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Are Poles aware of Thracian aspect in original roots of Polish ethos?


Crow 147 | 9,312
23 Feb 2010 #1
So?

Are Poles aware of Thracian aspect in original roots of Polish ethos? What people of this forum thinks and know about it?
Torq
23 Feb 2010 #2
Thracian

What do you mean - Bulgarian? Gimme a break, Crow ;)
OP Crow 147 | 9,312
23 Feb 2010 #3
no. i mean Thracian. Really

Bulgarians share with Poles this Thracian aspect in their origin. But, not only Bulgarians.

Actually, Bulgarians were formed as ethos after foreign Semitic (Turkic) factor was imposed on native European Thracians (branch of Proto Slavs). So, Bulgarian direct continuity with Thracians could be desputed.

Bulgarians has Thracians in their origin. Exactly that prevailing Thracian aspect of their origin makes them Whites, because after clash with non-Europeans Thracians of territory what is modern day Bulgaria preserved their culture and linguistic heritage no matter foreign influence and, even no matter racial mixing. Still, fact is, Bulgarians aren`t Thracians directly.

But Poles. Poles has dirrect continuity with Thracians. They originate from them and were formed as ethos without mixing with non-Europeans. Most probably, on their historical path Poles were extracted as ethos as direct descendants of Thracians with admixture that was result of other Slavic influences on them (inter-Slavic mixing, that took part in genetic stock of all the Slavs).
Ironside 50 | 11,048
23 Feb 2010 #4
But Poles. Poles has dirrect continuity with Thracians. They originate from them and were formed as ethos without mixing with non-Europeans. Most probably, on their historical path Poles were extracted as ethos as direct descendants of Thracians with admixture that was result of other Slavic influences on them (inter-Slavic mixing, that took part in genetic stock of all the Slavs).

WTF? what about sarmatians ?
OP Crow 147 | 9,312
24 Feb 2010 #5
Sarmatians were/are Thracians or you can say Thracians were/are Sarmatians
Ironside 50 | 11,048
24 Feb 2010 #6
don't you exaggerate? Sarmatians OK but Thracian ? what about Avarian - bavarian ?

Sarmatians ?huh

youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=E6m6pT-vVhA
OP Crow 147 | 9,312
24 Feb 2010 #7
don't you exaggerate?

no. Let`s go step by step to make things clear

Do you know how Poles designated Serbs in the middle age? Racowie, yes.

Now,... you look at the words `Serbs/Serbians` and `Racowie` and you don`t see connection, if you aren`t familiar with some facts.

what is connection? Word `Ras` is crucial here. ///Remember this word (some word close to it). This is the word that designate first ancestors of Poles that spoken language from which directly inherit modern day Polish language. Poles were originally Ras/Raski (Rashki) people.///

Word `RAS` is designation for central medieval Serbian land that even gave other name to medieval Serbia. That name was Raska (Rashka). Being aware of this Poles used to call Serbs- Racowie (referring on Ras).

Do you follow me Ironside?

word RAS pronounced by foreigners (Greeks/Romans) sounded and was recorded as THRACIANS (TH-RACI-ANS)

Oldest Byzantine chronicles directly designated and call Balkan Serbs- Triballi and we know that Triballi were main Thracian tribe.

Take Etruscan ethnic name for example. Etruscans called themselves Rasena. Others called them Etruscans and/or Tyrrhenians, while it was said that Etruscans (Rasena) originate from Rhaetia.

i already mentioned that modern day science established connection between Serbian name and name of Sarmatians. It is said that Balkan and Lusatian Serbs still using old, original and primordial name of all Slavs- Sarmatian name.

But, why then word RAS has such importance for Serbs, why that word always goes hand in hand with SRB.

Here is the answer.... SRB (root of Serbian name) by its meaning referring in Serbian on `organized numerous and brotherly people`. SRBIN /SA-BRAT/ - direct meaning in Eng. is `with brother`.

Complete meaning of the word SRB (SRBI/SARMATI) suggesting that word first time appeared when ancients started to organize itself in society. That`s why Poles remembered `Sarmatism` as kind of social and state organization.

Now, word `RAS`. In Serbian language word RAS referring on race/racial side and stays closely connected with word `RUSE` that is again connected with `RUJNI`.

direct meaning in Serbian >>>

RAS - root for the word RASA meaning `race` in Eng. For example White race

RUSE - describe something that is red/reddish, preferable red hair/skin

RUJNI - meaning directly `red people` in Eng.

All in all, we can say that RAS suggesting racial characteristic of ancients meaning that ancients were Red/Rose (White) people (in Eng.) and so they called themselves RAS. That way ancients differented itself from others (non-Whites).

So, we now know and can understand. Ancients were RAS (or form close to it) people and when first time organized in society they started to call itself SRB (form of it Serbians/Sarmatians). More later ancients designated itself as SLAVJANI (meaning- people who is able to talk, to communicate among themselves) if compare with foreigners- MUTE people- NEMCI.

>>>

RAS (domestic form) > THRACIANS (foreign derivation) > SRB /root/ (domestic form) > SARMATIA (foreign derivation)

To conclude,... Poles are Thracians meaning Poles are Ras people originally.
Ironside 50 | 11,048
24 Feb 2010 #8
Well, about Sarmatian elements in Poland we can discus, its probable and there many indication that its not only possible but likely.
Thracian ?huh? I don't know its a wee bit far fetched.
what you say is logical and sounds fine but is a fragile construction, take one element away and everything crumble into a pile of rubbish.

I think that genetics and development on this field will bring many answers.
Monastyrev - | 3
26 Feb 2010 #9
I think that genetics and development on this field will bring many answers.

That is a very narrow-minded point of view, as genetics answers are the final, absolute truth. No, you cannot conclude just from genetics, you must interpret your findings and not just use one field, you must include other fields to support your theory.

Actualy, Bulgarians were formed as ethos after foreign Semitic (Turkic) factor was imposed on native European Thracians

Turks are not semitic.

Crow, your theory is too short, it jumps all over the place, yes Etruscan and Italian names that include Rosa, Rosi, etc. etc. are interesting, but you're jumping to conclusions.

How is Serb or Srb, is related to Sarmatia? It could be, but your explanation is too short. Serbi can also be Servio: to be a slave to, serve, attributed to the sound change in Latin from v/w to b. It could be wrong, because this is only linguistics, and doesn't include different points of views, from different fields.
OP Crow 147 | 9,312
16 Apr 2010 #10
Listen Poles, listen Sarmats my beloved brothers what would Racowie tell to you. This is about our common history. This is why old Polish Warlords defended Balkan, old core of our civilization >>>

Our ancestors (Thracians)

youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=dOfKecvClvw

Dacians were considered to be kin to Thracians and both of them were considered to be Sarmatians. Don`t forget Poles. Don`t forget your history, your ancestors. Take back what enemy stolen from you, defend yourself, defend your future, accept responsibility!

Many of modern day Poles are just refuges of our great ancestors from Balkan, designated by names of Thracians, Dacians, Sarmatains, Celts, Iliryans... /who all were Proto Slavs/

Dacian Empire
...

oh, how we are greatly scattered, crashed, segmented, divided. But no, not defeated!

Poljska! Poljska! Poljska! Poland from Balkan to Baltic!

Racowie for Poland

Poland from Baltic to Balkan. natural Poland
Torq
16 Apr 2010 #11
Poland from Baltic to Balkan. natural Poland

Polish ABC - Adriatyk, Bałtyk, Czarne :-)

Who knows - maybe one day (but I'm afraid we would need to get a couple
of more F-16's and Leopards to achieve that ;)).
OP Crow 147 | 9,312
16 Apr 2010 #12
Sarmatian Confederation is only respond

Who knows - maybe one day (but I'm afraid we would need to get a couple
of more F-16's and Leopards to achieve that ;)).

Poland don`t need force to acquire what is ancient Poland`s realm
Torq
16 Apr 2010 #13
Sarmatian Confederation

Something like that......?

I was thinking more like...

...Central European Empire - wealthier than Sarmatian Confederation, more consolidated,
easier to defend, strong Slavic and Germanic elements (with the enriching addition of
Hungarians).

What are your arguments for Sarmatian Confederation?

*of course we are talking about available options if EU collapses for some reason*
OP Crow 147 | 9,312
16 Apr 2010 #14
first step is Poland`s military neutrality. That is Serbian message to Poland and only Serbian condition

Think Poles, forget Brussel. Let us all look at the Warsaw

Racowie


  • Sarmatian Confederation
Seanus 15 | 19,706
16 Apr 2010 #15
Crow, most Poles couldn't even tell you what Thracian means. The only positive news I have for you is that the great majority of my students want closer ties with Russia.

As an economist, why do geneology and ancient roots interest you so much? The Polish ethos is what and Thracian ethos is what? Let's flesh this out and put meat on the bones.
Torq
16 Apr 2010 #16
Sarmatian Confederation (map)

Why is DDR included in Sarmatian Confederation? If the rest of the Germany is
outside, we will NEVER have enough money to support them. They got the equivalent
of 1.5 trillion euro since unification and still 20% of them would like to see
the Berlin wall back. How are we ever going to support those moaners, Crow?
And how do you propose to take Kaliningrad from Russia without fight?
Sasha 2 | 1,083
16 Apr 2010 #17
As an economist, why do geneology and ancient roots interest you so much?

Don't want woron to be my personal mortgage consultor. :)
OP Crow 147 | 9,312
16 Apr 2010 #18
I was thinking more like...

in this option, Poles abounding and loosing continuity with its ancestral civilization. You must think global, really globally, on the long run.

Our old civilization was much bigger then it is, for example, Chinese civilization and territory today.

Poles would take all what belong to them or they would extinct. With Polish win, all of us who are kin ethoses to Poles are in win win situation, even those who are Polish friends

Take maximum for Polish language and culture. That is possible only if Poland`s influence overlap with the realm of our ancient civilization.

Crow, most Poles couldn't even tell you what Thracian means.

what to tell you. Poles are lucky that their loyal Racowie love them
Seanus 15 | 19,706
16 Apr 2010 #19
Crow, are you willing to admit that the EU has done well with regards to allowing Poles to spread their wings and, figuratively, fly abroad? Polish people can get their culture out there by travelling, without the inhibitive nature of communism to hold them back.

The very fact that LK's death has attracted so much international attention should tell you sth. Poland will be very much on the map in the near future.

Crow, what percentage of Serbs honour Racowie and Polish culture in the fullest way? It's a way of life here, no half measures on culture. I'd feel bad if I rejected an important cultural day here, it's deeply ingrained in their psyche. I toast the Poles for their allegiance to cultural norms and understanding their significance!!
OP Crow 147 | 9,312
16 Apr 2010 #20
The Polish ethos is what and Thracian ethos is what? Let's flesh this out and put meat on the bones.

what you want me to tell you? You want truth, for as Racowie i am obliged to tell only truth to Poles. I am educated in Yugoslavia and i would spread the word

Yes, Russian (RUS) ethnic name is closest to the ancient (really ancient) original name of direct Polish ancestors. But, old (medieval) Serbian ethnic designation RAS (or form RASH) is probably that lost original, true name of our deepest ancestors.

Ironically, genetic science confirmed that Russian Slavs originate from Slavs from the territory of modern day Poland (Russians are direct Polish children speaking in genetic sense). Its logical because Poland was populated from Balkan along the Danube river (*that`s why first Poles were Ledjani/Lech- people from ice/north in comparison with their ancestral southern/warmer regions*). Then, population continued to disperse Eastern and Western. Most Western most RAS people are for sure IRISH clans/tribes. Most Eastern most RAS people are Russians. Ancestors of today`s Russians obviously separated from Polish ancestors while name of RAS was still universal name for all Proto Slavs. They separated before name of Ledjani/Lech was extracted as specific name for tribes on the territory of Poland. In my opinion, chronologically (speaking of only today Poland`s territory), ethnic name of RAS was first parallel/replaced by name of LEDJANI/LECH, then parallel/replaced by name based on root SRB/BRAT/SABRAT- synonyms in Serbian (Sarmatian name), then parallel/replaced with name of Slavs and then parallel/replaced with Poljani/Polish name.

So, RAS was primordial name. Then, as i mentioned, Sarmatian name appeared with more developed social structure (Sarmatian name actually means `brotherhood`). That new universal designation for all Proto Slavs was spread again from Balkan to Baltic, then to the West and East, again. More later, Sarmatian name was replaced with new universal name- Slavic name.

That is truth. Rest is daily politics controlled by magnates of Africa/Near East and Western parts of Europe.

As an economist, why do geneology and ancient roots interest you so much?

simple, one feel or don`t feel responsibility

As economist i batter and easier understand global processes. Now, by decision of some powers, Serbian lands are split on German and Turkish zones of control (meaning Britain, France would rather see us as Germans and Turks then Slavs).

In last 1000 years Serbians resist to these processes and defend Slavic character of Balkan. Obviously, you must understand, Serbians being aware that they are greatly weakened and that retreat in front of overwhelming foes they decided to focus their last strength onto awakening of Poland.

Poland is in direct continuity with our ancient original civilization. Serbians are old core, Poland is last core (Sarmatism started in Serbia and `finished` in Poland). So, Serbians would rather give itself into one great and powerful Poland (what is actually Sarmatia, no matter name) then into Germany or/and Turkey, to put cross on myself. That`s our last scream, our last gift to Poland and Slavija, our last charge. We retreat but we falling for existence and survivor of our civilization, of our own seed.

We expect Russia to understand us and help us in our last mission.

and saga would live about Racowie. Would live only if Poland strengthen and spread
Bratwurst Boy 9 | 10,548
17 Apr 2010 #21
How are we ever going to support those moaners,

*glare*
OP Crow 147 | 9,312
17 Apr 2010 #22
Dragon would come. Price would be paid and Dragon would come, once again. Serbians paid the price

Serbian Voivode of knights Milos Obilic - Sarmatian Draconist; Kosovo battle 1389 Serbs vs. Turks

Dragon would be summoned once again Poljaci, do you feel it. Poljaci! or should i say LEDJANI/LECHI (your first specific ethnic name, my beloved brothers)

Come to us Poles, come. Help us, help yourself!

Polish president Kaczynski was just first awakened Dragon. Many would come, many would come after him

Polish ABC - Adriatyk, Bałtyk, Czarne :-)

this is nicely said. Sounds great
Mr Grunwald 30 | 2,004
17 Apr 2010 #23
Crow your idea sounds cool but remember one very important thing. All east of Poland is VERY hype on not letting Poland gain too much control on them or any form of taking over!

That's why I am more interested in the plan Torq came up with
1. Also it's only with Poland's help that Austria may unify themselves with Germany, since Poland was one of the biggest wounded countries after ww2 nobody would proclaim that Poland wants some grand unification of all Germans so that they will want to conquer all of Europe.

2. Although Czechs and Slovaks have animosities towards Poland because of München treaty and the commie invasion they may be some difficulties BUT they were never occupied in that sense that Poles governed them (in the meaning that they remember it and what kind of effect it gave them)

3. As Germany-Austria-Hungary have history of co-operating with each other they would with no problems add Poland into it, the only problem is that some countries may look at it as Germany+ Austria-Hungarian empires right before ww1, not only superpowers but Czechs and Slovaks too (especially Serbia when thinking of Crow :))

4. If it would been possible I would like to add Denmark into it if they would agree because then that alliance would not only have control of central Europe and most of the traffic between Western - Eastern Europe but also controlling the Baltic sea which would at least make Sweden and the Baltic states (maybe even Russia) to be friendly towards us. (also having an agreement with Italy about travel etc and passing through, the influence would reach far

5. It will be essential to not include any minor Balkan state to it since if in case of conflict the Balkan state will most probably go to war and since the alliance is complete we would have to help that country. Which wouldn't been any positive towards any of the alliance's members.

6. Then it is a problem, energy. Will we focus on oil from Russia (if we will have Denmark and good relations with Russia I would strongly push towards Russian oil as it's also one of the cheapest no?) Although having oil from UK and Norway it would lead to trade and maybe good relations with those two nations and having some form of protection from them (voting against isolation of our alliance if it would happen and speak on our behalf in their relations)

7. Although Kaliningrad would be an problem as to if Germany would want it or if it should been incorporated into Poland for a sum of money (cause some kind of war over it is ridiculous) or was the idea of an Poland-Lithuania kind of state, Swedish-Norwegian union or more of a Russian federation or kind of like EU? (to Torq)
Bratwurst Boy 9 | 10,548
17 Apr 2010 #24
I would rather think along the lines of a new Hanseatic League....founded on trade and building wealth and security together (the forerunner of the EU if you ask me).

It's also between peoples of similiar culture and outlook (and we can leave the whole southern Europe mess out).

another map of the same

It worked and was a great thing for all concerned...
z_darius 14 | 3,968
17 Apr 2010 #25
Hanseatic League....founded on trade and building wealth and security together (the forerunner of the EU if you ask me).

Nah, the true forerunner of EU was really the Roman Catholic Church.
z_darius 14 | 3,968
17 Apr 2010 #27
yeah, some facts are yucky indeed.
Now, be careful about expressing your feelings though. After all you live in an Orwellian country ;)
Bratwurst Boy 9 | 10,548
17 Apr 2010 #28
That's not a fact...just your theory...both of it! ;)

I'm really an admirer of the Hanseatic League...You can even today see the many traces it left in the beautiful architecture of the Bürgerhäuser along the baltic coast or even in city laws etc...

It spread prosperity through trade over borders like nothing comparable before (no, church doesn't count)!

Now does that look like a kind of EU or what? :)
z_darius 14 | 3,968
17 Apr 2010 #29
That's not a fact...just your theory...both of it! ;)

OK, perhaps not fully Orwellian yet, but you still gotta e careful about what you say. Not freedom of speech in Germany after all.

I'm really an admirer of the Hanseatic League..

I am too

It spread prosperity through trade over borders like nothing comparable before (no, church doesn't count)!

Why not? It united Europe and created prosperity for some and poverty for others. Just like EU.
Bratwurst Boy 9 | 10,548
17 Apr 2010 #30
OK, perhaps not fully Orwellian yet, but you still gotta e careful about what you say. Not freedom of speech in Germany after all.

The only thing I can think of would be official denying of the Holocaust actually (you can even do it private if you feel the need).

But else....what do you mean?

Why not? It united Europe and created prosperity for some and poverty for others. Just like EU.

I doubt the League needed to convert...erm...aquire members with a sword to their head!
The Church was and still is about power...the League was about trade...


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