherwise.
jon357 63 | 15,045
3 Jul 2017 #320
The internet

As the late, great, Stanislaw Lem said: "I hadn't known there were so many idiots in the world until I started using the Internet."
delphiandomine 85 | 18,254
3 Jul 2017 #321
If you believe the Polish internet, then KORWiN should have won the last election by a mile. I remember polls carried out online before the last election, and there was one claim that they along with Kukiz were going to win over 50% of the vote in some provinces.


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