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Polish visa expert? Japanes moving to Poland to study Polish.


Buggsy 8 | 98
2 Aug 2012 #31
I'm Japanese planing on moving to Poland to study Polish

I don't see what your problem is,OBAKA. U seem to have got all the answers u were after.
When u get a Karta Pobytu u can use it till it's valid and 45days before it expires u should submit an application if u wish to renew.

U'll need proof that u're still enrolled at university and that u can support yourself financially.
As a student I'm sure u'll only be eligible to apply for permanent residence after 5 years.
WatWat 3 | 43
2 Aug 2012 #32
as it's a piece of paper that confirms your address in Poland - not a paper that confirms your legal stay.

Well, then it's a myth both the immigigration authority, the American embassy in Warsaw and the Norwegian embassy in Warsaw who just accepted my paperwork believes too. According to the Embassies and the local immigration authority where I applied for my card of stay (which I was granted without hassle despite not having one for over 90 days) there's a treaty between the US and Poland that predates Schengen.

Oh, and to get that little piece of paper, I most definately did need to present my tickets out and into the country, and it was ONLY valid for 90 days starting from the entry date into the country, not the date I came in there to get it. They also needed those plane tickets when I got my residency card.

In order for the Norwegian embassy to accept my immigration papers, I had to provide proof that I had legally been residing in the country for six months. That date was reckoned from the date I flew out and back into the country, not the date my card was issued or even the date my application was processed.
Harry
2 Aug 2012 #33
Er, why would the US embassy in Warsaw have anything to do with your legal status with Polish authorities?

According to the Embassies and the local immigration authority where I applied for my card of stay (which I was granted without hassle despite not having one for over 90 days) there's a treaty between the US and Poland that predates Schengen.

Interesting. If Poland did actually go by that treaty, she'd be breaking the commitments she gave when she signed up for Schengen. The whole point about Schengen is that member states are to have the same regulations as each other.
delphiandomine 83 | 17,732
2 Aug 2012 #34
Interesting. If Poland did actually go by that treaty, she'd be breaking the commitments she gave when she signed up for Schengen. The whole point about Schengen is that member states are to have the same regulations as each other.

I'd be very interested to find out about this alleged treaty, too.

Somehow, I don't believe it exists - if it did, why are numerous Americans deported every year from Poland? It would also be a complete absurdity for the treaty to require exiting the Schengen zone, not just Poland.

Seemingly, the American Department of State has never heard of this treaty - travel.state.gov/travel/cis_pa_tw/cis/cis_1000.html#entry_requirements

Ah, Americans... all fun and games, until they get deported.
WatWat 3 | 43
2 Aug 2012 #35
The American Embassy had to get involved for other reasons I'm not comfortable discussing on an internet forum (I know I'm anonymous and all that, but I have my reasons for keepign that private).

As far as Schengen goes, countries do have [limited] soveriegnty on certain matters. I've tried to keep my explanation and links to Schengen protocol limited since that's kind of a tangent to this thread. I love talking legal matters though. If someone opens another thread, I might be tempted to tell more of my story and get into a deep discussion of the rules.
Buggsy 8 | 98
2 Aug 2012 #36
[quote=Harry]The whole point about Schengen is that member states are to have the same regulations as each other.[
Denmark went on to re-impose border controls last year in the name of trying to stop criminal activities from its Schengen neighbours Sweden and Germany.

I wonder if this is still in place..
WatWat 3 | 43
2 Aug 2012 #37
Somehow, I don't believe it exists - if it did, why are numerous Americans deported every year from Poland? It would also be a complete absurdity for the treaty to require exiting the Schengen zone, not just Poland.

No, there's no necessity for me to leave Schengen. Just to leave Poland. I used my plane tix from Norway back. I'm not at home now, but if you're interested, I can see what I can do about scaning in documents, posting emails, ect so long as I can preserve my anonymity. But as I said above, that would be better for another thread.

If there are people actually interested in my adventures in immigration, I can certainly post more info. I just don't want to pull this thread too far off topic since there's no way my life story is at all relevant to the OPs question.

Remember, Norway agrees. I can definately post the email from UDI anonymizing a few bits (in Norwegian of course, but Google translate should do a decent job with it. I assume you'd want the original and not my translation).
Harry
2 Aug 2012 #38
I'd be very interested to find out about this alleged treaty, too.

I'd love to know which Polish politician would sign a treaty which gave US citizens the right to live in Poland for up to six months with no visa but imposes a requirement on Polish citizens to have a visa for any and all visits to the USA. Not even Lepper would be stupid enough to sign that kind of treaty!

Denmark is like the UK and Ireland in that it has certain opt-outs with regard to the Schengen treaty.
Buggsy 8 | 98
2 Aug 2012 #39
Denmark is like the UK and Ireland in that it has certain opt-outs with regard to the Schengen treaty.

UK and Ireland are not in Schengen, Harry!
There are no certain opt-outs with regards to Schengen.
They were in clear violation of the Schengen agreement and I've just checked they actually stopped it in October 2011.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schengen_Area
Check out the heading: Controversies
Harry
2 Aug 2012 #40
UK and Ireland are not in Schengen, Harry!

Really? Have a read of 2004/926/EC: Council Decision of 22 December 2004 on the putting into effect of parts of the Schengen acquis by the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland:

Article 1

The provisions referred to in Article 1(a)(i), (b), (c)(i) and (d) (i) of Decision 2000/365/EC shall be put into effect for the United Kingdom as from 1 January 2005.

The provisions referred to in Article 5(2) of Decision 2000/365/EC shall be put into effect for Gibraltar as from 1 January 2005.

The provisions of the acts constituting developments of the Schengen acquis adopted since Decision 2000/365/EC and listed in Annex I of this Decision shall be put into effect for the United Kingdom and for Gibraltar as from 1 January 2005.

The provisions of the acts constituting developments of the Schengen acquis adopted since Decision 2000/365/EC and listed in Annex II of this Decision shall be put into effect for the United Kingdom as from 1 January 2005.

There are no certain opt-outs with regards to Schengen.

The EU seem to disagree with you:

The participation of Denmark

Although Denmark has signed the Schengen Agreement, it can choose whether or not to apply any new measures taken under Title IV of the EC Treaty within the EU framework, even those that constitute a development of the Schengen acquis. However, Denmark is bound by certain measures under the common visa policy.

europa.eu/legislation_summaries/justice_freedom_security/free_m ovement_of_persons_asylum_immigration/l33020_en.htm
Buggsy 8 | 98
2 Aug 2012 #41
If u read that well u'll understand that it is just co-operation in cross border crime and certain things of common interest like security.

It has nothing to do with free movement of people. Implemanting of provisions governing police and judicial cooperation doesn't mean they become member states.

UK and Ireland do share certain information with Schengen member states and vice versa just like with all the other EEC member nations which are non EU members.

People who travel on Schengen Visas do not have free movement to the UK and Ireland if they come from Visa nations they will have to get UK or Ireland Visas.

After evaluating the conditions that must precede implementation of the provisions governing police and judicial cooperation, the Council consented with its Decision 2004/926/EC of 22 December 2004 that this part of the Schengen acquis could be implemented by the United Kingdom.

Although Denmark has signed the Schengen Agreement, it can choose whether or not to apply any new measures taken under Title IV of the EC Treaty within the EU framework, even those that constitute a development of the Schengen acquis. However, Denmark is bound by certain measures under the common visa policy.

Denmark can opt out on any new measures but they are bound by the free movement of people within Schengen states and thats not a new measure.

That's why in October 2011 they had to stop border control coz they were in clear violation of the common visa policy or should we say they were just exploiting a loop hole

within the free movement of people
Harry
2 Aug 2012 #42
Not exactly the most coherent of positions there.

BTW: eur-lex.europa.eu/en/treaties/dat/11997D/htm/11997D.html#0099010007

and

justice.gov.uk/information-access-rights/transparency-data/jha-schengen-decisions

("The Justice and Home Affairs (JHA) opt-in and Schengen opt-out").
Buggsy 8 | 98
2 Aug 2012 #43
Not exactly the most coherent of positions there.

Nothing to do with coherence there.
My main points are the issues of free movement and border control within the Schengen countries and not the other issues within the agreement.
Denmark can not opt out of that one as it written in all the links u're posting on here. It was the core of the Agreement to start with.

Same applies with the positions of The UK and Ireland they remain non Schengen member states within the EU.
The only things they share with Schengen is the SIS Database and security matters.
The above mentioned are also shared with Norway, Iceland, Switzerland and Liechtenstein which are non EU countries but Schengen member countries. //en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schengen_Area

Read EU member states with opt-outs


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