Sad life of a Polish migrant in the UK. Ch. 5 - Racism

To suggest that your post has no genesis in the previous post is disingenuous.

One

z_darius:
This is just a meaningless PC slogan. It has no value whatsoever. In fact a lot of people become racists when they come to know others better and decide the others, their culture, habits and values are undesirable.

RevokeNice:
Race obviously does exist, to say other wise is nonsense. Stereotypes do not suddenly appear "out of nothing." They are based on a persons experiences with other people of certain races, social classes, or whatever else. Our brains generalise based on the experiences and past encounters we have had with each group.

Two

z_darius:
Some say that racism is whatever-phobia. Yes it is. One of the most powerful driving forces in biology is fear. Its function is survival. That's why we eat (we don't want to die of hunger) or withdraw out hand when it's exposed to fire (we don't want our hand to be burnt

RevokeNice:
If we ignore our stereotypes then we are ignoring our own experiences and choosing ignorance over knowledge, a recipe destined for failure. No one would expect you to put your hand back in a fire after being burned dozens of times,

Three

z_darius:
And it is also true when it comes to things such as skin color, family tradition etc. The tendency has been to preserve some of the defining qualities of various groups. That's why white people have been killed by non-white natives around the world, and that's why whites killed even more non-whites.

RevokeNice:
We see the result of this brainwashing every day in the crime reports when yet another European is *victimised because they have chosen to ignore their stereotypes about certain races.

The first poster presented a structured argument, you rehashed the same Ideas (and lost the meaning). You need to understand what intellectual plagiarism is

You are talking through your hat, Brit. I plagarised nada.

Lets make it a bit easier for him yeh.
plagiarism not plagarism, stealing somebody's work or idea and claiming it as original.
Or if you look at it from a different angel they could just have the same beliefs, beliefs that any normal adult would have which is that it is rare for us to become racist for the sake of it.

Perhaps, accessibility has a large part to play in it?
People who do play hockey live in countries with snow
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009_Men%27s_World_Ice_Hockey_Championships


Not just a Wiki debate.
But I do understand why you would not want to read anything contrary to your own set of beliefs, heaven forbid that you at 22 years of age does not know everything by now.


If that were really the case anyone reading your dribble on here might think that you are a typical Irishman rather than the worm you are, goodness forbid.


Race or culture?
Races do not "behave a certain way", culture and up bringing strongly influence people's actions not race.


You are confusing stereotypes with experience.


This is true, through experience and upbringing we are programmed to respond to certain things and people in a certain way, this can be interpreted as race distinction but it does not really mean anything.

It would be folly to treat all Swiss people the same way.

The NHL is in the US and Canana we have plenty of snow and Black athletes, yet not one Professional Hockey player?

Maybe they just dont like to swim or skate?

I googled it before I answered last time.


answers.yahoo/question/index?qid=20070606121904AAzwqcy

I honestly do not know the answer but I would not jump to any conclusions either.

To be fair you really have to take economics into it. I'm assuming and I admit my whole argument could be flawed on this assumption but I'm guessing the huge representation of blacks in MLB, NFL, NBA, Boxing and Track events have to do with the initial economic factors which prohibited many young blacks from becoming involved in hockey. Do you know how expensive that sport is? This initial barrier created a tradition of nonparticipation in hockey.

In other words it hasn't been their thang cause it's been as expensive as hell yo.

All that gear is expensive, and most the kids are usually in the park playing basketball or baseball
Football equiptment is quite expensive also and half the players or more are black?


I see your guys point:)

So only rich white kids play? ********!

Always the same lame reason.

Skate hire is cheap as chips.

Come up with a better one.
I don't think any of us know for sure.
After all aren't black people black due to an evolutionary process to protect their skin from the sun.
But more and more scientist are debunking the idea of race.

Not really - a lot is more to do with the fact that while Canadian kids all play hockey, it's not so much the done thing in America. Also, apart from North America - the main place for hockey is Europe.


Err...Jarome Iginla and Donald Brashear, to name two, might just want to argue with you. Iginla's even the captain of the Calgary Flames and Brashear has made an entire career out of beating people up. Even going back, Grant Fuhr, who is now long retired, made the Hockey Hall of Fame as a black goalie. Even Freddie Brathwaite was quite a well known black goalie.

comparatively, yes.
C'mon think about it, the average household income that a white hockey player has come from over the last 20 years is probably a lot higher than that of a black basketball, football (hand-egg) or baseball player. I think you'll be hard pressed not to agree with me on this.

Steriotypical white game.

Lots of sports are class ridden as well (Golf and tennis)

Genetics.

But that seems to be the part that is not clear.
respectable geneticists say there is no difference.
I will try and find a very important article about this, I will dig.

Tennis and golf used to be class ridden but not any more.

Have you been to a golf course in England recently. Still an elitist snob hole, even the municipal ones.

I am a bit lost as to your point.
Are you saying it could be genetics or accessibility/economics?

I just named three possible alternates. Cost is always used but as i said earlier skate hire is cheap and skating is the start of any ice hockey player.

Do you play ice hockey?

Never had the chance, skating rinks were like rocking horse poo when i was growing up.

I have tried skating and i am not very good to be honest.

You must be black then ;p

We used to have a skating rink in Ringsend in Dublin, I went twice, both times the state of the ice was ridiculous.
Whereas in Vilnius they take ice skating deadly serious and they are good at it, so they take care and manage it well.
It just seems more of a cultural thing than genetics.

lol. I knew you were going to hit me with something seany :-)

Got to go and get ready for the cinema and a young(ish) lady. Zombieland :-)

We have a brand new state of the art one in Sheffield, i did some outdoor skating in Wroclaw as well. Different citys same outcome-rubbish skater.

Beware of Irishmen bearing gifts :)


Good idea, with any luck she'll be clinging to your arm.


Me too, it must be because we are black, ah well at least we can dance??? hahahahaha

you're not actually doing anything with the above statement except proving my point (while trying to be contrary and showing off your overall ignorance of the topic.

I grew up in Canada, i didn't play hockey cause it was (and still is) as expensive as hell. The black kids didn't play hockey either cause they also came from families which couldn't afford not only the equipment but also the cost for ice time, or the free time to drop off and pick kids up from the rink, and the money for tournaments and the time for tournaments which are every other weekend. Not only that, they couldn't visually identify with anyone other Grant Fuhr or Pokey Reddick (sp). It's not a hard concept to get your mind around if you contemplate what I originally wrote.

BTW, As things are getting more expensive in Canada and both parents are working more, fewer kids play hockey. In fact swimming and soccer are (and have been for some time) far more popular with youth in Canada. Hockey still enjoys an entrenched system that allows for much greater development though.

Look to the northern states (Portland, Washington, Minnesota, Wisconsin, Connecticut) for your hockey players in the U.S. it's really not debatable. Yes there are exceptions of poor kids playing hockey but again they're only comparatively poor to their team mates or the majority of young players.

You know in Ireland, you have to say 'Ice' hockey because Hockey is field hockey.
probably because we get very little snow compared to Canada.


There is a good possibility that it is also cultural.
Say I moved to Canada and had kids there.
I would not encourage my kids to play ice hockey but sports I know instead, as I do not even know the rules of ice hockey.


Diego Maradona playing football with oranges as an impoverished kid.

Ho evr eard of a Jamaica national bobsled team?
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jamaica_national_bobsled_team

yeah canadians call it field hockey if it isn't on ice or of course there's also road hockey and floor hockey as well (i played a sh1tload of floor and road hockey).


also my point, thank you for agreeing with me. I forgot to mention the indians (first nations)didn't generally play hockey either cause they were generally pretty poor too. Anyhow if you did move your kids might want to try it because other kids would be playing it (the money you do or don't have would determine if they could)


try that with hockey see how far your skills develop


calgary olympics but let's not use exceptions as anything other than examples of exceptions to general rules.

Considering the relatively high entry cost of amateur hockey there are surprisingly plenty of black hockey players.

And that cost - no, it doesn't cost a fortune but by the time you're done getting your basic gear you're a few hundred $ thinner.

And then what do you do? You can play in the street or a parking lot if the local municipality sucks and they haven't cleared the roads off the snow. Or if you have your own means of setting up a rink such as a backyard with a pool (money again).

It is cheaper though to go to one of the local arenas, which is not free either. The upkeep cost is significant. Even in Canada, where we have a few days without snow, kids and parents struggle with the rising costs of maintaining minor hockey leagues. Small hockey rink operators will spend hundreds of thou$ands to maintain the facilities. A decent zamboni alone costs upwards of $200K. Staff time, at least 3 full time people at $40 to $60K a year and it all adds up up very fast.

To sum up, hockey is among the most expensive sports and an average unemployed, food coupon based single mom (white, black or pink) simply cannot afford the luxury for her (often many, and sometime colorful) kids.

Now compare that to the cost of playing soccer, or basket ball.

Perhaps it is the exception in this case that sheds a little light on the subject.
If black Jamaicans can do it, it would lead me to think that anyone with the means and the will can do it and it is not race based.

That had nothing to do with you being Polish though.

Then you would be lead down a path of false reasoning as you would clearly be ignoring the loopholes that allowed for such an entry to happen as well as duplicity and frequency of said event vs said activity. Please read z_dariusz's post above yours on this thread. After comprehending that you should reassess what it means for a sport to be race based and what modern demographics in N.america over the last 20 years has to say about family incomes.

Sometimes you say things and sometimes you don't, this is a post of the latter.