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Investment advice - my options in Poland?


zinc 1 | 8    
8 Aug 2012  #1
Hi all,

I've accumulated a small sum (around 15k zl) which I figure I should probably invest somehow since I don't have immediate plans for it. It'll probably grow a fair bit over the next year too.

Can anyone recommend how I should go about finding a good advisor to explain my options in Poland? (I'm in Wroclaw and can speak probably enough Polish to handle a non-English speaker if need be)

My girlfriend has pointed out that banks in Poland fairly openly scam their clients by tricking them into commitments they never intended and that investment funds here are riskier than in other countries due to a lack of regulation. On the other hand inflation is high, and so not putting money somewhere is self defeating, so my feeling is that finding a trustworthy advisor (or two) is pretty critical ...

any help is much appreciated!
pawian 151 | 7,977    
8 Aug 2012  #2
I've accumulated a small sum (around 15k zl)

Yes, it is small, indeed.

My advice: don`t bother to look for an advisor, you will only lose time. Just go and paint the town red for a few nights.
MoOli 9 | 484    
9 Aug 2012  #3
Dont listen to some dsicouraging idiots here,with the amount you have I would recommend buy a small commercial or residential place..rent it and pay it off! and you will learn.thats how I started 27 years back with almost no money,but I am glad you have ambitions!
jasondmzk    
9 Aug 2012  #4
Listen, 15k is plenty worth starting a conversation with an financial adviser. Make an appointment with 3Ts, a well-known Polish outfit, or just your local bank if you prefer. There's dozens of portfolios for minimum buy-ins, and it's never too early or late to think of your future.
MoOli 9 | 484    
9 Aug 2012  #5
Agreed Jason but thats kinda risky for a first time investor thats why I recommended real estate,dont you think he be playing it safe and secure...reslestate he might loose also but will win eventually after a decade or so eventually?
bullfrog 6 | 603    
9 Aug 2012  #6
How on Earth can he get into real estate with 15 k PLN??
jasondmzk    
9 Aug 2012  #7
Distressed properties, usually in conjunction with a like-minded consortium. But that's a game usually reserved for investors with diversified holdings. This fella is looking for a good way to get in on the ground floor. Used to be, bonds were the long-man's game, but stocks and commodities are the sexy alternative. My best advice, balance your gambling with a solid Roth IRA for the your future.
bullfrog 6 | 603    
9 Aug 2012  #8
a solid Roth IRA

For those who, like me, are unfamilair with the US of A, could you please let us know what "a solid Roth IRA" is?
jasondmzk    
9 Aug 2012  #9
A Roth is an IRA account where you set aside money (post-taxes) to accrue interest without further tax penalty. It's for those savvy enough to think towards retirement, even if they're not near retirement age.
delphiandomine 85 | 17,657    
9 Aug 2012  #10
And what makes you think that this is in any way relevant to Poland?

For our Polish members, what is an IRA account and how can they be used in a Polish context?
pawian 151 | 7,977    
9 Aug 2012  #11
How on Earth can he get into real estate with 15 k PLN??

Come on, the choice is abundant:

s

s

Afetr he finds a proper estate, it is extremely important to follow good advice:

buy a small commercial or residential place..rent it and pay it off!

jasondmzk    
9 Aug 2012  #12
Annuities and IRA's have been available through the Polish and Slavic Credit Union for years; and Citibank as well as a half-dozen other money-management accounting firms operating in the Schengen would be more than happy to assist you with anything from ROTH IRA's to virtually any money market you so desire delving.
delphiandomine 85 | 17,657    
9 Aug 2012  #13
Are these products offered on the Polish market in the Polish currency to Polish consumers?

operating in the Schengen

Operating where?

Schengen has nothing to do with financial services.
Wroclaw Boy    
9 Aug 2012  #14
Are these products offered on the Polish market in the Polish currency to Polish consumers?

He talks a good story but there's very little tangible substance in most of the things he says. It always has an "im great" agenda somewhere, always.
jasondmzk    
9 Aug 2012  #15
Schengen has nothing to do with financial services.

I'm saying, Luxembourg will take anybody's money. Anybody in that region, including the non-EU members.

It always has an "im great" agenda somewhere, always

Sometimes you're alright, but often you're just dickish for the sake thereof.
delphiandomine 85 | 17,657    
9 Aug 2012  #16
He talks a good story but there's very little tangible substance in most of the things he says. It always has an "im great" agenda somewhere, always.

I must admit, I'm rather confused as to what relevance the "Polish and Slavic Credit Union" has to someone seeking to invest PLN in Poland. I wonder if this credit union would even accept PLN deposits, let alone offer sensible investments at a sensible return for someone living here?

I'm saying, Luxembourg will take anybody's money. Anybody in that region, including the non-EU members.

Why would someone invest PLN in Luxembourg when there are perfectly adequate banks in Poland which will have a far better knowledge of the PLN than some random guys in Luxembourg?
Ziemowit 12 | 3,311    
9 Aug 2012  #17
There are no small sums. 15k may be quite unimportant for a Wall Street bankster, but is important for you!
Honestly speaking, this is a difficult question. There are no financial advisers who are always right. There is no property which cannot lose in value. There are no sure investments in the harsh times which will come.

If I were you, I would divide this sum into three and try to invest every each one in something different. For one (or even two parts) I would buy foreign currency, but not the Euro. As the Zloty follows the Euro, it is not safe, and may turn even less safe in the future.
Wroclaw Boy    
9 Aug 2012  #18
for the sake thereof.

henstworth, forthwith and tally ho.

There are no financial advisers who are always right. There is no property which cannot lose in value. There are no sure investments in the harsh times which will come.

Yeah its a gamble anyway you look at it.

Personally i would get into FX trading, but then again i have sound knowledge of the PLN - GBP Foreign Exchange market, i have correctly predicted swings of +20% within 3 months, it has been volatile for a while now so you if you apply some fundamental rules you can maybe increase your 15k to 22k within 18 months. But of course you could also lose it.
grubas 12 | 1,392    
9 Aug 2012  #19
My girlfriend has pointed out that banks in Poland fairly openly scam their clients by tricking them into commitments they never intended

No they don't,it is just that people don't read small print on their contracts and then blame everybody but themselves vide Amber Gold lately.

investment funds here are riskier than in other countries due to a lack of regulation

This is simply not true.Actually capital market in Poland is over regulated.As for investment funds they work just like elswhere,you know,risk-reward and stuff.

On the other hand inflation is high, and so not putting money somewhere is self defeating, so my feeling is that finding a trustworthy advisor (or two) is pretty critical

I think banks/advisors can create you individual portfolio if you have at least 100 000 PLN so it's not an option for you.Still,I wouldn't do it.Just open an investment account (rachunek maklerski) in any biuro maklerskie and buy yourself some stocks or bonds.

Personally i would get into FX trading,

I wouldn't go into anything what requires leverage.He has too little money to lose them all within a week.Stocks is what he wants and needs.
OP zinc 1 | 8    
9 Aug 2012  #20
Thanks for the suggestions guys,

I think property is out of my league, minimum in Wroclaw seems to be about 5k per m2, but it is I think the best investment here generally since rents are often high enough to cover mortgage repayments and prices keep going up.

Ziemowit's idea of spreading across three currencies seems a good one or at least 3 different baskets. And yeah grubus I think you're right about the fine print though I'm a bit overwhelmed every time I have to sift through it.

In terms of stocks I'm considering it, the problem for me is my lack of knowledge of the local market but it's much more rewarding on a personal level to buy and sell shares than fight with banks and fine print.

Anyhow, I started asking at a few banks today and the range of options is quite large, and sometimes I'm limited by being a non-permanent-resident which is a bit annoying. a friend suggested 'open finance' so I'll take a look there next.
pip 10 | 1,661    
9 Aug 2012  #21
I also agree with Ziemek. Try the big name banks PKO and Pekao. Stay away from the smaller ones.
SeanBM 35 | 5,809    
9 Aug 2012  #22
I'd say your safest bet is the bank, stick it in a deposit account for a year, you'll get about 6%.

I always fancied buying a load of Maluchs

They stopped making them and if you have a place to store them, they will be worth more in 20 years when they are mostly gone but that's just a fun thing to do, you could also 'pimp' the maluch:

Small car from Poland

An whoever suggested real estate is off his rocker, 15,000 with notary fees, contract etc... buying American bond you'd lose on the exchange rate, buying foreign currencies you'd be as well off investing in Amber Gold....

You could easily set up and company and website for that, if you have any ideas for such a venture.
pawian 151 | 7,977    
9 Aug 2012  #23
you'll get about 6%.

Sorry, 3.5%, below inflation level.
SeanBM 35 | 5,809    
9 Aug 2012  #24
Is this a negotiation Pawian?

Bank BPH term deposit 1 year PLN 4.20%
grubas 12 | 1,392    
9 Aug 2012  #25
4.2 is much closer to Pwian's 3.5 than yours 6%.You also need to take into account 19% CGT.
SeanBM 35 | 5,809    
9 Aug 2012  #26
I got offered 6.2%.
pawian 151 | 7,977    
9 Aug 2012  #27
Is this a negotiation Pawian?

I provided the rate from the banks suggested by PiP.

I also agree with Ziemek. Try the big name banks PKO and Pekao. Stay away from the smaller ones.

PKO BP offers about 3.5%

I got offered 6.2%.

Remember, smaller banks are suspicious.
MoOli 9 | 484    
10 Aug 2012  #28
lol! citibank handloway has 10 %:)))))) so shove it!(quote: for 1 month only if you change ur money in pln)
pawian 151 | 7,977    
10 Aug 2012  #29
Zinc, don`t listen to some encouraging idiots here who may try to tempt with you 10% or more. Just follow the advice a few posts earlier.
Harry    
10 Aug 2012  #30
I happen to have a few accounts with Citibank, so I just checked their time deposits: one-year lock up rate is 3.9%.


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