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Can't get a social security number/PESEL in Poland (I'm from UK)


OP InWroclaw 89 | 1,915
20 Nov 2012 #31
They stare at my passport a lot when I come in and out at the airport, I can tell you. And I don't think it's because they fancy me.
jon357 63 | 14,137
20 Nov 2012 #32
At airports they swipe them, on the Berlin train, nobody even sees them.
OP InWroclaw 89 | 1,915
20 Nov 2012 #33
I don't know what they do, I'll take your word for it. But it seems that they are scrutinising it a lot when I leave and enter unless they're just trying to think of the phrase in English "Geeeezez you've aged since that photo was taken, ain't ya, eh..."
Harry
20 Nov 2012 #34
To not have to deal with the tedious explaining that "no, I don't have one"? ;)

I don't find that at all tedious. Not my problem if their form hasn't been properly designed.
delphiandomine 83 | 17,726
20 Nov 2012 #35
They stare at my passport a lot when I come in and out at the airport, I can tell you. And I don't think it's because they fancy me.

The most hassle I ever get is from the UK, strangely enough.

Even crossing at an obscure small Montenegrin/Croatian border crossing didn't even raise eyebrows, even when I was driving a car registered in Poland!
berni23 7 | 379
20 Nov 2012 #36
At airports they swipe them, on the Berlin train, nobody even sees them.

True dat, i travel to Szczecin every 2 weeks or so and have never been asked for documents.
delphiandomine 83 | 17,726
20 Nov 2012 #37
It happens to me quite a lot when driving/walking across the land border - been stopped several times in Frankfurt (Oder) and Swiecko.
OP InWroclaw 89 | 1,915
20 Nov 2012 #38
Anyone know then -

what can be done with a PESEL-less blue card apart from maybe registering a car and getting car insurance?
if the blue card can be swapped for a plastic card or ID card?
if a PESEL-less blue card can in fact be used to get a PESEL when someone does not have a registered address? Bear in mind I can't just type an address on to my own blue card even if I were that bold, because the card has a number (not a PESEL number, mind) and they use that to look up the details on their computer which says I don't have a registered address and so can't have a PESEL
berni23 7 | 379
20 Nov 2012 #39
It happens to me quite a lot when driving/walking across the land border - been stopped several times in Frankfurt (Oder) and Swiecko.

I am using the train, maybe thats why im so lucky.
Are you beeing stopped on the way in or out?
Harry
20 Nov 2012 #40
As said on page one, as far as I know (from personal experience and from the experiences of others, the most recent of which was the week before last) you do not need a PESEL number in order to register a car in Poland. Who has told you that you do? Have you tried asking them for the legal basis on which they are requiring you to give them a PESEL number before they will let you register a car? Quite often when an desk monkey is saying something they think is true but don't really know, they will change their mind when you ask them about the legal basis for their decision.
jon357 63 | 14,137
20 Nov 2012 #41
. But it seems that they are scrutinising it a lot when I leave and enter unless they're just trying to think of the phrase in English "Geeeezez you've aged since that photo was taken, ain't ya, eh..."

I used to get it all the time with my old passport but never with the new one. Who knows what's in their system.

BTW, if you want to top up a mobile phone online, they actually ask for a PESEL - unbelievable!
OP InWroclaw 89 | 1,915
20 Nov 2012 #42
Harry, I'm at a real disadvantage when I go to these official places as I don't speak Polish. Yes generally they are very pleasant, but few there speak English, so I am very disinclined to be overly-assertive with the actual person there who speaks a little English and who could just get up and walk away if I go all Jeremy Paxman with them.

And yes, definitely that little slip of paper for car reg does have a PESEL on it.

I think you wrote that you do not have a PESEL but you do have car insurance and a car registered in your name. Do you register it every 3 months, as you said in an earlier post...

a) don't buy a car;b) re-register your car every three months;c) move to a new flat (making sure you can get a maldunek there); ord) find somebody who will let you register at their flat for a maldunek.

Did you/your friend register every 3 months or every 5 years, sans PESEL, if I may ask?

BTW, if you want to top up a mobile phone online, they actually ask for a PESEL - unbelievable!

Who does? I top up with 2 different phone companies online, they have never asked me, and I pay via my internet bank.
Harry
20 Nov 2012 #43
And yes, definitely that little slip of paper for car reg does have a PESEL on it.

So shove your passport number in there and tell them that in England a passport number is used where in Poland a PESEL is used.

I think you wrote that you do not have a PESEL but you do have car insurance and a car registered in your name. Do you register it every 3 months, as you said in an earlier post...

Yes I have all of those things and no I most certainly do not register it every three months.

Did you/your friend register every 3 months or every 5 years, sans PESEL, if I may ask?

As said twice above, from personal experience and from the experiences of others, the most recent of which was the week before last, you do not need a PESEL number in order to register a car in Poland.
OP InWroclaw 89 | 1,915
20 Nov 2012 #44
Your "register the car every three months" suggestion was based on what then, if you say you can register a vehicle for longer than 3 months at a time, without a PESEL?

The official rule book, I presume. But, I infer that in practice in your part of Poland at least, the PESEL was not needed. Remains to be seen if that happens here.

I will post again if they allow me to register or decline, so that forum readers can see what the situation is in this neck of the woods. I am yet to even buy the car, for fear of ending up being unable to legally use it. So, it will be a while until I post the results of this little adventure into red tapedom.

edit...
Okay Harry, I think the penny's dropped for me - what you meant was if I have the blue card (even if PESEL-less) then I can register the car for >3 months. Right, I've got it now.
Harry
20 Nov 2012 #45
if I have the blue card (even if PESEL-less) then I can register the car for >3 months. Right, I've got it now.

I had to show my maldunek and that is what got the car registered. However, you could give it a try with your PESEL-less blue card and see what they say.
OP InWroclaw 89 | 1,915
20 Nov 2012 #46
in order to register a car in Poland. What you need is a maldunek (a registered address) and your registration can only be valid for as long as your maldunek is valid for.

OK, so I am now grasping that a maldunek is not the same as my blue card (Res Reg Cert) and that my RRC is not superior to, or a promotion from, the maldunek and won't necessarily open doors for me and as it has no address on it I shouldn't get my hopes up that the car reg office will accept it, but it's worth a try. I can't get the maldunek of course as already explained. Problem is, if I buy the car and they refuse to register it, then it has no insurance and I am stuffed and can't even collect it to drive it to an off road or whatever. And what's more, I hear that a car in Poland has to be insured at all times even if off the road. So, not easy here at all. I don't think I'll ever complain about the UK's system again. Ever.

Just an additional thing occurred to me, or just one more thing, as Columbo would say:
can I get a NIP number if I don't have a PESEL?

The employment opportunity I missed a few weeks ago said if they didn't tax me via my PESEL (which I don't have) I can do a bill to them with a NIP if I have one. Of course, I have no company and no income so I don't have a NIP either. But if I did, can I get my NIP if I am want of PESEL?
Harry
20 Nov 2012 #47
a maldunek is not the same as my blue card (Res Reg Cert) and that my RRC is not superior to, or a promotion from, the maldunek

Your Res Reg Cert confirms you have the right to live in Poland. Your maldunek confirms you have the right to live at the address where you live. You need an address to register a car at.
OP InWroclaw 89 | 1,915
20 Nov 2012 #48
Thanks, Harry

Anyone know about the NIP - PESEL thing... do I indeed need a PESEL to get a NIP? Do I need to nip round to the NIP office to nip my PESEL woes in the budow or pestle my way through the PESEL red tape?
sobieski 107 | 2,128
20 Nov 2012 #49
The pieces of paper are totally useless - barely anyone understands what they are!

Exactly. I had already a few occasions like this. Twice in a bank they asked if it was a photocopy.
OP InWroclaw 89 | 1,915
21 Nov 2012 #50
It looks to me like a person cannot get a NIP if they do not have a PESEL.

The form for the NIP asks for a PESEL number. See below:-

archbip.mf.gov.pl/bip/_files_/podatki/formularze_podatkowe/nip_2006/nip_3.pdf
GabiDaHun 2 | 152
21 Nov 2012 #51
I got a NIP before I got a PESEL. NIPs are pretty much redundant now anyway they are being phased out and mine hasn't been used since Janary.

Sorting out the paperwork has been the single most infuriating thing I've experienced since arriving here. It seems that every 'official' has 10 different ways of doing the same thing. I think the truth is none of the deck jockeys at the town halls actually know what they are talking about. They work on the basis that if they send you away (to anyone else- even with wrong information) then someone else will either sort it out, or it just simply isn't their problem anymore. If you ask 100 of these fools what to do you will get 100 different answers.

The way I got my PESEL (after running around for 3 months) was through my employer. I gave them my NIP and 3month zameldowania, they told me the nip wad useless and that they (I presume the authorities) would generate one for me with proof of employment.

Karta Porbytu wad nearly impossible - we had to get my boyfriends aunt involved, who is a judge in Krakow, even she was totally confused.

Not much help but I feel your pain. The system is ridiculous.
OP InWroclaw 89 | 1,915
21 Nov 2012 #52
The system is ridiculous.

Seems that way!

Thank you for taking the time to post!

I am wondering whether if I ever get my PESEL, it will then allow me to do some paid freelance work because every firm I approached was either disinterested in hiring me or would only give me work if I had a NIP or PESEL. If I can be self-employed or freelance with just a PESEL and no NIP, then I wonder whether I'd still have to pay 300zł ZUS each month whether I made a penny or not. No problem paying tax here based on what I earn, but very hard to start a business when there's a a prescribed ZUS fee payable every month come rain or shine. In the UK, a small business does not have to pay National Insurance or tax if earnings are low (for NI it's called the Small Earnings Exemption certificate and a trader applies for it from the UK DSS).
ska 8 | 13
6 Sep 2015 #53
I will post again if they allow me to register or decline, so that forum readers can see what the situation is in this neck of the woods.

I am basically in the same situation. I do not have PESEL or maldunek, but I have purchased an used car in Wroclaw already. I am struggling to understand what to do and where to do. InWroclaw, please let me know what you have gone through.
delphiandomine 83 | 17,726
6 Sep 2015 #54
You cannot register the car in your name without a registered address in Poland. End of story.
ska 8 | 13
6 Sep 2015 #55
InWroclaw had written extensively how he couldn't get a registered address due to his circumstances. And I would like to hear how he has proceeded since then.
delphiandomine 83 | 17,726
7 Sep 2015 #56
It is very simple to register. Go to the Urzad Miasta with your passport and title to the property that you wish to register at (for instance, a lease, or the purchase document) and you'll be registered for 3 months without any fuss. If you want to register the car for longer, you need to register your right of residence at the Urzad Wojewodzki.


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