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Is Jozef Pilsudski the king of modern Poles?


Polonius3 1,000 | 12,448
24 Jan 2010  #2
Today's Poland could use their Piłsudski! PiS tried to sweep out the corruption and post-commite footholds as part of their IV RP programme, but lacked the majority to push it through.
Exiled 2 | 425
24 Jan 2010  #3
Now the king is Kaczynski.
joepilsudski 26 | 1,389
31 Jan 2010  #4
Pilsudski no king, just Pole who love his people, and he had very big balls and a bigger heart. Actually, a man 'after God's own heart'.

Probably many young Poles do not know who he is...They would ask 'Is he in a metal band or does he do techno?'...Tell them 'He invented the cell phone'.
vetala - | 382
31 Jan 2010  #5
Actually, he was a Lithuanian.
jeden - | 226
31 Jan 2010  #6
bulshit,

He was Pole... He was born on todey`s Lithuenia lands. that`s all
vetala - | 382
31 Jan 2010  #7
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Józef_Piłsudski#endnote_bnone

He considered himself a Lithuanian raised in Polish culture, he never called himself an ethnic Pole.
bullfrog 6 | 603
31 Jan 2010  #8
Many famous Poles were not "pure Poles" but had some foreign element in them. Apart from Pilsudksi, see above, Mickiewicz was also born in Lithunia, same for Nobel Prize winners Cz Milosz; FR Chopin's father was French..
vetala - | 382
31 Jan 2010  #9
bullfrog
Also Kopernik's mother was Prussian, Wit Stwosz was born under the name Veit Stoß and Matejko was Czech. Most of our kings and queens weren't ethnically Polish either. Still they were better Poles than most ethnic Poles.
Bzibzioh
31 Jan 2010  #10
What about 'they were as good Poles as ethnic Poles'?
Seanus 15 | 19,706
31 Jan 2010  #11
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/J%C3%B3zef_Pi%C5%82sudski some background on the man. He was unsuccessful in getting Lithuania onboard but had many other successes and his heart was what won people over.
Bratwurst Boy 5 | 9,714
31 Jan 2010  #12
Wit Stwosz was born under the name Veit Stoß

Not only born, he lived under that name...why is it with you guys giving Germans polish names???? ;)

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Veit_Stoss

Veit Stoss was a leading German sculptor, mostly in wood, whose career covered the transition between the late Gothic and the Northern Renaissance.
...
Stoss was born at Horb am Neckar before 1450; his exact date of birth is unknown though it may have been in 1447. Nothing is known certainly of his life before 1473 when he moved to Nuremberg in Franconia and married Barbara Hertz. ....

vetala - | 382
31 Jan 2010  #13
Bratwurst Boy
Would you prefer 'Brzęczyszczykiewicz'? ;)

What about 'they were as good Poles as ethnic Poles'?

Better than Feliks Dzierżyński at least.
convex 20 | 3,978
31 Jan 2010  #14
why is it with you guys giving Germans polish names???? ;)

looks classy on a business card..
Bratwurst Boy 5 | 9,714
31 Jan 2010  #15
Would you prefer 'Brzęczyszczykiewicz'? ;)

*get's knot in tongue to read out loud*

:)
Bzibzioh
31 Jan 2010  #16
Better than Feliks Dzierżyński at least.

In comparison to Feliks anyone look like outstanding citizen.
Seanus 15 | 19,706
31 Jan 2010  #17
Define modern. The guy died in 1935. That's modern by Polish standards, right? ;)
Sokrates 8 | 3,346
31 Jan 2010  #18
Piłsudski was calling himself a "Lithuanian" in the same manner as every single Pole born in the Lithuanian region was calling himself a Lithuanian.

The name was to call a region of birth, as for his nationality he was from a Polish noble family, with a Polish coat of arms and a long tradition of pro-Polish patriotic activities and he considered himself a Pole which he repeteadly said in newspapers and in the radio as well as privately.

How about you stop lying Vetala, its not the first time you're taking advantage of the mods being a bunch of fockwits to insult and twist the facts to fit your little anti-Polish outlook you smelly twat.

@BB

The same reason why we call Germans with Polish names is because you call Poles like Kopernik with German ones,we're almost as chauvinistic as Germans, almost :)))
Sokrates 8 | 3,346
31 Jan 2010  #20
Whats to be modest about? You're attempting to claim Polish achievements as your own and you bytch about Poles giving Germans Polish names?
Bzibzioh
31 Jan 2010  #22
why is it with you guys giving Germans polish names???? ;)

What is it with you guys giving Polish cities German names???? :0
Sokrates 8 | 3,346
31 Jan 2010  #23
What polish achievements?

Lets see, among some of your better ones "Kraków was so prosperous because it was half German."

"Kopernik was German because his uncle wanted him to be."
"Poland didnt won at Vienna, it was the Germans."
"Poznań is a natively German city."

There's more if we bother to dig except its not ad hominem shooting gallery.
Bratwurst Boy 5 | 9,714
31 Jan 2010  #24
Lets see, among some of your better ones "Kraków was so prosperous because it was half German."

That could be as at that time it was the German merchants who made Krakow and other towns prosperous.

"Kopernik was German because his uncle wanted him to be."

Well, he was at least half German..

"Poland didnt won at Vienna, it was the Germans."

I never said it was only the Germans...I always said it was a joint venture, an alliance who broke the Turks neck...nobody of us could had done alone.

Compared to your "...it was only the Poles!"
(Especially as you flat out deny the brave viennese citizens their honor, who held out for long time, starving, never gave up)

"Poznań is a natively German city."

I don't remember this one! *scratches head*

And I don't know what this has to do with "Wit" Veit Stoß a clearly german artists who did alot of cool work for now-polish towns but still is and was a German. ;)

...
moved to Krakow, the royal capital of Poland, at the invitation of the German merchant community, who commissioned him to produce the enormous polychrome wooden Altar of Veit Stoss at St Mary's Church in Krakow.

German-polish cooperation as it's best! :)
/wiki/Krakow#Golden_age

....
In 1520, the most famous church bell in Poland, named Zygmunt after Sigismund I of Poland, was cast by Hans Behem.[23] At that time, Hans Dürer, a younger brother of Albrecht Dürer, was Sigismund's court painter.[24] Hans von Kulmbach made altarpieces for several churches.[25]

:)

It was rebuilt and incorporated in 1257, based on the Magdeburg law, with tax benefits and trade privileges for its citizens.[10] These citizens were German settlers who moved in during the Ostsiedlung, and who constituted a majority of burghers in contemporary Polish and Bohemian towns.[11]

Germans constituted the majority during the 14th century, and became Polonized in the 16th century.[13]

Bzibzioh
31 Jan 2010  #25
and the altar of Saint Stanislaus.

No, not the main altar at Wawel Cathedral. It was done by Tomas Dolabella or Marcin Blechowski.

Artists were traveling circus back then; whoever commissioned them they went there. So were Italian, Dutch and English artists. It's for Poland benefit that those merchants, princesses and kings were able to finance those projects.
Bratwurst Boy 5 | 9,714
31 Jan 2010  #26
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Altarpiece_of_Veit_Stoss

The altarpiece of Veit Stoss (Polish: Ołtarz Wita Stwosza, German: Krakauer Hochaltar), also St. Mary's altar (Ołtarz Mariacki), is the largest Gothic altarpiece in the World and a national treasure of Poland.[1]
It is located behind the main altar of St. Mary's Church, Kraków, Poland.

What do you mean?
Bzibzioh
31 Jan 2010  #27
He did main altar at St. Mary church but not the one in Wawel Cathedral, as you said in your quote.
Bratwurst Boy 5 | 9,714
31 Jan 2010  #28
Maybe there is a misunderstanding...there is mentioned a tomb only..

....were the tomb of Casimir IV in Wawel Cathedral...

Bratwurst Boy 5 | 9,714
31 Jan 2010  #29
Is there only one??? ;)

..... His earliest work (1477) is the celebrated altar of the Blessed Virgin in the Church of Our Lady at Cracow, which is made in three parts, as an altar with wings. In the centre is seen the almost life-size figure of the Mother of God as she sinks dying into the arms of an Apostle.
Another altar of his in this church has reliefs depicting six scenes in the life of St. Stanislaus. The fine qualities of this work, especially the animation of the portrayal and the effective composition, obtained for him in 1492 the commission of making the tomb of King Casimir IV in the Cathedral of Cracow....

Bzibzioh
31 Jan 2010  #30
Another altar of his in this church has reliefs depicting six scenes in the life of St. Stanislaus.

That is mystery to me. I know there is fantastic crucifix made by him in the same church but another altar? I doubt it.

"Po stronie północnej (lewej) znajduje się barokowy ołtarz p.w. Św. Stanisława (zamykający lewą nawę boczną) z drugiej połowy XVII wieku z rzeźbioną sceną Wskrzeszenia Piotrowina. Wmontowana jest tu gotycka mensa z ok. 1400 roku z płaskorzeźbną dekoracją.

Drugi barokowy ołtarz, wykonany został w 1725 roku przez architekta krakowskiego Kacpra Bażankę. W nim znajduje się obraz Zwiastowanie, namalowany w 1740 roku przez Giovanni Battistę Pittoniego."

Nope. No mention of Stwosz.


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