The BEST Guide to POLAND
Unanswered  |  Archives 
 
 
User: Guest

Home / Language  % width posts: 49

Tusk's uvular 'r' when speaking in Polish


Polonius3 1,000 | 12,448
12 Jun 2013 #1
Both Tusk and Gronkoiwcz-Waltz are probably the best-known politcal celebrities to pronounce the 'r' sound the French or uvular way. Is that just a speech defect or an optional pronunciation? The reason I ask is I recall I had encountered several uvular speakers in the Szczecin area. Could thatpossibly have been a leftover of the 'autochtoni' in that area or maybe an element of Kashub pronunciation?
Lyzko
12 Jun 2013 #2
Very possibly. While I don't believe I've ever heard either of those two individuals speak, the influence of Kashubian, hence of the North German uvuluar 'R', is doubtless present:-)
Polson 5 | 1,771
12 Jun 2013 #3
Really, the French/uvular 'r'? Never noticed... If you have a vid, I'd really like to see it, quite curious ;)
Lyzko
12 Jun 2013 #4
I too:-)
cinek 2 | 337
12 Jun 2013 #5
Is that just a speech defect

yes
OP Polonius3 1,000 | 12,448
12 Jun 2013 #6
Tusk and Gronkowiec are on TV often enough these days. Just watch the news for a few days and I'm sure you'll see and hear them.
OP Polonius3 1,000 | 12,448
12 Jun 2013 #8
So now you're against people using the uvular 'r'?
sobieski 107 | 2,128
12 Jun 2013 #9
Gronkoiwcz-Waltz

You are still not able to write the name of Warsaw's City President correctly I see.
OP Polonius3 1,000 | 12,448
12 Jun 2013 #10
I was going to call her Duckgirl but thinking up respectful names for leading political personalities is your forte.
sobieski 107 | 2,128
12 Jun 2013 #11
I was going to call her Duckgirl

You mean as competition for Marta Kaczyńska ? Btw I suppose in your definition of Polishness Kashubians do not qualify ?
When we are talking about the French "r" - you of course behave as an idiot again. I myself have a most Frech "r" when I speak Polish and neither the Prime Minister nor the City President have it.
AdamKadmon 2 | 508
12 Jun 2013 #12
Really, the French/uvular 'r'? Never noticed... If you have a vid, I'd really like to see it, quite curious ;)

To roll one's "r's" as the French do was once considered an aristocratic preserve, so-called grasejowanie. Watch the video making fun of this pronunciation, particularly Ludwik Sempoliński's (starozakonny książe) part faking that mania: żądam satysfacji z bRonią w Ręku...

Watch from 7:00 time stamp:
sobieski 107 | 2,128
12 Jun 2013 #13
Polonius as "an afterthought" tried a different angle of sniping. Notice "the autochtoni" or the Kasiubian angle.
AdamKadmon 2 | 508
12 Jun 2013 #14
a false track

That's the official version of Tusk's unsavoury first name:

Julianna Tusk (babcia) wyjechała w młodości za granicę i ponoć zachwyciła się pewnym brytyjskim lordem o imieniu Donald. Dlatego tak dała na imię swemu synowi, który z kolei przekazał je własnemu dziecku.

So we are once again on the aristocratic track.
sobieski 107 | 2,128
12 Jun 2013 #15
Tusk's unsavoury first name:

The only unsavoury first name I could imagine would be Adolf.
Maybe you could copy the complete link, so that we know it does not come from fronda.pl?
Actually I just found it....www4rzeczpospolita.blox.pl/2007/10/BIOGRAFIA-DONALDA -TUSKA.html
The source tells everything.
AdamKadmon 2 | 508
12 Jun 2013 #16
Maybe you could copy the complete link, so that we know it does not come from fronda.pl?

nonsensopedia.wikia.com/wiki/Donald_Tusk
OP Polonius3 1,000 | 12,448
12 Jun 2013 #17
neither the Prime Minister nor the City President have it.

Coudl be if they ditched it overnight. But yesty both were on TV uvulating away.
sobieski 107 | 2,128
12 Jun 2013 #18
Do you have a problem with a French "r".? As in relation not being able to write GW's name properly?
Warszawette - | 128
12 Jun 2013 #19
Hi! There is not such a thing as a "French "r" since this letter is pronounced in a lot of different manners acccording to areas. It can be rolled or pronounced almost like a Spanish "j" (which I do) and alot of other varieties.
OP Polonius3 1,000 | 12,448
12 Jun 2013 #20
City President

That's not English, it is mayor. For a foreigner your English is OK, but not always.
sobieski 107 | 2,128
12 Jun 2013 #21
Polonius only uses this to snipe from a a different angle at his favourite enemies. He forgot to mention President Komorowski :)
Though why Kashubians would talk with a French accent?
Me, coming from a trilingual country, am convinced the French "r" exists. My French friends here in Poland for sure have it, and my wife and daughters are convinced I have it as well.
OP Polonius3 1,000 | 12,448
12 Jun 2013 #22
sobieski
Komorowski defintiely does not use the uvular 'r'.
Did you fail to see this post:

Very possibly. The influence of Kashubian, hence of the North German uvular 'R', is doubtless present:-)

AdamKadmon 2 | 508
12 Jun 2013 #23
Very possibly. The influence of Kashubian

Uvular R is not one of the phonological and phonetic characteristics of Kashubian.
pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Język_kaszubski#W.C5.82a.C5.9Bciwo.C5.9Bci_j.C4.99zyka_kaszubskiego

It must be about Mr Tusk's fatuously haughty, aristocratic air he is exuding.
OP Polonius3 1,000 | 12,448
12 Jun 2013 #24
Tusk's fatuously haughty, aristocratic air

But Tusk defintiely is unaristocratic in appearance. Looks more like a chłopek-roztropek and the shifty eyes make him look suspect.. Komorowski deifnitely proejcts the aura of a traditonal Polish szlachciura, esp. when he sported his moustache.
Wulkan - | 3,251
12 Jun 2013 #25
Is that just a speech defect

yes

If you have a vid, I'd really like to see it, quite curious ;)

I too:-)

you guys are dumb or just pretend that never heard about youtube?

Nina Terentiew is the best example of person with the so called "French r" speech defect...
AdamKadmon 2 | 508
12 Jun 2013 #26
But Tusk definitely is unaristocratic in appearance. Looks more like a chłopek-roztropek and the shifty eyes make him look suspect..

I couldn't agree more. He could have been an excellent professional soccer player. Being a politician, he wasted his talent.
Lyzko
12 Jun 2013 #27
On occasion, I think I've heard some Polish native speakers (both from Cracow, by the way!) use the uvular/"French"/"High German" 'R' when saying, for instance "baRdzo", instead of rolling it off the tongue or trilling it "baRRRRdzo", the way I've always heard it pronounced.

It's probably just a coincedence, however. Either that, or my hearing's defective (which is also possibleLOL)
a.k.
12 Jun 2013 #28
the tongue or trilling it "baRRRRdzo",

It must have been szpieg z krainy deszczowców! Karramba! :)
Lyzko
12 Jun 2013 #29
No, somehow I don't think so. I'm pretty sure they were respectively both speaking Polish:-) Spanish and Italian however do also have almost an identical trilled R-sound'LOL
OP Polonius3 1,000 | 12,448
13 Jun 2013 #30
The trilled 'r' that exists in Polish, Spanish and Italian is not the same as the guttural uvular one. The former is made by vibrating the tongue against the back of the upper teeth whilst the flatter throaty one -- by vibrating the uvula.


Home / Language / Tusk's uvular 'r' when speaking in Polish
BoldItalic [quote]
 
To post as Guest, enter a temporary username or login and post as a member.