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Number of church attendees in Poland


Dougpol1 31 | 2,639
23 Apr 2016 #1
moved from
Why do you think the churches are emptying? The only attendees in any number are:

!. Those closer to God (Literally)
2. The under 18s (because babcia checks on them)
3. PIS voters
Levi 11 | 436
24 Apr 2016 #2
1st: Churches are not emptying. According to CBOS (one of the most, if not the most respected statistical institute in Poland), church attendance is stable in Poland during the last decade.

Indeed it decreased compared with the times of John Paul II, but it is normal and expected that a country that have the pope have increase in attendance and decrease again after he dies.

Just see how the RCC gained traction in Argentina with Pope Francis.

2nd: When you say that "Just see how the church is losing attendance" it reminds me of you saying "Just see how PiS is losing supporters, only farmers from Poland B support them".

And weeks later, PiS had the biggest victory ever achieved in democratic Poland.

LOL
delphiandomine 88 | 18,116
24 Apr 2016 #3
And weeks later, PiS had the biggest victory ever achieved in democratic Poland.

You do realise that it was the electoral mathematics that caused that and not any real support for PiS? Less than 1 in 5 eligible voters voted for them, while over 1 in 5 votes were disqualified.
OP Harry
24 Apr 2016 #4
According to CBOS (one of the most, if not the most respected statistical institute in Poland), church attendance is stable in Poland during the last decade.

Oh dear, there you go again, showing your ignorance of Poland. Firstly, CBOS is not a statistical institute, is an opinion polling institute. Secondly CBOS does not release studies about church attendance; it very simply does not have the resources to count church attendees. Thirdly the statistical institute which does conduct a obviously flawed study of church attendance is the Catholic Statistical Institute. Fourthly, and most importantly, the studies released by the Catholic Statistical Institute, show a steady decline in church attendance over the last decade.

PiS had the biggest victory ever achieved in democratic Poland.

And again you display your ignorance of all things Polish. The reality is the PIS got barely 80,000 more votes than PO did in the previous election and they got a million fewer votes than PO did in the election before that one.
Levi 11 | 436
24 Apr 2016 #5
Harry, stop lying.

CBOS RELEASED a research about church attendance in february of 2015. ISSN 2083-1734, registered at the national archives.

And the result is completely different of your bullsh1t lie. Indeed half of the respondents attend regularly church services, and this number had been stable for the last years.

Harry, my turkish muslim (not) friend, stop embarassing yourself talking about things that you clearly doesnt know (specially your rants about the catholic church.

We know that you, as all other radical muslims that you support, would love to see all christians beheaded but this is not the place for it).
delphiandomine 88 | 18,116
24 Apr 2016 #6
And the result is completely different of your bullsh1t lie. Indeed half of the respondents attend regularly church services, and this number had been stable for the last years.

Except those of us living in Poland know that CBOS tends to get polls wrong due to the polling methods used.
OP Harry
24 Apr 2016 #7
CBOS RELEASED a research about church attendance in february of 2015.

That's a report about the number of people who say they go to church. The number of people who actually do go to church is very different, becausewhat people say and what people do all often rather different.

And the result is completely different of your bullsh1t lie. Indeed half of the respondents attend regularly church services, and this number had been stable for the last years.

The data about declining church attendance is not mine: it is the data of the Catholic Statistical Institute. They actually record the number of people who do go to church, not the number of people who say they go to church. They actually count the number of people in each and every church on a particular Sunday. data shows a steady decline in attendance from 57% in 1982 to under 40% last year. one should note that the figure of 39% is not 39% of all polls but 39% of the number of polls which the Catholic Church thinks should be in church, they exclude from that number Poles who are too young to take communion and make an allowance for people who are ill and thus unable to go to church. from memory they exclude in the region of 20% of people from their expected church attendance, in reality we're talking about approximately 30% of Polish people being in church on a given Sunday. Of course, not everybody who is in church on a particular Sunday goes to church every single Sunday. If we assume that two thirds of the people in church on a given Sunday go every single Sunday that means approximately 20% of Polish people actually attend church every Sunday as the faithful are required to do by the Catholic Church.
Ironside 51 | 12,441
24 Apr 2016 #8
Except those of us living in Poland know that CBOS tends to get polls wrong due to the polling methods used.

Well, if that so that renders your 'friend's' Harry line of argument null and void.

The number of people who actually do go to church is very different, becausewhat people say and what people do all often rather different.

If you say so. It could be read both ways not only the way you take it, i.e. more people actually go to church than CBOS states.

Of course, not everybody who is in church on a particular Sunday goes to church every single Sunday.

Again, that line of argument can be used to debunk your claim. Not everybody who isn't in church on that particular Sunday doesn't attend Church services in some or most of Sundays in a year.

If we assume

You can assume whatever fits your fancy it doesn't mean that your assumption is correct and reflect reality.

from 57% in 1982 to under 40% last year

So from 1982 to 2015 attendance fell from 57% to 40%. If we take into account that some of those people attending church in 1982 died, if we adjust for the decline of population due to emigration, for a greater number of people working Sundays (only few worked Sundays in 1982), then we can assume that 17% of difference is not that great. Yes, some of those people don't go to church due to fashion, laziness, 'liberal' lefties ideas but only some and the latter is not a number that can be determined.

What we know is 40% is a number that shows up in some or other of the USA research of the subject and that number is lowered by one or other argument to about 20% of those who actually go to Church as opposite to those that say they go. Goes as it may we know where Harry got his 20% number from.

However here we have a number of those who actually show up. So you failed again as usual.

to under 40% last year. one should note that the figure of 39%

Nah, 40% is in fact 39% and 39% is not real that but only 30% as the great Harry Houdini says. Why would we take his word for it? No reason at all.

they exclude from that number

whomever they exclude from that number they have been excluding them for years so if your argument had any consistency you would have to lower that number for 1982 by the same factor - instead of 57% should be 47%.

Instead of exploring murky ways of 'arry and his wishful thinking and questionable integrity let talk about something else. For example about that weird thread's topic and his even weirder OP. Like WTF?
OP Harry
24 Apr 2016 #9
It could be read both ways not only the way you take it, i.e. more people actually go to church than CBOS states.

It could be taken that way, but all of the available data shows that fewer people go to church than the number who claim to go to church.

Not everybody who isn't in church on that particular Sunday doesn't attend Church services in some or most of Sundays in a year.

You can claim that however what is beyond any claim is that the people who are not in church that Sunday do not go to church every Sunday.

If we take into account that some of those people attending church in 1982 died, if we adjust for the decline of population due to emigration ... we can assume that 17% of difference is not that great.

The data used by the Catholic Church takes into account the decline in population caused by emigration. And a fall from 57% to 39% is not a fall of 17%: is a fall of some 32%, please at least try to tell the truth in your posts.
Ironside 51 | 12,441
24 Apr 2016 #10
is a fall of some 32%,

That is unsupported claim. You keep believing in what you want. Just stop misleading people.

Those are interested in a true state of the affairs in Poland should be advised that there are three groups of people in Poland:
a. those who are even more into church.
b. those that are loosely attached to church
c. those who detach themselves from the church.
B - the most numerous group.
A- growing
C- growing
In which way pendulum will turn it is impossible to say at the moment.
However quality is better than quantity.
Levi 11 | 436
24 Apr 2016 #11
Indeed, i know much more people that are becoming more attached to church for a very simple reason: Practicing catholics, like me, reproduce. Have 2 or 3 kids.

Meanwhile atheists are too busy practicing hedonism.

So naturally the number of practicing catholics tend to increase organically.
OP Harry
24 Apr 2016 #12
That is unsupported claim.

Please stop lying. Stating that a fall from 57% to 39% is a fall of some 32% is simple mathematics (to be exact it is a fall of 31.6%, so rounded to the nearest whole percentage it is a 32%).

And the data itself is most certainly supported: it comes direct from the Catholic Church, who actually count the number of people in each and every Catholic church in Poland on the given Sunday in question.
Ironside 51 | 12,441
24 Apr 2016 #13
And the data itself is most certainly supported: it comes direct from the Catholic Church

But you yourself stated that the CC data give us a drop in Sunday attendance from 57% to 40% which is a simple equation that gives us 17% not 32%.

Your 32% has nothing to do with the CC data but with your calculations which are only your assessment and as such cannot be trusted.
OP Harry
24 Apr 2016 #14
you yourself stated that the CC data give us a drop in Sunday attendance from 57% to 40%

You're lying again: it's down to 39%, as I said above.

which is a simple equation that gives us 17% not 32%.

Catholic church attendance in Poland on a given Sunday is down by 32%. Please stop lying about that. 32% of 57 is 18 (nearest whole number). Catholic church attendance in Poland on a given Sunday has fallen from 57% to 39%, i.e. by 18 percentage points; that means attendance has fallen by 32%.
Levi 11 | 436
24 Apr 2016 #15
No Harry. You are lying.

The CBOS poll is clear: Half of the poles attest that they attend church regularly.

Then you come with the assumption that they are lying. But it is just your wishful thinking as a Turkish Muslim that is trying, without success, to do Dawah at Poland and convert Poles to Islam.
jon357 74 | 22,258
24 Apr 2016 #16
Catholic church attendance in Poland on a given Sunday has fallen from 57% to 39%, i.e. by 18 percentage points; that means attendance has fallen by 32%.

Worth remembering that this is the national figure - in larger cities fewer people practise religion regularly.
Ironside 51 | 12,441
24 Apr 2016 #17
in larger cities fewer people practise religion regularly.

That claim is completely unsubstantiated.

use migrants as material to burnish your latter-day Marxist credentials

Without a doubt their credential should grand them a one way ticket into a loony house for fanatically bigoted slobs with a great sahib complex. Perhaps a cure will be invented one day.
jon357 74 | 22,258
24 Apr 2016 #18
That claim is completely unsubstantiated.

Really? Then you haven't kept up with the scandals in Ursynow megaparish...
Ironside 51 | 12,441
24 Apr 2016 #19
with the scandals in Ursynow megaparish...

What? are you talking about?
Marsupial - | 877
25 Apr 2016 #20
I find it fascinating that humans will go to a temple and worship a higher being they made up. It's kind of cool.
TheOther 6 | 3,664
25 Apr 2016 #21
I find it fascinating that humans will go to a temple and worship a higher being

Not only humans... :)

Jesus
Wulkan - | 3,186
25 Apr 2016 #22
humans have been doing it for thousands of years
Marsupial - | 877
25 Apr 2016 #23
Longer than just mere thousands of years. Time hasn't made it look any less silly.
jon357 74 | 22,258
25 Apr 2016 #24
It's actually a neurological thing. This has been proven by experiments. Regardless of the religion involved, when people are praying or otherwise attending worship, the same part of the brain is working.
terri 1 | 1,663
25 Apr 2016 #25
I find that people only turn to their religion when a) they are gravely ill and about to meet their maker and b) when they are in deep trouble.

The rest of the time they don't give their God and religion a second thought. But when the Grim Reaper (death) calls, then it's on your knees and pray, pray, pray....that is why mostly older people go to church. They are the ones that seek forgiveness, the youngsters still think that they will never get old... (to me that is the only thing that is fair in life, you are born, you live and you die)
RubasznyRumcajs 5 | 498
25 Apr 2016 #26
afaik ca. 15% of population attend the churches regularly.
the others are "wierzący- niepraktykujący" (lege: mostly atheists who christen their kids because of "co ludzie powiedzą?" and don't give a damn about Church's family talking yet wish to have a church wedding).
cms 9 | 1,254
25 Apr 2016 #27
Maybe praying to a deity is nonsense but what is normal and in my view very good for society is having a coherent set of "ground rules" and a time of the week to get together with the people in your community - old and young, rich and poor - and spend an hour or so in the same place.

In my suburban street I see 40-50% of the people in Church most Sundays and in the village where I have my farm its probably more like 80% - I think those figures are more or less stable.
OP Harry
25 Apr 2016 #28
The CBOS poll is clear: Half of the poles attest that they attend church regularly.

Yes, going to church every Christmas is going regularly. But I'm surprised that only half of all Poles go to church every Christmas.
terri 1 | 1,663
25 Apr 2016 #29
People will appear in churches when they are ill and no one can help them. Then the churches will be full.
Ironside 51 | 12,441
25 Apr 2016 #30
afaik ca. 15% of population

Did you pull that number out your ass? Nah, don't answer it stinks.

I find that people only turn to their religion when

You are very observant are you not? Do you think tat form your point of view Sun revolves around Earth or it is the other way around?

It's actually a neurological thing. This has been proven by experiments.

Yep, dumbasses are those most prone to be influenced by others. The point is nowadays they are mostly influenced by atheists and other "intellectual" gurus.

To sum it up most of the rank and file atheists ( or people who have no place for religion) nowadays are just followers, dumb like a carrot. The same people that were called a fanatical mob are still the same fanatical mob but on the side of the atheism. We can observe their antics on this forum.

I find it fascinating that humans will go to a temple and worship a higher being they made up. It's kind of cool.

You haven't hit 30 as yet have you now Supial? Do you think that such a dumb remarket make you look cool and clever? Wrong. Make you like a look junior high geek.

But I'm surprised that only half of all Poles go to church every Christmas.

Hmm ....are you bending backwards now just for an opportunity to lie about something that you have nothing to back it up with?


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