Is UK the new cradle of antipolonism?

We Polish-Americans sure are laughing at your performance in this thread Dephiandomine. Your attempt to change the topic to a disparaging critique of the Polish educational system was especially hilarious. You've certainly earned your red rubber nose and floppy shoes if not your B.A.

Can't do you a video link, but what about this?


Comment not needed.

What is the point of this tired old topic that has been flogged to death already, I am sure that the vast majority of Poles are enjoying the famous liberal British hospitality.

Funny,I thought it was meant to be about British racism.....its only you that has demonstrated any Polish racism....


I presume they are smart enough to read huge flipping signs in english that simply state "NO FISHING" ?


Exactly, "openly".like them or hate them the bnp and all the other loony fringe parties are a symbol of our relative freedom..........where as in Poland parties with exact right wing views as the bnp are just as popular,only why use mass immigration to Poland as an issue as it is simply not a "problem" is it...


No,its history,not nice history,but certainly less "hatefull" than your constant labeling of an islands entire population....


yes,and small percentage of fake intelectuals or working class dimwits makes up a good representation of all the british people does it then loser?

(mods,by "loser" I refer to his screen name,not in an ad hominim attack, simply for a Pole to choose the name of the Confederacy's best general and then cry about "racism" is pretty funny...)

And vice-versa. Britain and Poland excel in that area. Time to leave the negativity for those with real stories and not those with agendas.

I presume you meant to hague1 there seanus? :)

No that's hate talk, as well as the works of Mr Gross. Marek Jan Chodakiewicz or Polish IPN are more objective, but it still makes little sense to discuss those events without context, unless you have another agenda, defamation for instance.


Ok, let's say he apologized for something he didn't said.


Which means they can take the carp they catch in PZW waters home. And it's hard to find non-PZW lakes in Poland.


I see you are clutching at straws here. Hard to accept the fact that the "liberal and tolerant UK" is really more racist towards immigrants than Poland?


That's as racist as saying that the tolerance the Britons showed towards Daily Mail certainly suggest that Britons approve.


Again racist accusation. "Stealing of carps" by Poles in the UK has very little to do with jumping through fences but rather with taking home the fish they caught because they assumed it's obvious that they can take it - this is how fishing works in Poland.


I see Coren's slur is catching on.


I have little interest in stirring up resentment. You just need to face up to your own racism before you point your fingers at Poles, which seems to be the hobby of Britons.


UK hardly allowed Poles to stay "in the beginning", after selling them to Stalin. Many veterans complained how they were not welcome in UK after the war ended. Now Poles should feel gratitude for allowing them to have those low paid jobs? You clearly have no clue about Polish people and their pride.


I notice no attemp from you part to refute membership/approval of NSDAP, Gestapo, SS, NKVD, church of satan, etc.

What ? a cradle ? Robert-Lee and his Appomattox.

Delphiand and a lot of nonsense and racist talk.

Even the IPN has made it clear that Poles were heavily involved with Jedwabane. As for criticising Gross - that's just lazy racism on your part, nothing more. Remember - Jan Gross is a historian at one of the best history departments in the world. Chodakiewicz? He's nothing in comparison - and the IPN is hardly a "impartial history source".


They shouldn't 'assume' things when in a foreign country. If they're too stupid to observe the law - then they should be prosecuted. I can't imagine "But, Mr Police Officer, I don't have to have my lights on when driving in the UK" will wash - I'll get a 100PLN fine and a point on my licence regardless. Incidentally - before you carry on - many of these cases, they were stealing from private sport ponds.


It's a great way to describe people like yourself - Plastic Poles with precious little knowledge of what's going on in Poland, and without any skill in the language.


Hahahaha - the hypocrisy is astounding. Personally, I'd be happy for everyone to own up to their racism - what about it? Can you admit Polish racism - something that UEFA is exceptionally worried about?


Most Polish people really couldn't care less about what happened after WW2 - they live in the present. As I said - it's obvious that you're American, because real Poles were more worried about the money in their pocket than any nonsense about history.


Godwin's law strikes again.

Listen, pal - you aren't Polish, you will never be Polish and you certainly aren't welcome to be Polish. Now - get the hell out of my country.

A lot do. It doesnt matter where they are. And the same is true for 'living in the present'.
Your last statement is horrible generalization...

Many Poles left to the "New World" exactly because of money and difficult time.


LOL. is this a joke? A person is free to travel almost wherever they please.

I've found that the vast majority of those with hang-ups about Britain are usually those who have forefathers that left Poland. Those living in Poland these days regard Britain as being one of the better EU members, no doubt helped by the utter lack of any moves to throw them out/punish them/etc. As I'm saying till I'm sick in the face - Britain and Poland have rather good relations these days.

Anyway, do I need to remind you that Britain allowed the Polish Government-in-Exile to stay in the UK? Or perhaps we could discuss how the 1945-era Poles were so happy in the UK that they actually can be used as a shining example of true immigration? They certainly didn't moan and whine about what the UK could've done - they just got on with their life in the new country. Great people.

As I've said - most of the racism about Britain comes from non-Poles who think they're Polish despite not speaking the language at all. The ordinary Poles? They really couldn't care less - Britain is generally good to Poland and is quite happy to accomodate Poles.

The whole WW2 thing is an absolutely minor side-note these days - and is only really argued about by historians. Ordinary people? They couldn't care less.


We don't have room for racist American scum in this country.

I agree.


There is racists in every country though right? (not saying its good or bad).

Personally I see racism as having two groups:

1)The kind where someone will say "Go burn in hell you ******* [insertcountryhere].

2)Especially in the US and Canada we hear that "black people like chicken".
It has gone so far that this is now considered racism (I personally think in this case people need to lighten up and not take it as a racist comment).

Anyways thats a slightly different direction of the topic so I will end it here.

Ekhm :D If that makes you tick :D
I always wondered why are Britons experts on the suffering inflicted on Jews by Poles? Is it the favourite topic of chit-chats over a cup of tea in UK? Surprisingly they are not so interested in cases where Poles were the victims.


No, it's a term used by racist, that you gladly adopted.
This thread is not about what's going on in Poland, it's about what's going on in Britain. If you want to talk in Polish with me - use the appropriate place in the forums, I welcome you to do that.


That's just offensive.


You need to make up your mind "pal": am I in USA or in Poland?


You mean not counting the pattern of derogatory stereotyping in the media, discrimination and the openly expressed wish to get rid of "cheap Polish workforce, that steals jobs from locals"?


Yes, they did happen to honor that particular part of the alliance with Poland.


They were devastated that Brits sold their land to Stalin and asked them to leave. Those who lived in Kresy lost their homes, other still faced prosecution when coming back. And Britain, both the government and the general public, wanted to get rid of the Poles, who were now just seen as a competition on the job market.

Well, I've lived most of my life in UK and never been treated in a Racist manner. Older people would occasionally praise the Poles for their bravery in the war, they were greatly admired.

I guess an American feel's he knows more about the subject having read about in on the internet. Ho hum.


Thats sounds like the US is a racist society. From my experience that seems the case, less of a melting pot, more of a salad bowl, the races and social groups do not mix. Thats from an Black American who emigrated to the UK.

You know what? the UK is not like that.

The thread is wandering again. Mods, I feel that if nobody is going to even post a video here to discuss but only to sling mud then what's the point in having the thread?

Here,
youtube.com/watch?v=oVP0RRvl2WE
part 1/7, The Poles are Coming. Some of the reasons why some Brits may be angry. 1.54 is one such example of idiocy and I don't know if it was staged. The golden thing to remember is that such Poles tend to be rather lacking whereas many super smart ones stay here in Poland.

The problem is always one of winners and losers. Local economies thrived due to immigrant labour but some residents became the victims of dumping trash and feeling like a foreigner in their own town. It's the same old story in the UK. Businesses profit and your average punter is left to fend for himself in a hard slog.

That's what they said ;) ;)

Anyway, I can tell PF members that there are quite a few videos online worth watching on this topic. I'd recommend an open mind. Poles tend to be very tidy IMHO. The rubbish gets put out to allocated areas so I refuse to believe that the tipping is mostly done by them. Yes, the beer-swilling bozos contribute a little but I'd hazard a guess that other groups are responsible for the majority of the dumping.

How could residents not be angry with that? I acknowledge my guest status here and do what I have to. It doesn't take much and good manners cost nothing.

youtube.com/watch?v=oVP0RRvl2WE
part 3 of 7. Interesting is at 5.29. This is how ridiculous it has become. This Indian woman, who clearly sees herself as a Brit now, is against immigration as she advocates putting a stop to it. Well, from having been a UK resident for 23 years myself, I know that they have naturalised themselves into Britain (though I still don't think they are fully British as they have India) but that process took time for her. Why deny others that which has been afforded to yourself? For me, that Indian woman is not every bit as British as my family is, for example, and would do well to realise that she has been allowed to hold down a good job partly through her own hard work, yes, but more from the fact that the rules let her stay at one time too. The answer was simple all along, immigration caps!

What in the name of sanity are you talking about?

about a year and a half ago I watched a sky tv program here in Poland. We used to get Sky- then cancelled because it was all crap. Anyway- this program was about immigration and specifically targeting Poles- claiming that Poles undercut their business, offered for cheaper, they set up ghettos, churches etc etc.

The funny thing about this show was that the majority of the people commenting that were British- were of a visible minority- being black or east Indian. These same people were claiming that Poles are changing their culture.

I dunno, I have never lived in England- my grands immigrated to Canada from England- but as far as I know- a curry is not a British food- yet there is a window selling it on every corner.

Hehehe, I hope you are joking, I-S. I'm the one here who steers it back the most. Caps would have helped to reduce any anti-Polish sentiment. The sooner you realise that it isn't people being anti-Polish per se, but sheer numbers, then you will begin to see what the topic is about. If you can't then this thread is not for you.

if you are sincere here that you do not understand Poles and Poland well enough.


Also you are biased by your ideological/political approach.

I-S, what doesn't he understand about Poles? If you can show what a Brit doesn't understand about Poles, maybe this will make understanding better!? It seems to many Brits that Poles just want to make money and sent it all home. That doesn't sit well with them whether it is their choice or not. What Polishness doesn't delph get?

The original post of this thread claims that part of British antipolonism is smearing Poles as synagogue burning anti-Semites.

DE, that's an insult, whether true or false, levelled against Poles and not an excuse to enter into a discourse on the Jews.

I-S, I'm not going to comment here on the Jews as it's not the point. The bottom line is that I see nobody here has any evidence regarding the thread so why keep it open?

Oh,well then,must be true if Rupert Murdoch says it then....


All of which is true and supportable by evidence.....


Do tell.....


Yes,but British , something many non Polish "Poles" seems to think makes them second class,not really British.....sorry to burst the strange North American obsession but black yellow white or brown,British is British...........


Surprise surprise....


Well,you know wrong then,just as Pizza is not Italian,the most popular curries in the west were generally invented in Britain by Indian immigrants....

Basically,your entire post should have been simply;


or,alternativly;


Sorry,not picking on "you" pip,but,your post just sums up the problem perfectly. No Poles who have lived or worked in England have posted anything negative here,only people from over three thousand miles away who have never been to britain seem to have the "real insight" into how things "really" are over here (except the forums terrorist apologist,milky,the chap who supports unborn babies being blown up)............

Bit sad really,

I don't think they understand at all that the black dude selling clothes is as British as the Asian guy working in the curryhouse, the Chinese guy selling imported goods is as British as the white guy washing windows. Heck, I don't think they realise at all that the grandchildren of Polish immigrants are British, not Polish.


That's all because it suits their dodgy right-wing agenda to claim that Brits are "against Poles". Usual scaremongering nonsense.

I wouldn't say 'as British', delph. A Chinaman is from China, just like a black guy might have come from an African country. In one sense, they are as British but I do not see foreigners as being as British as my family, not a chance. If you follow that logic, an American-Pole is every bit as much a Pole as a Pole that is originally from Poland. Do you believe that to be the case?

I don't think I was picking on England, I was just describing the program I saw. I thought it was funny that in this program there were people being interviewed claiming that eastern Europeans are changing the face of England- yet these people were of an obvious visible minority and spoke with an east Indian or Jamaican accent. pot meet kettle, if you will.

as a side note- I am not here to pick on any country- I am just one Canadian girl, living and working in Warsaw, married to a Pole- sometimes a different perspective is nice.


Poles born abroad are considered Polonia- not the same.

In America, the melting pot, you are American first. ex. and American of Polish decent etc etc
In Canada you are Polish-Canadian or Jamaican -Canadian etc etc- we are a cultural mosaic- and very proud of it.
I imagine that in England it is probably similar to Canada.
In this case we are mixing ethnicity with nationality.

Well said. I wouldn't see some German for example who moved to Poland to be as Polish as I who was born there, speaks the language fluently and who's ancestor were Polish. Just like here I meet Polish-Americans he knows just a few words in Polish or none at all, has never been there, isn't quite sure what part of Poland his descendants came from or the closest identifying thing he has with Poland is saying proudly he ate some Golabkis last night.

No - you're British.

Only people who are truly half-half will say it - and even then, many of them will identify with Britain, not the 'other' country. I know someone who holds an Irish passport, was born in Dublin - yet self identifies as British as she's lived there since she was 2. The Irish passport is just a minor note.

Where you come from is really of little interest to most people in the UK - even Poles get adopted as Brits quickly.

Pip, true. The dynamic is different and that's sth we learn in Modern Studies, a secondary school subject (high school).

Penn, exactly. There must be a meaningful connection which comes through immersion and attachment to cultural norms in the broadest form. I mingle very well with many Poles, joke around with them and have interesting discussions with them. I may even get full residence soon (my first school fecked that up by not telling me to register, sharks). However, all that doesn't change the fact that my roots lay elsewhere. Drop me back in Scotland and I will quickly change a few things. My wife says my accent and words used change a bit when there.

This is important as background but let's link it back into the topic. Penn, did you see that woman commenting in part 3/7 of the video I posted above? I accept multiculturalism as being a reality in GB but it doesn't change ultimate lineage and ethnicity. As pip rightly said, they should be differentiated. That kind of person cannot call the shots when her family has been given a chance to prosper. Fine, if a Pole refuses to integrate and speak English to the best of their ability then take that case on its merit without launching into a full-scale attack on immigrants. Intelligent people adapt and just get on with it like they know they have to.

Delph, I see what you are saying but just think about what you said for a moment. The great majority of people I know identify those by ethnicity through indirect reference to their business. You don't say 'I'm away off for a British tonight'. You say 'I'm off for an Indian tonight'. The owners are of Indian origin in the same way that Pakistanis own 'Paki shops' (no racism intended here as many Scots refer to them in that way, rather loosely I might add). Brits, through symbols, see them as different whilst being part of the national fabric. Turks with kebabs, Greeks with gyros and Italians with pizza/pasta etc.

When talking about Poles, one can mention the salad bowl theory,
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Salad_bowl_(cultural_idea)

They, like the Indians, Chinese and Pakistanis, have their own enclaves and you will know this from having lived in Aberdeen (think Sunnybank and Tillydrone/Sandilands).

Are you gonna try and get Polish citizenship eventually?