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Is Poland split into two religions: catholicism and non-believers?


George8600 10 | 636
7 Jul 2010 #31
Some people have said the country is split into 2, Catholicism and non believers.

Are you kidding me? Poland definitely doesn't have a near significant "non-believer" side, and as far as half goes, it's not even that high in the most atheistic/skeptic countries in Europe such as the UK and France.

Don't get me wrong, I'm an agnostic so I have no bias for/against religion or for/against atheism. But statistics don't lie. I think it's so pointless how the "religion argument" has taken so much popular hold when there are other problems thousands of times more serious and affective. (Poverty, natural disasters, global warming, etc.) More people are dying of these causes yearly than religion has ever killed in history. It'd be at least nice if the religious argument wasn't so childish. Politicians and activists have illogically crammed this argument into their politicos causing more rage, and the commoners have painted the whole issue black and white (either you're an atheist anti-theist high IQ'ed intellectual, or your a bible thumping dumbbell whose not going to hell). Out of the vast majority of people I've met in these sides only a very small minority do these labels apply to. Your arrogant atheist thinks he has a high IQ which most of the time he doesn't and your arrogant theist thinks he's the most moral which most of the time he isn't. I believe people should have the right to believe in what they want without pointing childish labels at others, and our sovereigns and "activists" should stop trying to purge the privacy of our beliefs/dis-beliefs like some Stalinists.

Anyway, Poland according to statistic has one of the lowest rates of atheism. While bible-thumping is dying down it's more or less being replaced by liberal Christianity/spiritualism.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion_in_Poland

90% of Poland is Catholic as of recently, the rest are Orthodox and Protestant by most. Other statistics claim Poland is 95% Catholic.

EU statistics show that religion in Poland has been increasing---

In 2005:

- 80% of Polish citizens responded that "they believe there is a God" (which was the fifth highest result in the European Union).

- 15% answered that "they believe there is some sort of spirit or life force".

- 3% answered that "don't know".

- 2% answered that "they do not believe there is any sort of spirit, God or life force".

In 2008:

- 94% of Poles claim "they believe in God",

- 6% claim they "do not believe in God or do not know",

- * 52% of believers claim "they attend to mass, religious meetings etc. at least once a week",

- * while 17% do so "once or twice a month",

- * 18% do so "a few times a year",

- * and 13% "never do so".

These statistics have been published in accordance to the Polish government by the EU. The EU is secular and has no religious or irreligious bias from what can be seen.
RubasznyRumcajs 5 | 491
7 Jul 2010 #32
yes. i hope that thread-creator will understand communistic invention called "wierzący- niepraktykujący" ("believer but not attending to masses etc")- ya know, someone who labell himself as 'catholic' but not going to church (unless its christmas/easter or its a funeral/wedding/christening), someone who claim to love pope but still using condom/pill (sex outside marriage! omfg!), someone who doesn't believe in any of church rules but he/she *have* to have a catholic wedding or funeral etc- in that case, 95% of Poles are catholics; 5% just don't give a sh*te about that.
Seanus 15 | 19,706
7 Jul 2010 #33
Nice answer, RR. Sb who can laugh a bit and take the sting out of things :)
Olaf 6 | 956
8 Jul 2010 #34
Your choice.

- well not really, because when it comes to the one-and-only-tru religion in Poland, and I bet my sneakers on it that in many other countries too - the taxes and money from the govt. is flowing to the Church even if you are e.g. Jewish or aheist and you wouldn't like your money to go on that. But you do not have any choice. One of countless examples is this Światynia Boza Opatrzności - loads of money on that from Polish govt.

So do not say we have any choice.
I only have a choice to watch or not a footbal game.

95% of Poles are catholics; 5% just don't give a sh*te about that

- I say more wierzący-niepraktykujący and very little truely believing and following the word of God.
Mr Grunwald 33 | 2,019
8 Jul 2010 #35
Protestant church apart from a Catholic one? ;)

Here in Norway there is a lot of Catholic churches used by Protestants... I find it amusing :)
Although inside them it's different ;)

(people dont give £30/£40 per week more like £2 - £5 - plus price of candles) if you ask me.

Ive always given just around 10-20 NOK or 2-5 Złoty :(
But when I get a real normal life THEN I will give a lot more away :)
f stop 25 | 2,513
8 Jul 2010 #36
This will not win me many friends here I suppose, but I really believe that religion is for mentally handicapped. Or old people, afraid of dying.

Not that I'm immune. I used to think that a sunday school for my son was good, at very least it taught him that even if you don't get caught, you still are responsible. Plus, I had these fine memories of magical church, after a mug of sweet warm beer... Anyway, then, he conveniently learned that if you perform some ritual, you can wipe the slate clean again. That does not promote high moral standards, does it?
nott 3 | 594
8 Jul 2010 #37
He learned there is a slate.
Seanus 15 | 19,706
8 Jul 2010 #38
Thanks, Mr Grunwald, for commenting on the issue.

Not exactly! Other religions are represented but you have to dig deeper to find options for yourself in terms of places of worship. That is to be expected. The indoctrination aspect is such that most follow the teachings of the Catechisms etc. This is a cohesive aspect.
Olaf 6 | 956
13 Oct 2010 #39
Non-believing is not religion; it's more like not having a need for believing. KNOWING, not believing.
George8600 10 | 636
13 Oct 2010 #40
*dig* *dig* *dig* Seanus, your shovel might break ;-)
Seanus 15 | 19,706
13 Oct 2010 #41
No need to dig here for me :)
1jola 14 | 1,879
13 Oct 2010 #42
This will not win me many friends here I suppose, but I really believe that religion is for mentally handicapped.

Funny that soldiers who have been in combat have a saying: There are no atheists in foxholes.
A J 4 | 1,088
13 Oct 2010 #43
This will not win me many friends here I suppose, but I really believe that religion is for mentally handicapped.

Yup, you've won a friend.

;)
convex 20 | 3,978
13 Oct 2010 #44
Funny that soldiers who have been in combat have a saying: There are no atheists in foxholes.

While that of course is false but yet commonly repeated, it still brings up a good point... Are people scared into being religious to insure themselves a happy and fruitful afterlife? Is that what all the fuss is about?
Seanus 15 | 19,706
13 Oct 2010 #45
I'd say it's more down to ID, convex. The point is that they are not ensured of it at all. A Catholic believes in constant good works, infusing and transformation of the character to give themselves the best chance of redemption and ultimate heaven.

They follow the process of contrition/penance/salvation in order to show this working. When a Catholic finds himself 'justified' is a hard question and often transgresses into the realms of sanctification. The Council of Trent confuses this point. For a Calvinist, justification is a simple matter but a Catholic has to continuously work at it and the moment of justification is by no means clear. This is what puzzles me. A Catholic sees themself as practising only if they go to church. That's what I pick up anyone. However, the majority of 'good works' are done in society, outwith the direct gaze of the church. Is the church merely reinforcement or....?
convex 20 | 3,978
13 Oct 2010 #46
I'd say it's more down to ID, convex.

Sorry, that was in response to the

There are no atheists in foxholes.

quote, which is obviously based on fear.
Seanus 15 | 19,706
13 Oct 2010 #47
Aha, ok :)

I wonder if any Catholics feel let down by God. There was a chapter in Watchtower devoted to the scepticism of those that questioned the intentions of God. They felt he introduced natural disasters as a punishment to mankind. Catholics tend to be devout so perhaps they don't question in that way.
alexw68
13 Oct 2010 #48
I wonder if any Catholics feel let down by God.

Well, if they ever do feel inclined to call a shareholders' meeting, I'd love to see the agenda.
Barney 15 | 1,500
13 Oct 2010 #49
They follow the process of contrition/penance/salvation in order to show this working.

You seem to be thinking yourself round in circles, a dog chasing its tail?

Reading the above; are you saying that Catholicism is a dynamic journey while Calvinism is a smug auto defining thing?

Obsessing about Catholics is pointless, just pick a belief system that you are comfortable with and dont worry about what others believe.

Simples.
Seanus 15 | 19,706
13 Oct 2010 #50
Minority shareholders would be welcomed or not? ;)

Barney, you seem uncomfortable with me discussing it and I can't figure out why. Are you really so defensive? This is a forum and Catholicism is a large part of the Polish psyche. I'm not chasing my tail at all, what I addressed above was a separate point. If you cannot answer or are not comfortable with what you write, then don't. Simples!

I was merely making a theological point but you don't need to go into it if it doesn't interest you. A Catholic tends to work more on the deed side of things.
Barney 15 | 1,500
13 Oct 2010 #51
Are you really so defensive?

Not in the slightest, I am not a Catholic.

I dont have to be a Jew to dislike anti Semitism:)

I think that your obsession with the Catholic Church is bordering on the offensive. Using the Polish psyche as a smokescreen.

I have noted that you have recently toned down your "critique" of the Catholic Church after posting anti Catholic propaganda, this is a good thing.

I would take the same stance if you were posting about almost any other belief system.
Seanus 15 | 19,706
13 Oct 2010 #52
People make such issues their life. Do priests have an obsession with the RCC or is it just their work/interest? I don't discuss religion at work, with fellow Poles or in other places. I've just wanted to find out a few things from Poles here, that's all. Not an obsession!

Sorry but the Polish psyche has roots with the RCC, amongst other things. There is no smokescreen, only clear fact.

Care to quote some of that anti-Catholic propaganda? I'd happily defend any of my statements by reference to official sources. Best by PM as I don't want to repeat what has been done already.

Questions are open and no guns are pointed at heads.
Barney 15 | 1,500
13 Oct 2010 #53
People make such issues their life.

Like DariuszTelka;)

Care to quote some of that anti-Catholic propaganda?

Almost all the videos and the Swedish radio program where they said that The Catholic Church invented Islam or some such nonsense immediately spring to mind.
Maryia
13 Oct 2010 #54
Non-believers have never been a power in Poland. To compare with France or UK, Poland has ery strong religious background.
A J 4 | 1,088
13 Oct 2010 #55
Care to quote some of that anti-Catholic propaganda?

Who needs anti-Catholic propaganda?? I think Benedict's speeches are bad enough for PR already!

Obsessing about Catholics is pointless, just pick a belief system that you are comfortable with and dont worry about what others believe.

You can tell that to the Pope who constantly expresses his concerns about all those awful Humanitarians, Atheists and whatnot.

;)
jonni 16 | 2,485
13 Oct 2010 #56
Non-believers have never been a power in Poland. To compare with France or UK, Poland has ery strong religious background.

Yet there are still plenty of better educated people, especially in the capital, who have nothing to do with religion.
Barney 15 | 1,500
13 Oct 2010 #57
You can tell that to the Pope

I would but I'm scared of Germans on balconies:)
A J 4 | 1,088
13 Oct 2010 #58
Come to think of it, he's pretty scary..

:O
Seanus 15 | 19,706
13 Oct 2010 #59
The videos don't reflect my views, Barney, but stimulate discussion.

People cast aspersions on the role of the RCC with Islam but I fail to see where they are coming from. However, they have occupied positions that I'll never have in religious circles. I do tend to think those mason types are wackos with conflicts in their agendas.

I could also equally mention the good things the RCC does and I have already praised JPII elsewhere.
Barney 15 | 1,500
13 Oct 2010 #60
I have already praised JPII elsewhere.

And for some unknown reason managed to drag Ian Paisley into it.

People cast aspersions on the role of the RCC with Islam but I fail to see where they are coming from

Yet you saw fit to post obvious Anti Catholic propaganda.(I'll not even go with the rest of what I'm thinking about this sentence).

Seanus I think you are at heart a good person.
If you want to explore these issues you must be extra careful. Your history of, how shall I put this, "unorthodox questioning" will always lead to dead ends.

A legalistic mind is not necessarily the best for tackling philosophical points.


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