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Are Poles grateful to the Russians for winning the war?


Sire Brenshar 1 | 61
2 Oct 2011 #91
on the INTERNET forum, not likely.

I can only wonder why you put the emphasis on "internet"...

Either way, Socrates must back up his claims, otherwise what he says are just his utterly subjective opinion. And as such, useless to the debate.

Define the communist era.

The years around those leading up to the fifties (end of majority of Polish resistance), to 1989.

Are you sure it was Polish history that had been taught ?

Not solely, but yes. Polish history was taught.

Why you asking irrelevant question, Poles were murdered by the ten of thousands after the WWII by the Soviets.

Rather than tell me I'm saying irrelevant questions, which were not even addressed to you, answer them.

I repeat. Were there any mass murders of Poles after the Soviets had assumed control?

You notice my carefully worded sentence? No, its not because I'm trying to narrow the subject into a period of time that backs my point, but rather to show Socrates wrong: If the Soviets wanted to exterminate the Poles, why did they become so lethargic and lax about it when they had full control? Why is it that once they built their own nuclear weapons, meaning when the West no longer had any advantage over them, did they no longer feel the need to end, freely, polish existence?
1jola 14 | 1,879
1 Nov 2012 #92
I repeat. Were there any mass murders of Poles after the Soviets had assumed control?

Old thread, but YES.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/August%C3%B3w_roundup
legend 3 | 664
1 Nov 2012 #93
I am not sure if this is true about Hitler, but I read that he wanted to kill most of Polish society/peoples.
If his plans worked out, I would prefer Communism (assuming the leaders of the latter didnt have the same/similiar plan). So in a way yes I am slightly thankful. I think the events of the Warsaw Uprising were sad too.

At the same time, Communism and Stalin destroyed or made Poland lag compare to western Europe.
There were pluses and minuses to Communism, but I think most will agree there were more negatives.

Communism was partly forced onto Poland and partly accepted by Poles. Thats why I try to avoid bashing Russians today over that time period.
I think Stalin and the early leaders of ZydoKomuna were quite evil against Poles.

Both Stalin (and earlier leaders) and Hitler were asses.
Vlad123 7 | 204
1 Nov 2012 #94
Ditto, although I have no real idea how much was lost because its all gone. Even my parents death in 1991 was a direct result of the Soviets actions.

Doesn`t it seems strange to you that on every thread of this forum immideately appears few people who readily describe picturesque atrocitities toward them by either Soviets or Ukrainians (about whoever your start conversation) and NONE ever mentioned attrocities by German Nazies? Sorry but this is just statistically impossible.If nomber if dead by hand of Russians and Ukrainians are is mesured in thousands (that even Polish sources clam) it should be 0.0??% of total Polish population.And all of them are on this forum?

To such People as ``legend`` and ``Shasha`` Guys do not you seem that you are wasting time on this forum?Do you seriously take this eywash?
1jola 14 | 1,879
1 Nov 2012 #95
This thread related to Russians, when a thread relates to Germans, we talk about them. I could join on both threads with family stories. Plenty of crimes and barbarity to go around. Don't worry, when the foreign experts wake up, you'll get plenty of Soviet crimes whitewashed.
eliseusz
14 Oct 2014 #96
No. They won the war for themselves, but they just conqueried us. Why should poland be grateful. It is like living under attila the hun only to have him expelled and live with genghis khan the mongol. Thousands of poles were killed by them.
solidarity - | 15
14 Oct 2014 #97
Thank you for helping to defeat the Nazis (after helping them defeat us in 1939) but no thank you for putting up an Iron Curtain for the next 50 years

Did I cover all angles?
Korwin - | 17
8 Dec 2014 #98
I for one am grateful to the Soviets for their effort in the war. I do also feel ppl try to minimize their role in winning the war. One person here claimed there were allies who had helped with that. Yes, but not to the degree that the Soviets did. And those allies at the beginning of the war were actually sympathetic to the Nazi's and saw their crusade against Communism a just action.

Katyn, a lot - no - most Poles always throw that out there. What happened to those officers and elites is of course terrible but until 1953 everyone accepted that Katyn was a Nazi crime. Has anyone here actually heard the Russian arguments claiming it was a Nazi crime?

Katyn aside, and agreeing it was a terrible crime, how do most Poles still use Katyn and retaking kresy as an argument to still have a dislike towards Russia BUT at the same time be able to forgive and forget all Germany has done? It's incredible how much Russophilia exists in Poland. Lech Wałęsa once even suggested that Poland and Germany should unite! This was recent in an article from Onet. If we're going to use history as a pretext for dealing with our neighbors presently then if one was consistent we would not have very many friends around us.
Marsupial - | 888
8 Dec 2014 #99
Yes, I am greatful for russia winning the war. Greatful for the pact in the first place with germany which allowed nazis free reign unleashed on europe without the worry of a second front. Greatful for their invasion shortly after. Greatful for 50 years of commie filth. At the moment I am greatful for every agressor on the planet wielding an ak47 or another russian idea. Greatful for yet another broken russian treaty in ukraine and the shooting down of that plane full of australians. I guess no matter where I go backward russian dogs will kill my country man and woman and children. Greatful for 44 in warsaw too, every day I pray to god to thank him for blessing us with this dieseased mental trash on our planet. I will be especially greatfull when a massive asterod wipes this fungus from the planet so we can use the area for actual people.
z0ltan - | 2
8 Dec 2014 #100
Poles have a rabid and inexplicable hatred for Russia mingled with blatant undertones of fear, mostly due to a feeling of inferiority.Throughout history, Poles have been aggressors towards Russian lands and Russian people (even trying to usurp the Tsar's throne), but have been thwarted and repelled by their superiors. Moreover there is an attitude amongst Poles of trying to hide their Slavic roots by trying to act like Westerners. Laughable, really.
Szenk88HTAFC 2 | 47
8 Dec 2014 #101
Z0ltan

Laughable really

Not as funny as that post though. Many lols to be had.
Paulina 9 | 1,448
8 Dec 2014 #102
Poles have a rabid and inexplicable hatred for Russia mingled with blatant undertones of fear

Yes, of course, just like Ukrainians, Estonians, Lithuanians, Latvians, Georgians, Romanians, Chechens, etc. - all of them have this "rabid" and especially "inexplicable" (lol) what you call "hate" to those "superior" Russians and their "friendly, nice, warm and fuzzy, white and fluffy neighbour" Russia :)

Moreover there is an attitude amongst Poles of trying to hide their Slavic roots by trying to act like Westerners.

I'm sorry z0ltan but cherishing democracy, freedom of media and human rights as well as respecting borders of neighbouring countries isn't exactly "hiding our Slavic roots" :)

Not as funny as that post though. Many lols to be had.

I agree, z0ltan is some sad (and funny in a way) Russian troll lol
Szenk88HTAFC 2 | 47
8 Dec 2014 #103
Paulina

I agree, z0ltan is some sad (and funny in a way) Russian troll lol

I guess he is just mad that Russia can't even invade Ukraine without their economy crumbling ;)
Korwin - | 17
8 Dec 2014 #104
Yes, I am greatful for russia winning the war.

This is a prime example of Polish russophobia, blame Russians for what happened to Warsaw in '44; not the Nazi's that actually murdered about 200,000 of the civilians and destroyed 80% of the city, never mind the confiscated or stolen works of art. No let's blame the Russians.

The airplane that was shot down by the Russians, use some logic, if not the lack of evidence that show Russians had nothing to do with it. Russians showed their satellite pictures and dared NATO and the US to do the same, did they? No. The Russians also questioned Kiev why they had even allowed for a civilian aircraft pass through a war zone, Kiev still hasn't answered. Also there was a deleted BBC footage showing a lady interviewing some civilians about the crash that claimed it was an aircraft that shot it down. It was never aired on BBC, only YouTube. A slow clap for your arguments sir, you represent Poles well especially when you wish for the death of a people who you consider sub human... I guess you learned something from the Nazi's.
Marsupial - | 888
8 Dec 2014 #105
Your words are irrelevant time and time again russia has proven to be a horde of un civilized backward barbarians. There is no such thing as russo phobia or any other made up term and words are cheap. Its laughable that you are on here trying to sound reasonable when time and time again you stab and betray. As if anyone believes a word you say. Laughing stock of the word. A regime of mass murdering lunatics with 200 year old views of the world hampering progress of human kind. Get over the nazi thing you regressive lemmings the war is over long time ago and you are the nazi after all you signed the pact and you helped the nazi start the war. This forum like all your newspapers and other media coming from russia is filled with your rubbish excuses and deranged lies.
Korwin - | 17
9 Dec 2014 #106
You seem to not have any need for intellectual debate. You dismissed any arguement I presented and went right into russophobe mode.
Why would you call me a Nazi when it's you who are preaching Nazi doctrine?
Szalawa 3 | 248
9 Dec 2014 #107
I agree, z0ltan is some sad (and funny in a way) Russian troll lol

He already claimed he is from India. Although this posts are far fetched, there are some truths to them...
Marsupial - | 888
9 Dec 2014 #108
Well Kowin why did the latest war on your border shoot down civilians. I dont even care who did it perhaps not russia at all. Jusr after you lot sheited yet on anotber treaty this time with ukis. Great way to make friends. You see a lack of debate? Perhaps it's the missle you are holding to some neighbours head at any given time? This makes debate difficult.
Korwin - | 17
9 Dec 2014 #109
I must admit I'm finding it hard to follow what you are talking about. Shooting down innocent civilians? You're blaming Russians but then you say you don't care who did it? From what I can see and I can post many video sources for you it's the new Kiev government bombing Donbas. Much like Tudjman bombed the Serbs out what he considered Croat territory. All events in East Ukraine have very many similarities with Yugoslav wars. So I do agree with you innocent are being killed however I think you're pointing the finger in the wrong direction. That's besides the point, this was supposed to be a discussion about WWII. We left off when you ignored Nazi atrocities and can't help but blame Russians for their crimes. If you wish to discuss that further please do. Also, it's in very poor taste to assume I'm Russian; and throwing allegations that I have a missile to my neighbor? Your comments reveal that you have low intellect and poor etiquette.
Paulina 9 | 1,448
9 Dec 2014 #110
He already claimed he is from India.

All kinds of trolls claim all kinds of things on this forum. I don't believe any of it anymore and I judge their nationality by what they write.

And judging by what z0ltan has written he's a Russian nationalist.

Also, Zoltan is a name of a Hungarian prince and one of the characters in a Polish game "The Witcher" and this game seems to be very popular among Russian men, as far as I've noticed.

I don't see any clues leading to India though :)

Although this posts are far fetched, there are some truths to them...

Are there? I guess you could also find "some truths" in comments of an anti-Semite or a racist, but I don't care about such "truths", to be honest.
Jadowniki 1 | 24
29 Dec 2014 #111
No why should we be thankful to soviets, it is like having the mongols replace the huns, it is one evil taking the place of another.
Korwin - | 17
29 Dec 2014 #112
Not exactly. While the Soviets were indeed cruel and did persecute Poles that were part of the western gov't (AK rebels) they did not create a ghetto pot concentration camps to the general public. The Nazi's had a plan to systematically liquidate the Polish population; germanise those who would be able to and destroy anyone who wouldn't be able to be "rehabilitated". Yes, the Soviets destroyed any challenge to foreign influence coming from the outside. But they did not persecute the civilian population. Do any of you here have contact with relatives from Poland? Grandparents? I know that from my side of the family that not one of our family members were ever persecuted during Soviet rule.
weeg
30 Dec 2014 #113
The Russians deported over a million Poles to Sibera and exected 22000 at Katyn. That is a systematic genocide, just like the Nazi's.

(AK rebels )

Thanks for confirming that you are a Russian propagandist.
Jadowniki 1 | 24
30 Dec 2014 #114
Korwin, the Soviet occupation of Poland was not as dramatic as the german one, but it was no less evil oppressive and destructive. My parents are from poland, and while none of my family was directly attacked by the soviets, my babcia still remembers both occupations with tears in her eyes.

The german occupation was one of ethnic extermination, the Soviet of political extermination. They were, like the germans, destroying our identity. The soviets deported over a million polish civilians to siberia, they killed thousands of us at katyn and else where. And while the soviets were "liberating" poland they stole furniture, destroyed property, raped woman and young girls, executed polish partisans. Even after the war, the soviets and there communist allies stood in poland till the 1950s. A unknown hopeless Partisan war ensued, in which 100,000 thousand poles would die. Russian troops would stay in some area of poland till the 80s even if poland was not part of the Soviet union. That sounds like mongols to me. The only difference between the nazis and the soviets is that the germans were loud killers, and the soviets were silent ones.
R.U.R.
2 Jan 2015 #115
I'm sure the gratitude must be mutual .
Russian must be grateful for Poland's refusal to join Drang nach osten (March to the East)
for breaking of Enigma code and for involving Great Britain into the war, each item was of supreme importance for the outcome of the war

IMHO, Stalin's atrocities (or ZydoKomuna's as Legend put it in his post above) are nothing compared to the extermination planned by the Fuhrer
johnclark 1 | 4
2 Jan 2015 #116
I guess the Poles were "liberated" to just become slaves to judeo-consumerism that the USA brought to Europe.
jon357 63 | 14,600
2 Jan 2015 #117
to just become slaves to

Certainly, the modern age has brought problems, like immigrants from another continent trying to make illegal sham marriages etc.

Oops, hang on a minute, didn't you start a thread about that?
johnclark 1 | 4
2 Jan 2015 #118
And that doesn't have to do with the topic. Getting married with my best friend to stay here has nothing to do with the consumerism culture that has dominated European culture and has only brought in millions of uneducated, violent immigrants to Europe. My grandfathers fought and died in Europe, but I think they would be disgusted as to what they died for. My great-grandparents are from Sweden and Denmark, so I am not the problem here
R.U.R.
2 Jan 2015 #119
Greatful for yet another broken russian treaty in ukraine

Well, Russia and the USA promised to defend the Ukraine from a nuclear attack.
Do you think the Ukraine has experienced the atrocity of nuclear bombardment?

especially if the Poles were covertly aided by the Americans.

hahahaha.........

. .....Moreover there is an attitude amongst Poles of trying to hide their Slavic roots by trying to act like Westerners. Laughable, really.

Not laughable, it is ridiculous, really.

Unlike Russia, Poland has always been a Christian country, moreover Poland has always been a Catholic country, that is she belonged to the Western Church that for centuries shaped Western civilization and culture.

Unlike Russia, Poland has experienced all western trends like European integration, renaissance, enlightenment etc. Unlike Russia or Germany, Poland has never beget non - European trends like communism or Hitlerism.

Anyway, Poland is more Slavic than Russia due to geographical location and historical events
R.U.R.
18 Jan 2015 #120
Still about the consequences of the war and about the gratitude :

..... consumerism culture that has dominated European culture and has only brought in millions of uneducated, violent immigrants to Europe
My grandfathers fought and died in Europe, but I think they would be disgusted as to what they died for. My great-grandparents are from Sweden and Denmark, so I am not the problem here

Well, none - European education can present a problem too :

wiki/Barbara_Lerner_Spectre
wiki/Barbara_Spectre

I think there's a resurgence of antisemitism because at this point in time Europe has not yet learned how to be multicultural, and I think we're gonne be part of the throes of that transformation, which must take place. Europe has not yet learned how to be multicultural. Europe is not going to be the monolithic societies that they once were in the last century. Jews are going to be at the center of that. It's a huge transformation for Europe to make. They are now going into a multicultural mode, and Jews will be resented because of our leading role. But without that leading role, and without that transformation, Europe will not survive.

- by Barbara Lerner Spectre


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