The Stock Exchange - Poland (GPW ... or WSE). Do you invest?

Hello there,

So do any of you invest in the Warsaw Stock Exchange? If you do, what is your portfolio? Would you like to discuss opportunities in the market?

I think the WSE is not doing poorly, and there are very good chances to make good money in here.

My friend who studied with me in University of Lodz had been doing excellent! With some guidance from him, I was able to do good in this and well, one thing I need to say is that if your portfolio is good your money sure grows!

Before I open this topic, I would like to begin with my own suggestion: Keep in touch with other people who are trading, and always maintain a fairly large portfolio (minimum 5).

Here it is in English: gpw.pl/root_en

So... lets start the discussion?

Mod: Would love if you made it a sticky. I think the topic is really relevant.

Merged: Investing in Polish Stock Market

Within the next year I was planning on investing in the Polish stock market. Anyone have any feedback or advice? I read a thread on this which was from 2007 and it mentioned that it wasn't very wise due to lack of conduct codes in businesses, but its been a few year and I'm noticing that companies' revenues are multiplying at an accelerated rate. What do you guys think?

Transaction costs notoriously high here. Emerging markets ETF to spread the love a bit?

I think that 19% of CGT is a focking ripp off.


BS.It is just like other markets(except for a focking tax).I can also tell you that KGHM seems to be highly undervalued in comparison to it's "western" peers.


True.

18% in the UK.

About 20% CGT is normal in Europe.

Yea ok but there is at least 10.100 CGT allowance and many ways to rise it.That alone leaves AT LEAST 1900 pounds in MY wallet.

If you want to trade with an EU company, Bulgaria is 10% with 10% CIT as well.
If that's not a prerequisite, just offshore with one of the usual suspects


Especially if you don't have the time to do your research.

Tell us first what your portfolio is. And what are your gains made on the guidance of your friend. Are these just paper gains?

Does investing on a stock exchange require a lot of time or does it not? If it does, would you still have time to read through the PF any more?

Will people tell you on a public forum what shares they hold if they're sure they've just bought a goldmine? I once bought a rather small amount of shares of a company, sold it after a year or so with a decent profit, and after another year or so these shares skyrocketed into what would have made a millionaire [in euro terms] of me. This has been the best company of the last ten years or so on the WSE in terms of biggest gains, so if you are an investor, you'd be able to tell its name. Are you prepared to keep your shares for five or ten years?

No, I've never kept a large portfolio. I am or - better say - I used to be a risky investor in shares.

With the figures an individual trader is running, you can forget about a decent return going into straight shares after costs if you rebalance on anything like a regular frequency (eg, quarterly). Exchange costs, fees etc are truly horrendous here.

Better off to stick it in an emerging markets etf with exposure to BRICS, all of whose growth rates are solid double digit. With PL having such strong ties to the Euro and the Euro being borderline f*cked, any PL position without a currency hedge is looking a bit flaky.

My great-uncle made a mint in the city as one of the last of the old generation of traders. His advice was very simple: if you're investing, just follow the market; if you're gambling, you're far better off in the casino or at the Gold Cup as you'll get far better odds there.

There is no such thing as "paper gains" or "paper losses"


Care to elaborate Alex?


Transaction fees are high but to call them horrendous is an exageration.Ever heard of "prowizja liniowa"?


No,you won't.

It doesn't


I have a business of my own, as well as investments in various ventures and stocks. I have time ... and stock market doesn't consumer alot of my time. I have good agents.


Yes. It is not the money for my livelihood... its rather idle money.


You can be risky and still have a large portfolio. Large portfolio helps you to minimize losses.

If you want to make money it does take time and first of all DISCIPLINE.


And also limit your gains.

I didn't mean that. I meant: are you prepared for it if a share price itself is idle for, say, two or three years - aren't you tempted to sell because you've stopped to believe that it can ever go up. That's what happened to me and I have not become a millionaire as a result of my lack of perseverence; I could have sold later on the shares I've mentioned for two million euros approximately.


Imagine that when the market collapses and you are struggling with the double glazing of your window in your appartment on the 15th floor to throw yourself out of it as a result of the crash, the market suddenly recovers and you are saved thanks to the double glazing. The losses that you've made between the crash of the market and its recovery, the ones that you did't materialize (although you've tried to do so through the act of your attempted suicide), but which at some time occured to you, are usually refered to as "paper losses".

When market collapses I am shorting.I never allow myself to lose more than 5%.Now,that's what I mean saying discipline is most important.But I am not an investor,I am a trader.B&H is for idiots.Put your money where your mouth is dude,I will gladly take it (the money not mouth ofc).

I agree that discipline is probably the most important (not only in investing or trading, by the way). As for the B&H strategy, one of the richest people on the planet, Warren Buffet, has made his money using precisely that strategy. What makes you think that he is an idiot?

I am not saying Warren Buffet is an idiot but he also makes mistakes.Now,do you have Buffet's capital?I don't and I can't afford losses he can.B&H is for someone who don't follow markets and is lucky or smart enough to buy at the right time.It has cost me a lot of money to learn that and now when unsure about trend I rather lock in gains or realise losses and go on the sideline.But,everyone has his own strategy.Anyway, good luck!

bbc.co.uk/ news/business-12354402

Commodities still rock'n baby.

And they will in 2011 since FED keeps printing.The FED is the biggest holder of US dept.Budget deficit 1,5 T. Don't US "borrows" money from US?

^ And he ain't whistlin' Dixie:

bloomberg/news/2011-02-08/commodities-to-beat-emerging-market-stocks-in-2011-socgen-s-friesen-says.html

Yes, the US Treasury (public) owes the Federal Reserve (private) roughly $5t for typing a couple of numbers into a computer. That is an awesome business model.


I completely agree. Lots of folks are losing confidence in most types of paper...that will only drive up commodities more until panic mode sets in and metals start getting pushed up again...

And from the deep end....
Guessing by that point, the dollar will lose it's status as the worlds reserve currency and literally be worth nothing. No reserve currency, no value at all. I'll be glad to have invested in that AR15 and the reloading bench. Yea, I'm coming over to steal your water and rice.

How dare they open their mouth again after a certan Jérôme Kerviel had shown they are total crap?


What the hell is AR15?

Name any investment bank of whom you wouldn't say the same following September 2008 - March 2009.

A short list, to be sure.

Probably one of the best long term investments one can make in todays difficult times.

Don't buy into the hype! The best investment is most certainly an M1A1 carbine, with some of the change left over being invested in a titanium crowbar.

But is it really better than the AK-47?


The same? No, I can't name any other investment bank except this French one which had been fooled with such an enourmous fraud by one of its employees. If you can, je suis preneur ...

No other bank was defrauded like SocGen. But most of them willingly bought into mathematical models of risk that even a cursory glance would tell you were at best opaque, and at worst plain wrong. They willingly and deliberately ignored the downside, because right now the bonuses were flowing in.

The guy (Li) who invented the copula model of CDS/MBS pricing was up for a bloody Nobel until the sh1t hit the fan - that's how pervasive the self-delusion in nearly all of the banks was.

And yes, I was there. Very hard to give a lecture on the 'guaranteed return' of equity indices to a bunch of trainee traders in Canary Wharf when behind you the Reuters ticker is telling you the FTSE has just tanked 6% in one hour.

Today I closed nearly all my units in a fund that invests in WSE. I left only 10 units to keep the account. I made this investment in January 2005, for 7.5 years it brought 30% profit. Not bad. Could be much better, 120%, if I closed units in July 2007 (the peak) or nearly 70% in May 2011. Never mind, I am a long term investor. :)

Now I feel it is better to withdraw from stocks as hard times are coming. But I am going to come back in two years time or so.


Of course, it is clean 30, after deducting tax and average annual inflation.

Here is a list:

Barings
Sumitomo
AIB
Socgen
UBS
JPMorgan

and if one includes the with the 2 latest scandals:

Barclays (Libor)
Standard Chartered (Iran)

Could have been worse if you did that late in 2008 or in 2009, I suspect.

If hard times come, and many say they are destined to come, two year's time will be too promptly to come back to the stock market (unless you are a witty investor who invests on your own).


I meant a record loss made by a single trader. I now vaguely remember that the Barrings case involved only one trader...