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What makes a man a Pole? what does it mean to be a Pole?


pam
25 Aug 2013 #61
But if someone feels they are Polish through and through, the way you think about being Enlgish, then that's what they are.

I'm sorry but I don't buy this at all.
Just because a person feels an affinity for Poland and all things Polish, if they weren't born there it doesn't make them Polish. I can understand people of Polish descent having a particular affinity for the country, especially if they have been brought up hearing tales about the country by family, but if they were born elsewhere, they're not Polish.

.

There are Polish-born individuals who espouse the cosmopolitan philosophy 'My homeland is where they pay me better' and feel no affinity for their country,

Whether they feel an affinity with their country or not is irrelevant. Just because a person may not be overly patriotic, they are still Polish.

.

there are foreign-born Polonians who are greatly attached to and proud of their ancestral heritage and are always ready to defend it against detractors.

I'm not arguing the fact that many Polonians are proud of their heritage, I'm sure they are, but they are not Polish if they weren't born there, they are of Polish descent.

.

is that how you feel about Britain?

I'm not patriotic if that's what you mean. There are good and bad things about this country, same as anywhere else.
4 eigner 2 | 831
25 Aug 2013 #62
I don't buy this at all

but it wasn't for sale either, Pam (kidding, LOL)
Bieganski 17 | 896
25 Aug 2013 #63
The Ministry of the Interior spells out Polish citizenship requirements: msw.gov.pl/en/documents/ways-of-acquiring-poli/793,Ways-of-acquiring-Polish-citizenship.html

America and other nations may offer unconditional Jus Soli determinations for citizenship to any child born on their soil regardless of the status of the parents. But Poland's rules make it clear that a child born in Poland would either have to have been abandoned by foreign parents or both parents of a child would have to be stateless persons in order for the child to be regarded as Polish.

Furthermore the simplistic view that in order to be Polish you have to be born in Poland ignores the reality of children of Polish citizens being born and raised abroad. No one in their right mind would say that a child born to Polish diplomats or Polish expats stationed in say China is now Chinese.
pam
25 Aug 2013 #64
but it wasn't for sale either, Pam (kidding, LOL)

Yeah, you have to laugh at some of the stuff on this forum :)
4 eigner 2 | 831
25 Aug 2013 #65
just don't get too serious about all this, we're here to pass time and not to make our lives miserable ;-)
mochadot18 17 | 244
25 Aug 2013 #66
You are Polish if you were born in Poland.

STILL THANK YOU!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
4 eigner 2 | 831
25 Aug 2013 #67
you're Polish, no doubt about it but it's not only because you're born there. Now imagine, what if a baby is born in Poland while its parents (both, not Polish) are just visiting Poland and leave the country right after its birth?
50%Polish
25 Aug 2013 #68
Greatness, that all it takes
mochadot18 17 | 244
25 Aug 2013 #69
you're Polish, no doubt about it but it's not only because you're born there. Now imagine, what if a baby is born in Poland while its parents (both, not Polish) are just visiting Poland and leave the country right after its birth?

Well isn't that how the mexicans do it lol come into the U.S pop out a kid to gain access to America although idk if the kids consider themselves american or still mexican considering they were born to Mexicans. But if they were born in the U.S well then they have every right to consider themselves American although I dont think the parents should gain any citizenship through it but thats another topic.
Polonius3 1,000 | 12,446
25 Aug 2013 #70
but they are not Polish

Think Shakespeare's sweet-smelling rose! You can call them Poles, Polish, Polonians, AmPols, AmPolonians, PolAms, Polish Americans, Americans (or Canadians or Brits or whatever) of Polish descent, ancestry, heritage, background, etc. That makes absolutely no difference. But if they feel Polish then they do. And id they don't, they don't. It's as simple as that.
jon357 71 | 21,107
25 Aug 2013 #71
I'm not arguing the fact that many Polonians are proud of their heritage, I'm sure they are, but they are not Polish if they weren't born there, they are of Polish descent.

Yes. It's a huge difference and there comes a time when a family who've emigrated need to decide whether they look to their past or their future.
Wroclaw Boy
25 Aug 2013 #72
I honestly don't see how anybody can be anything other than a human being born on this planet, the same planet as all of us, the planet that provides life for us. Thousands of years ago it was one tribe vs another living in close proximity, then we had larger tribes and villages fighting each other, then civil wars, then countries vs each other to World Wars, now we have religions vs each other.

Patriotism now is no different than tribalism 1000 of years ago, its only the scale and level of ignorance that has changed. Look at how we consider those tribes today.... We consider them primitive and barbaric.
SavageGoose
25 Aug 2013 #73
yes, right.

Good. I agree with you. No borders. No histories. No identities. One world baby!

You should consider taking the Polish city out of your username. It's a tad bit territorial don't you think?
4 eigner 2 | 831
25 Aug 2013 #74
No borders. No histories. No identities

NWO, the worst case scenario possible
Wroclaw Boy
25 Aug 2013 #75
You should consider taking the Polish city out of your username. It's a tad bit territorial don't you think?

Its too far gone for that, i used to love there and my opinions have changed quite a bit over the past 6 years.

Good. I agree with you. No borders. No histories. No identities. One world baby!

History is history, identity also - theyre not going anywhere. I'm talking about the human race evolving past borders and religion, the sooner we sort our ***** out down here the quicker we can break out of our own Solar System.

NWO, the worst case scenario possible

Depending on the perspective, if corporations rule the world with power and profit agendas being in the hands of a few (as it is now) yes it would almost definitely be a bad thing. However if the people manage to take back their power and we are heard and served as we should have been when the constitution was written there may still be

hope.
SavageGoose
26 Aug 2013 #76
Its too far gone for that, i used to love there and my opinions have changed quite a bit over the past 6 years.

Oh, so YOU CAN advertise a Polish connection but OTHERS SHOULDN'T.

Right. Now I see where you are coming from.
Wroclaw Boy
26 Aug 2013 #77
Oh, so YOU CAN advertise a Polish connection but OTHERS SHOULDN'T.

I'm not Polish, im English i just lived there for a few years, i signed up for this forum when i was living in Wroclaw, Poland.
SavageGoose
26 Aug 2013 #78
Using national identities and showing nostalgia are things expected from foolish patriots, primitive tribespeople and their sappy sympathizers. These expressions are alien to any true globalist living in the here and now.

You should change your username to something more consistent with your changed opinions.
OP goofy_the_dog
26 Aug 2013 #79
wb is a socialist man.. progress and only progress.
for me life has a bigger meaning, I love my country and i am a Roman Catholic and socialist neo marxist will ever change it!!

Red is Bad people!
mochadot18 17 | 244
26 Aug 2013 #80
Your country what the one where you're living as in the U.K or the one were you wereborn Poland?????
Polonius3 1,000 | 12,446
26 Aug 2013 #81
whether they look to their past or their future.

One does not rule out the other. An appreciation of one's heritage can make life fuller, richer and more meaingful. Rootlessness can turn a person into a bit of flotsam, batterred by the winds of life and defenceless against fly-by-night commercial and ideological brainwashing.
legend 3 | 664
26 Aug 2013 #82
I honestly don't see how anybody can be anything other than a human being born on this planet, the same planet as all of us, the planet that provides life for us. Thousands of years ago it was one tribe vs another living in close proximity, then we had larger tribes and villages fighting each other, then civil wars, then countries vs each other to World Wars, now we have religions vs each other.

Spoken like a Cultural Marxist.

NWO, the worst case scenario possible

Agreed.

History is history, identity also - theyre not going anywhere. I'm talking about the human race evolving past borders and religion, the sooner we sort our ***** out down here the quicker we can break out of our own Solar System.

We'll be out of the solar system and religion and borders will exist.

Using national identities and showing nostalgia are things expected from foolish patriots, primitive tribespeople and their sappy sympathizers. These expressions are alien to any true globalist living in the here and now.

Globalism is basically NWO.
jon357 71 | 21,107
26 Aug 2013 #83
One does not rule out the other.

Often that's exactly what it does. Aside from those who define themselves by who they are rather than who some of their relatives were.

Rootlessness can turn a person into a bit of flotsam, batterred by the winds of life and defenceless against fly-by-night commercial and ideological brainwashing.

That's just meaningless.
OP goofy_the_dog
26 Aug 2013 #84
its better tovhave a separation for different identies such as a Pole, English etc... it stimulates competition...
the TZM Globalist ideology not only doesnt seem to care about natural beheaviotlr of a man such as greed but also seems to fight our evolutionary advantage of competiyion.

of we will one country... which of course is impossible.. we will become a stagnant society of people who being in one body- one country will lack the competition and orientality of different nations.

this in turn will cause a catastrophe.

NWO is the worst Scenario ever.
abetter dead than red!
Wroclaw Boy
26 Aug 2013 #85
Using national identities and showing nostalgia are things expected from foolish patriots, primitive tribespeople and their sappy sympathizers. These expressions are alien to any true globalist living in the here and now.

Thats complete rubbish, if somebody wants to make their location known to other users they use a place, which is exactly what i did.

You should change your username to something more consistent with your changed opinions.

I assume your screen name is exclusive to you then....

We'll be out of the solar system and religion and borders will exist.

Who's we? There maybe enough resources left for a few to leave by that time, i guarantee the common people will not get to go, ohh no. Only the super rich will get a ticket to the next planet of which to exploit. Just think how much richer the super rich will be by the time we have technology to get out of the solar system. Open your eyes man.

Anyway Legend whats you time scale on when we will have the tech to break out? Religion will not last much more than a few 100 years, borders will be gone long before then. Im just gonna say right now that i think the human race will destroy itself before we get anywhere near the technology required to reach another solar system.

Globalism is basically NWO.

It could be termed that but it doesn't have to be a negative thing.

its better tovhave a separation for different identies such as a Pole, English etc... it stimulates competition...

Im thinking a better motivator would be the fact that there are billions of stars with potential life sustaining planets of which to compete with, think back to the tribe analogy Goofy.

TZM Globalist ideology not only doesnt seem to care about natural beheaviotlr of a man such as greed but also seems to fight our evolutionary advantage of competiyion.
of we will one country... which of course is impossible.. we will become a stagnant society of people who being in one body- one country will lack the competition and orientality of different nations.
this in turn will cause a catastrophe.

You have no idea what you're talking about, were in a catastrophe right now. Crikey if you need evidence go and ask your parents what they had to do in leaving Poland just so they could put food on the table.

Please explain your "which of course is impossible" comment, you cant type things like that with no explanation.
pam
26 Aug 2013 #86
But if they feel Polish then they do

If a person not born in Poland feels Polish then that's fine. Up to them and how they feel, and I'm not knocking anyone for that.

However, feeling Polish and actually being Polish are not the same thing.
Harry
26 Aug 2013 #87
However, feeling Polish and actually being Polish are not the same thing.

That's right.

Rootlessness can turn a person into a bit of flotsam, batterred by the winds of life and defenceless against fly-by-night commercial and ideological brainwashing.

What about the people who pretend to be what they are not and what they refuse to actually be?
Polonius3 1,000 | 12,446
26 Aug 2013 #88
That's just meaningless

Agreed, To those steeped in hedonist-commercialist values, devoid of spiritual and cultural depth, what else is there but the latest consumer hit, trend or market craze that comes along. A person aware of and appreciative of a broader ancestral, spiritual and cultural framework is largely innoculated agaisnt and wary of all the avdertisers triyng to sell him a load of bollocks and empty his bank account.
legend 3 | 664
26 Aug 2013 #89
You are Polish if you were born in Poland.

Two questions..
a)A black man is born in Poland on his way from Ethopia to say Britain. He never intended to stay and was born there by chance, he leaves immediately. Does that make him Polish? I wouldnt think so.

b)The year is 1850. A person is born in Krakow. Poland is off the map. Polish or not?

"A child born to a Polish parent is usually a Polish citizen at birth. This applies whether the child is born in Poland or elsewhere."

You dont have to be born in Poland to be Polish.

Anyway Legend whats you time scale on when we will have the tech to break out? Religion will not last much more than a few 100 years, borders will be gone long before then. Im just gonna say right now that i think the human race will destroy itself before we get anywhere near the technology required to reach another solar system.

I have no idea. Complete guess...

Living on the Moon? 2100-2150
Living on Mars? 2150-2250
Humans leave Solar System? 2200
Humans leave Galaxy? Head explodes.
OP goofy_the_dog
26 Aug 2013 #90
religion exists for the entire human civilization.. i would say that it is a human thing to bdlelieve in something not prploven to or not to exist.

recession is fading away wroclaw boy, in a year ur tzm movement will start losing its followers, whereas the christian values are always needed.
the same as belonging to a nation, of cotse you will dismiss it as some pathetic, being a part of one nation and being in a constant competition with other nations is stimulating human civilizayltion to develop.

next wars will be thought between superpowers in spacee fighting for colonies.. and people will travel in millions to earth to see the Vatican or the Notre Dame etc...

tzm will go in the same bog of forget as did socialism marxism and nazism
i give it a 150 years.


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