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Polish guy and courting? Confusion.


Myself
24 Aug 2016 #1
Hi everybody,
I'm a young IT woman and here is my question: I have met this Pol guy I really like.
I got to know him when I started Joining my friend on A weekly event that became the "usual". He his a friend of my friend since long ago.

Around 40 days ago, the guy asked me whether I wanted to eat something together before the "usual" and the dinner happened to seem like a date. I was confused but it felt very nice to me. The week after he asked me whether I wanted to go with him somewhere out of town and I said yes. We spent 20 hours together and I was struck by discovering how many things we have in common.

I am out of a very abusive relationship ( but we NEVER talk about this matter luckly) and feeling scared of men. But not scared enough to hold back from life. Let's say I have a huge conflict within as I don't get if i can trust him or not and, on the other side, he is so respectful of me that sometimes it looks almost scared to touch my arm or back.

The week after (4 weeks ago) the thing got repeated. Meanwhile, our texting increased. But nothing happened although he brought me to the most amazing and romantic places . He showed a lot of nice thoughts towards me, but yet I felt and feel confused because I am used to men who are quite clear in their intentions. Usually, the guy I am used to are very adamant about lettin me know they like me. I don't get whether he does like this because he is a gentle person or because he might like me.

Sometimes we found ourselves holding each other's hand. But this just happens out of the blue when we come back home at night.
He holds the doors, pays compliments but I can't figure him out. Because someone can do this just out of kindness. He also pays everything and I m not used to it, as I have always been used to pay for my ex most part of the times, due to necessity. But maybe this is cultural?

Finally, around 3 weeks ago he kissed me, after we came back from the "usual". It was a super-shy kiss , but very nice. I can't place this kiss in the wider context. We didn't speak about it and he seemed "scared", although kept on texting me and so on . He is kinda introvert, I am a very shy person and I feel insecure. But usually people don't figure it out and think I am kinda superstrong and cool and independent woman. I am actually very fragile at times.

I feel scared and nothing is clear to me yet.
I am not good with texting and he writes in what I call "the usual polish way", which for an IT person feels like a telegram at times.

Few days later(2weeks ago) he went to his Country for a family wedding and I went to my Country too, for holidays. Through these days we texted a lot, but never spoken about precise matters. I feel a bit confused.

I am now coming back from holidays and I don't know what to expect. In other words, I am very scared... I really like him, as a man and as a person (or at least I like what I perceive of him) but I have suffered very much in the past in a very awful way. He doesn't know this.

I have been told that Polski men are "old fashion" at times and I wanted to know what do u readers think..
I know this post might seem confused, but so am I . I don't want to create embarassment in him but I am not good at expressing my interest sometimes. . . Especially in a written way, Because I dont feel textes as the best way to express my innermost.

Can't speak to my friend about this. I think she figured out but luckly gossip is not in her style.
And since I have never met a guy from this Country (only had flatmates from Poland) I would like to be enlightened about your culture around such matters.

Because seriously this is the first time I find myself in a situation like this...
Ziemowit 13 | 4,108
24 Aug 2016 #2
What an intriguing story! I think Dreamergirl could be your proper guide here, so you should wait until she reappears.
Atch 17 | 3,225
24 Aug 2016 #3
I can't figure him out.

Don't try to. Stop agonizing. You can drive yourself demented trying to figure out what another person is thinking. Never mind what he wants, what do you want?

I have suffered very much in the past

You'll have to put that behind you and take a chance on somebody else at some point or you'll be alone for the rest of your life.

Dreamergirl

Yes, she'll be in like Flynn on this one. Just in case Myself is genuine, I thought I'd throw a bit of sisterly advice her way.
OP Myself
24 Aug 2016 #4
Who's Flynn?
I want to understand. My post is about understanding what is cultural, not understanding what he wants.
I think I let off this thing accidentally, but still.
No I'm not ready to go and "take a chance on somebody else". First because I don't take a chance on people, they are not things or interchangeable, second because this is an ongoing thing and I'm not ready to do so anyway.

I asked about cultural habits, I didn't ask about what should I do with what I feel, that's my problem and I would be very childish in posting such a question in a forum :-)
Ziemowit 13 | 4,108
24 Aug 2016 #5
In that case only Dreamergirl can help. She seems to be a real connaisseur of Polish men... Plus, she is the forum's expert on them. Rumour has it she may be a man herself...
mafketis 23 | 8,445
24 Aug 2016 #6
Who's Flynn?

In like Flynn is an idiom it means: will have no trouble achieving their goals

My thoughts. A lot of Polish men are actually pretty shy and not that... assertive about pursuing relationships*. By contrast many Polish women are very upfront and assertive (most foreign-men w/ Polish-women relationships I've ever known and very many Polish relationships I've known were initiated by the women).

From everything you've written and my experiences with Polish people, my best guess is that he wants a romantic relationship with you but is mostly waiting for you to initiate more intimacy the same way a Polish woman would. He's giving all the signals and waiting for you to act on them.

*this is especially true among the more educated, lower class men tend to be lots more assertive (there are exceptions both ways of course)
Atch 17 | 3,225
24 Aug 2016 #7
I asked about cultural habits,

People are always asking that question here, just have a good old rummage around in the Lerv thread and you'll find that no satisfactory consensus has been reached.

only Dreamergirl can help.

Yes, she definitely couldn't do better than getting Dozy's unique insight into this matter.
Dreamergirl 4 | 276
24 Aug 2016 #8
Is he from London? The polish guy?
OP Myself
24 Aug 2016 #9
Dreamgirl, he has been living in UK for some years (more than me though). He was born and raised in his Country though.
mafketis 23 | 8,445
24 Aug 2016 #10
So my guess is still that he wants a romantic relationship and is waiting for you to show real interest in that. If you don't want that then stop accepting invitations to be alone with him (or just tell him). Polish guys can take a long time to get the message on their own.
Dreamergirl 4 | 276
24 Aug 2016 #11
Thought so. Yes they are shy. He will be scared to make first move but once you show him you are intimate with him, ie sex he will be fine
OP Myself
24 Aug 2016 #12
@Mafketis
You think so?
Do you know many polish guys who are more or less this way (cryptic )?
My friends say I am not always clear, but more than keeping the contact with him (even just to show a thought) and say yes when he asks me to go "somewhere", i don't know what should I do.

Of course I would like something with him. I have an interest for him. Meaning with this not only sexual, because when I am with him everything feels just so fine. It was like meeting someone I had been knowing for a long time, although this is just a metaphor. But I don't want to seem to naive in here.

I am not that type of girl who jumps over a guy..... Let's say I am not a Londoner, so being the one who makes an inequivocable step is is impossible to me .

@Dreamgirl, sex is not my first thought in this case, as what I have is (unfortunately) a real interest in him.. I can find sex wherever, I can't find someone I Like everywhere.... But WHAT do you mean by "intimate"?
Dreamergirl 4 | 276
24 Aug 2016 #13
My polish guy is similar to that and shy but sexually we went to bed on first date and now I'm having his baby 😊 Piolish guys like a lot of their sausages being eaten
mafketis 23 | 8,445
24 Aug 2016 #14
Do you know many polish guys who are more or less this way (cryptic )?

Lots. It's not necessarily the most common type, but it's not rare either.

Meaning with this not only sexual

Given the behavior you describe, it's not just about sex for him either (guys who just want sex are much more straightforward).

what I have is (unfortunately) a real interest in him.. I can find sex wherever,

If your'e going to do that, break things off with him first. It would be unspeakably cruel to make him think he has a chance if he doesn't.

Getting sex for a woman is not an accomplishment. Finding a guy who's committed to more than her body is.

Giving all the signals that you want a relationship and then sleeping with someone else would be very cruel of you.

WHAT do you mean by "intimate"?

Sex plus companionship and becoming close at the spiritual, not just physical, level.
OP Myself
24 Aug 2016 #15
Mafketis
I have said the opposite all the way through. I dont want to have sex around it is not what I need.. I need something more.
mafketis 23 | 8,445
24 Aug 2016 #16
I need something more.

And from what you write, that's what he's offering.... The choice is up to you. This doesn't mean you have to jump in bed right away, but if you care about him you need to let him now that it will happen sooner or later.

But you shouldn't wait too long or he might give up on you. Even the greatest gentleman can't wait around forever....
OP Myself
24 Aug 2016 #17
I am trying to let him understand I am interested, i am not a nun LOL. it's just that HE is very hard to figure out!

I have just got back to UK and that's why I got the idea of asking to you guys here, because I would rather do all I can in order to do my part and see if I am returned. Just I feel there are some cultural things I might misunderstand or don't understand.
Dreamergirl 4 | 276
24 Aug 2016 #18
Give him a special kiss he will understand what you mean then!!!!
Some men just need directions. Use pointing if necessary. I did.
Paulina 9 | 1,448
25 Aug 2016 #19
I don't know if Myself is genuine or a troll, but let's assume that she is genuine...

A lot of Polish men are actually pretty shy and not that... assertive about pursuing relationships*.

*this is especially true among the more educated

That's kind of my observation too, I guess...

Myself, if he asked you out (only you and him) on several occasions, pays for you (friends pay for themselves, split expenses during meet-ups or one time one person pays and another time another person pays), you were holding hands and he kissed you... If he kissed you on the lips and not on the cheek then I don't understand what's so cryptic about his behaviour. He's clearly interested in you romantically. But he's probably shy and I'm guessing a sweet guy too. He won't drag you to bed on a first or "even" a third date lol That's nothing unusual in Poland in my opinion.

Usually, the guy I am used to are very adamant about lettin me know they like me.

That's probably often not the case with Polish people (not only men, but women also). They may be more likely to give you indirect signs that they like you rather then go like: "OMG, I like you so much, let's date!" ;)

Yes, Polish men can be confusing, for Polish women also, trust me... :)

Since you both are shy you may be going in circles like that forever or until he decides that you're not interested and you prefer to be friends with him or sth.

If you don't have the courage to tell him that you like him and that you're interested in him romantically then my advice would be to do it "the Polish way" and give him some less direct signs:

If he's always taking you somewhere then take the initiative and ask him out yourself, like to the cinema for a film or to the theater or wherever you guys like going. Or where he likes going. If you don't know where he likes going or what he likes to do in his spare time then ask him.

Use some body language - find some opportunities to touch him, like holding hands or... um... I don't know the name for this gesture in English but I have also this in mind:

Polish gentelman

Take his arm like this when you're walking. If you're too shy for this and it would be too akward for you to do it "just like that" then think of some kind of excuse, like, for example, that you're cold and it's warmer next to him or whatever ;)

Btw, a grown man and a grown woman holding hands is a couples' thing in Poland usually (unless the male friend is gay, I guess).

Touch his arm when you're laughing/joking around, take some invisible speck of dirt from his coat/shirt, etc. - you know the drill ;)

Since he was on a family wedding not long ago you can ask him about it and about his family and generally simply show interest in him.

Later on you can invite him to your place (if you haven't yet) to watch a film on DVD or for a dinner after work. If he cooks you could cook some meal together - it can be fun and a nice bonding experience. You can say, for example, that you'd like to show him how some dish from your home country is made or sth of this kind.

At some point ask him what he likes in women to give him a clue :) and maybe that could lead to a conversation about a realtionship...

In other words, gradually give him more and more clues that you're interested romantically and he'll become more sure of himself and will stop fearing rejection.

How old are you guys? And where are you from (from which country), Myself? If the culture of your country is a lot different than Polish then he may also not be entirely sure how to approach you.
mafketis 23 | 8,445
25 Aug 2016 #20
unless the male friend is gay, I guess

The thought that this guy is gay and doesn't realized the signals he's sending crossed my mind and it is a (small) possibility. But I don't think so, because

1 the gay guy-straight woman friendship dynamic isn't as common in Poland as in some countries

2 if he's in England, he'd probably be out (if not to everybody, he'd tell a close friend)

There's also a small possibility that he's kind of gay and doesn't realize it yet or that he's asexual and just wants friendship but again those don't seem that likely.

There's a slightly larger chance that he's staight and just doesn't know what he wants in terms of a relationship himself (a small subset of 'shy' guys in Poland at the same time both want and don't want relationships and repeatedly go through the initial stages of courtship before backing off) but again that's a small possibility.

I do think Myself is real and the most likely explanation for his behavior is that he's waiting for clearer signs from her.
Paulina 9 | 1,448
25 Aug 2016 #21
Yes, mafketis, I also think that he's straight and he's simply shy. If he kissed her on the lips then it's a clear sign for me that he wants their relations to be of romantic nature.

And as you wrote here:

but is mostly waiting for you to initiate more intimacy the same way a Polish woman would. He's giving all the signals and waiting for you to act on them.

That's probably the case and hence my instructions for Myself ;)

the gay guy-straight woman friendship dynamic isn't as common in Poland as in some countries

Really? From my observation the gay boys at my highschool were often spending time with girls... One even shared a flat with my female classmate.
OP Myself
25 Aug 2016 #22
@Paulina
@mafketis

(I DON'T KNOW HOW TO SELECT PART OF YOUR TEXT GUYS)

Thank you for the advice.. I am from Italy. I am in my early 30s and he is in 30s too. Slightly older than me.

I know we look like 20yo people in this. But as I said some things are hard for me as I have been in a sort of hell for 3 years(long story) and spending time with a person who actually shows to appreciate ME (and not his ideal about me) is something I am no longer used to. And at times I can't believe it....

It is like I forgot everything. I was often paying things for my ex and spent all the time listening at hos problems only. He was only talking about himself. This guy asks me a lot about myself.

He has got his troubles too in the past, though.

No, he is not gay (I have got this info) and all I knew before I started liked him is that he is "very sensitive"( a friend was saying this one day, but we were talking about generic stuff. It was way before something happened- at least from my side).

I will keep your suggestions and advice in mind and will try to do some of what u mentioned, Paulina
Last time we met it was him taking me under the arm, that's funny LOL , as in Italy only old people do it.

I am prepared to the fact that I will face a certain "resettling"time in relation to him.

When I am together with him I do think he might be interested, it is when I am not that I wonder. I hate textes in the sense that they are interpreted by indirect things such as symbols and so on.

I don't want to be too adamant because I really enjoy his company and like him overall and I don't want to put him in an awful situation, meaning embarassing, in case he is not.

Ie. Sometimes I don't understand his way of texting: there are times when he "gets very close", often followed by textes where he only asks me "how are u?"

we don't text every day, it is more every two days.

At the moment I am confused and critical about the approach I have been having towards him. For me it is clear, but from the outside it might not be.

Ps. I am Not faking, I mean I would never had signed up to a forum if I was joking.... In that case I would have played in real life. I thought that here there are people who might know some things better than me.

I had a relationship with a Serbian guy few years ago amd, although I know it is not the same culture, understanding that some actions or non-actions were culturally determined helped me feeling a bit more relaxed in that situation. Well I didn't use a forum that time... But nowadays I thought it could be useful.
OP Myself
25 Aug 2016 #23
If he kissed you on the lips and not on the cheek then I don't understand what's so cryptic about his behaviour.

I understood how to select text from a computer! I am improving :-)
I realise I must explain this point, otherwise I am gonna look like a complete freak.
I did kiss me, some days before we both left the Country for the summer. Due to the timing of the thing and to the fact that we didn't actually speak about it nor made each other clear for what it was ( I didn't as well, I take responsibility for that. But it was feeling weird to go and say "by the way, that kiss meant to me!"), I am still at the same point of before, INNERLY.

We'll see if other occasions for doing something together will happen. Today is my first day back here and I was feeling a huge conflict about how to feel in coming back to UK (in relation to this situation). This makes me realise how scared I am, but yet, this is again my own responsibility. I only know that when I feel so shaking I need to stop for some hours or a day and calm down, otherwise I only tend to express my insecurity (which I don't want beyond a certain extent).

hence my instructions for Myself ;)

Thank you for the instructions, this was what I needed, meaning: this was my question.

I do think Myself is real

Thank you, no I am not here to play. I don't use forums in general. But I found this one as with some potential, at least for a better understanding.
Paulina 9 | 1,448
25 Aug 2016 #24
The fact that he is "very sensitive" and he had "his troubles too in the past" probably explains a lot.

But as I said some things are hard for me as I have been in a sort of hell for 3 years

Don't worry about it, that's understandable.

And at times I can't believe it....

Then believe it ;) And, btw, maybe try to show him some appreciation too, pay him some compliments, tell him at some point how good you feel in his company and that it feels like you've known him for a long time, etc. Maybe he also got "burned" in the past and can't believe that such a "superstrong and cool and independent woman" would be interested in him. Or maybe he doesn't have much experience with women and in such case he could use some reassurance too.

I don't want to put him in an awful situation, meaning embarassing, in case he is not.

In case he is not what? Interested in you romantically?
Myself, you wrote that he kissed you. Did he kiss you on the lips or on the cheek?

we don't text every day, it is more every two days.

Well, you're "dating" just over a month (and you're not even sure whether it's dating, maybe he isn't sure what's the situation either) so I wouldn't expect everyday outbursts of emotions, etc. Especially if he is, as you wrote, an introvert.

Btw, one thing you should also remember about, I guess, is that Poles aren't very open people. We need time to open up, to warm up to people, to trust them, etc.

Thank you for the instructions, this was what I needed, meaning: this was my question.

You're welcome :)

did kiss me, some days before we both left the Country for the summer.

If he kissed you on the lips then he probably "can see his unborn children in your eyes" ;D Just kidding, but, seriously... What more do you want, woman... lol If he's such a sensitive introvert he probably had to pluck up a lot of courage to give you even that super-shy kiss.

Next time you meet kiss him on the cheek at least :)
And on the days when he's not texting you maybe you text him first and simply ask how he is, how his day was, etc. You know, to show him that you want to be in touch and that you care so it wouldn't be always only his initiative (if it is).
OP Myself
25 Aug 2016 #25
Did he kiss you on the lips or on the cheek?

On the lips... otherwise I would have not taken it into consideration

you maybe you text him first and simply ask how he is, how his day was, etc. You know, to show him that you want to be in touch

I think I will recollect myself today and I will do it.... Sometimes he takes the initiative, some other times I do... for me, a text is more like a "thought", never speak of important things by text.

I honestly think humanity was far much better a century ago! without mobile phones LOL!
Let's see how things will go....... I hope I will feel less tensed after I will see him again... "post-holiday".
Ziemowit 13 | 4,108
25 Aug 2016 #26
Did he kiss you on the lips or on the cheek?

A kiss on the lips or a kiss on the cheek - that is a question!
Atch 17 | 3,225
25 Aug 2016 #27
On the lips

I'm sorry, but really, come on woman, you're in your 30s, not your teens. Men don't differ that much from each other from culture to culture. When a man kisses you on the lips he means business.
Dreamergirl 4 | 276
25 Aug 2016 #28
Atch get off this thread and leave her alone. She's with a new culture and is also traumatised from her previous relationship so she's wanting to know if she's getting it right. Polish men do behave very differently to others, especially those in London. Atch as you don't live in London and don't have the same experience you need to butt out about what's her age got to do with it.
johnny reb 23 | 4,584
25 Aug 2016 #29
When a man kisses you on the lips he means business.

When he slips you his tongue he really means business.

you need to butt out

Yeah Atch, what do you know about courting a Polish guy. lol
Dreamergirl 4 | 276
25 Aug 2016 #30
Johnny and atch neither of you have any business being on this thread except to try and cause trouble


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