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Memos show US hushed up Soviet crime against Poland


peterweg 36 | 2,316
11 Sep 2012  #1
AP Exclusive: Memos show US hushed up Soviet crime

WARSAW, Poland (AP) - The American POWs sent secret coded messages to Washington with news of a Soviet atrocity: In 1943 they saw rows of corpses in an advanced state of decay in the Katyn forest, on the western edge of Russia, proof that the killers could not have been the Nazis who had only recently occupied the area.

The testimony about the infamous massacre of Polish officers might have lessened the tragic fate that befell Poland under the Soviets, some scholars believe. Instead, it mysteriously vanished into the heart of American power.

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National Archives page on Katyn: archives.gov/research/foreign-policy/katyn-massacre/
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Randy Herschaft reported from New York. AP reporter Monika Scislowska contributed from Warsaw.
___
Vanessa Gera can be reached at
twitter.com/VanessaGera and Randy Herschaft at twitter.com/HerschaftAP
news.yahoo/ap-exclusive-memos-show-us-hushed-soviet-crime-132109652.html?_esi=
Ironside 47 | 9,587
11 Sep 2012  #2
Yes, there is nothing new about that news.
Both Stalin's partners kept well his secret i.e. Britain and the USA.
teflcat 5 | 1,032
11 Sep 2012  #3
These facts, as you know, were not revealed until 1990, when the Russians officially apologized to Poland."

Thomas Gerth's quote, of course, not peterweg's.
This is the worst kind of bureaucratic bs. American and British failure to challenge Stalin in 1943 is understandable, but by 1951 there was no good reason why this atrocity couldn't have been exposed. I wonder whether it was a case of "Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when first we practise to deceive".
delphiandomine 84 | 17,703
11 Sep 2012  #4
Yes, there is nothing new about that news.

Nothing at all, but it might make people realise that America is not the ally that certain quarters believe she is.
BBman - | 344
11 Sep 2012  #5
No surprise. I'd like to know what else has been "hushed up" about the war...
pawian 157 | 8,627
11 Sep 2012  #6
Yes, there is nothing new about that news.

Iron, I have to agree with you at last.

Americans covered Soviets whenever it suited their interest.

Sad but true and we can`t help it.
p3undone 8 | 1,135
12 Sep 2012  #7
Pawian,as much as I hate to admit it,you are absolutely correct and it is sad that America has covered for the Soviets when it suited our purpose.Ironside,I also agree with you;as I have known about this for quite a while,in fact this has been discussed on here before.I guess this is about official recognition of the fact.
legend 3 | 664
12 Sep 2012  #8
This doesnt surprise me...

Now sorry to bring this old topic back...it is possible that Russia and USA are hushed up about "truth" of Smolensk crash?

(ps I believe it was an accident and all Poles shouldnt have been on same plane).
p3undone 8 | 1,135
12 Sep 2012  #9
Legend,their are other threads for this discussion and this one is about the Katyn massacre.
Tim Bucknall 7 | 98
22 Nov 2012  #10
American and British failure to challenge Stalin in 1943 is understandable, but by 1951 there was no good reason why this atrocity couldn't have been exposed

supposedly they wanted Soviet help to end the Korean war. (according to tv news reports)

but no such excuse existed in 1979 when the Labour government tried to block the construction of the Katyn Memorial at Cannock,
Luckily the people of cannock told "Sunny Jim" Callaghan to get stuffed and built the monument anyway. no labour politicians were present for the dedication ceremony


  • Katyn Monument- pse excuse my deranged expression. i hadn't slept!
johnb121 4 | 184
22 Nov 2012  #11
It is a fact that politicians are in it for themselves, and any "good" they do is generally done so that it reflects well on them. It's increasingly noted in the UK that the so called "special relationship" between the UK and US does not exist, except in the minds of self-serving politicos who want to fly to the US and have their photos taken with Obama. The USA looks out for itself, with the interest of alleged allies a long way down the list of priorities. That has been so for a long time, and for sure back to the time of Katyn (for confirmation, consider the actions of the US in the early days of WW2, when they sold then loaned materiel to the UK and avoided any form of actual support for a long time before finally coming in on the side of those fighting Hitler). For a period of years, the US acted in what it saw as it's own interest and stayed out of the war. British people of my father's generation has nothing but for contempt for the US, which stood on the sidelines until most of Europe was overrun and Poles, French, Dutch, etc people could only fight via exile armies or the underground. What's the figure? A million Poles fighting in exile for their country, while the US looked on? I can believe that the US turned it's blind eye to Katyn and more during WW2, bc ause it served the US' interests to do so.
jon357 63 | 14,341
22 Nov 2012  #12
A very cynical point of view. And a thread that's harping on about the past.
johnb121 4 | 184
22 Nov 2012  #13
So, jon357, how recent must an event or an attitude be to be "relevant? For me, the point is that the US has, for a long time, acted first, second and third in it's own interests and I would therefore believe those for whom Katyn is still an important (and unresolved) issue the right to be sceptical about America's role in covering it up. It was a dreadful event, which impacted on Poland and her people for many many years. Huge numbers of those people, who saw Poland lose the cream of her people and the following absorption of their country into the Russian sphere, are still alive (not so old!) today. "Harping" ? Never forgetting, more like!
jon357 63 | 14,341
22 Nov 2012  #14
You're asking the wrong question, johnb121.

A better one would be why some cultures seem unable to forgive and most importantly of all, why some people never move on, but in fact repeat their country's historical grievances while never, ever, admitting to their own wrongdoings. Even to the point of lessening the impact of the original events.
Tim Bucknall 7 | 98
22 Nov 2012  #15
before talk of moving on, there needs to be a thorough and complete acceptance by the Russian government of what happened, and they need to stick to it for longer than 5 minutes and not randomly sanction a piece in some provincial newspaper questioning the facts when they think no one will notice. they also need to stop looking for an "anti-katyn" to use against Poland, such as the Russian POWs who died from disease outbreaks in the 20s. Many people don't even know about Katyn.

when i was at high school in the early 90's our school textbooks were anti Polish and pro- soviet, assuming that most of the kids in my class wouldn't have cared enough to check the facts there will be many people out there who think that Poland randomly attacked the soviet union in 1919 for no reason at all, that was the impression the left wing school text books left me with until i grew up and found the truth - thanks Norman Davies!
jon357 63 | 14,341
22 Nov 2012  #16
They haven't done it, despite overwhelming proof and the fall of the USSR 20 years ago. I doubt they're going to do it any time soon. And yes, everyone in PL has heard about it.
Bananafishbone - | 2
22 Nov 2012  #17
Oh yea, a good example of America ignoring stuff.



Grzegorz_ 51 | 6,163
22 Nov 2012  #18
A better one would be why some cultures seem unable to forgive and most importantly of all, why some people never move on, but in fact repeat their country's historical grievances while never, ever, admitting to their own wrongdoings. Even to the point of lessening the impact of the original events.

This is a very anti-semitic statement.
jon357 63 | 14,341
22 Nov 2012  #19
You're obsessed with them. Unhealthy.
Tim Bucknall 7 | 98
22 Nov 2012  #20
And yes, everyone in PL has heard about it.

indeed, its the rest of the world that doesn't know. i've lost count of how many times i've had to explain to brits
OP peterweg 36 | 2,316
22 Nov 2012  #21
And a thread that's harping on about the past.

So you would prefer Polish history is swept under the carpet, just like the Holocaust is by Jews? Wait..
Grzegorz_ 51 | 6,163
22 Nov 2012  #22
You're obsessed with them.

It's not my fault that you wrote an anti-semitic post.
jon357 63 | 14,341
23 Nov 2012  #23
swept under the carpet

Perhaps you should reflect on the difference, not only between the two events but also on how one may move forward.

anti-semitic

As I say, you're obsessed.
Meathead 5 | 470
23 Nov 2012  #24
WWII occurred because you European folk basically don't get along. WWII was an extension of WWI and we didn't want anything to do with another bloodbath. You know sending soldiers "over the top" in the teeth of machine guns and losing a whole generation of young men. The same bs is happening all over Europe today with the financial crisis (austerity measures). And what are you doing about that? If England's leadership had a brain they would quit the Eurozone and concentrate on their "lost empire".
OP peterweg 36 | 2,316
23 Nov 2012  #25
Perhaps you should reflect on the difference, not only between the two events

What a vile repulsive thing to say.

A million dead Poles killed in Soviet concentration camps are 'different' from the millions killed in German concentration camps??

Please explain how one genocide is a 'difference worthy of reflection' while the other genocide requires us to 'move forward' from?

Who were unworthy victims in, your sick eyes, jews? Poles? other nationalities?

Please feel free to enlighten us
jon357 63 | 14,341
23 Nov 2012  #26
Once again, as so often, you've totally misunderstood the entire meaning of the thread.That or not actually read it.,

Either learn to read properly, or avoid commenting. Unless of course you'e just trolling - again nothing new.

Now it's time for you to apologise for your comments.
OP peterweg 36 | 2,316
23 Nov 2012  #27
How about explaining yourself.
Foreigner4 12 | 1,769
23 Nov 2012  #28
Do you mean explaining himself or his comments?
I'm curious myself what the intended meaning was...
jon357 63 | 14,341
23 Nov 2012  #29
How about explaining yourself.

How about reading the thread.
[quote=Tim Bucknall]indeed, its the rest of the world that doesn't know. i've lost count of how many times i've had to explain to brits[/quote

Would British people be more likely to know about KatyƄ than Poles about the Japanese atrocities against Britons. Would they need to?
OP peterweg 36 | 2,316
23 Nov 2012  #30
Do you mean explaining himself or his comments?

Explaining his comments. I've read it again and it still seems he's saying that the Holocaust and Soviet genocide crimes are somehow 'different'.

Over to you Jon, explain what you mean or I'll take it as that.


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