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Ed Miliband, new Labour leader, talking about Polish immigrants yesterday


Ironside  50 | 12337  
27 Sep 2010 /  #31
They did undercut and that's a problem to be tackled by the new administration.

If they undercut, IF, it was the labour party policy!
The only solution for a working class fears would be the French system, however I doubt that a new government will antagonise bankers and fat cats !

Nevertheless, why always pick on Poles ? Ed shred!
Amathyst  19 | 2700  
27 Sep 2010 /  #32
However, from direct personal knowledge I know he does look after local Polish constituents.

I'll post this link on a few sites and that'll ensure he doesnt get the vote the British public ;0)

But I do hate the treachery and support for mindless Stalinist thuggery that surfaced time and again in the Miliband family in the past.

Past being the operative word sweetie..Besides Red Ed only got in because of his backing from the Unions...lets see how long he lasts!

That is obligatory press-BS, he openly says his party is "Red",

He's been put where is by the Unions, and will be manipulated...and brother is what he is...another Blairite..Neither are strong enough to look after a herd of goats let alone a country! But I look forward to what they have to say at the end of next month in respond to the budget.

I wouldnt want either of them running the country! This has nothing to do with their families past, it has to do with them!

and remember Britain had a Jewish Premier over a hundred years before, and the number of Jews holding high office in the UK proves that the public are not overly bothered about whether someone is Jewish or not.

Quite the oposite really, they prove to be honest...Cant remember a Jewish MP being done for corruption (unlike other immigrants who abuse their power in this country)...There are also plenty of Jewish circuit judges and all very respected.

My dislike of the brothers, has nothing do with their religion or ancestry, more to do with the policital views.

Pure comedy!

Did these people not do natural history at school? OMG! Does stupidity have no bounds!

That's in the eye of the beholder....

Im sure some Germans and other nationalities (older people who should be dead but for some reason they still continue to waste precious air!) will say the Jews deserved all they got! But we both know this isnt true!
Seanus  15 | 19666  
27 Sep 2010 /  #33
There was a crackdown on it. The Poles that appeared in the Dominic Lees film testified to its accuracy. It told the tale of a Polish dude that runs a building site and employes Poles on the cheap. I think it's called Highlander. It shows how they cheat one another and also British employers. Trade unions exacerbated it, yes. Truly sad!
Barney  17 | 1629  
27 Sep 2010 /  #34
I'm not anti-Polish but they came here and reduced living standards by undercutting wage rates.

No he didnt, He did say that (people complained to him using these words )"I'm not prejudiced against Polish but they are driving down my wages and conditions"

What he did say was that he was in favour of free movement of labour within Europe so that British people can work abroad. He went on to say that the policy of a flexible labour market which seemed(in his constituents minds) to drive down wages should be addressed, and then a load of marketing speak that meant nothing.

He never once mentioned Stalinism, used "Polish people as a scapegoat", or advocated the destruction of western society.

In this thread we have had Islam, Bangladeshi, Somali and Pakistani immigrants mentioned the Jewish-Bolshevik red herring and who knows what is to come.

Is it possible to have a nutters corner?
DariuszTelka  5 | 193  
27 Sep 2010 /  #35
Quite the oposite really, they prove to be honest...Cant remember a Jewish MP being done for corruption.

I don't want to harp on it, but the second I read that, Lord Levy came to mind;

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Levy,_Baron_Levy
Amathyst  19 | 2700  
27 Sep 2010 /  #36
The only solution for a working class fears would be the French system,

Oh no, you are very wrong there matie..In fact Id go one step further, I be happy for only people who work and have several (at least 5) generations in this country to vote...You'd soon see a change to how things worked over here!!!!

If they undercut, IF, it was the labour party policy!

No it was is not, it is people who lived like rats who can afford to do so...They dont have a standard of living that a British builder has! But there you go again blaming someone else! No change there then for a Pole!

There was a crackdown on it.

No there wasnt (asuming you are talking about undercutting?)..Its still going on..

Nevertheless, why always pick on Poles ? Ed shred!

Sometimes the truth hurts....Love the way you play the victim card..Pakis do that all the time...
sascha  1 | 824  
28 Sep 2010 /  #37
Sometimes the truth hurts....

Agreed.

I'd say that Mr. Eddi Miliband has an unsolved issue with his polish/jewish origins and that's why he mentioned the Polish in the interview.

Better for him I suppose to solve that first and then start the title race ;-)
Ironside  50 | 12337  
28 Sep 2010 /  #38
But there you go again blaming someone else!

I don't blame somebody else - you do!Do you think that Poles are travelling around the world looking where they can undercut local wages ?

First of all it your government policy to let Poles in and work- legally!
Secondly Poles are being employed by your citizenry, why do you have a beef with Poles only?
Anyway those arguments were repeated here many times - are you bored ?:)

Oh no, you are very wrong there matie..

Why wrong - working class would like socialism in the national guise, work for all citizens, minimum wage, reduced work hours - paradise eh?

asuming you are talking about undercutting?)..Its still going on..

Isn't it illegal ?Illegal activity should be stopped, if they undercut ......

Love the way you play the victim card..Pakis do that all the time...

What card? Do you claim that only Poles arrived to UK ?So, ?
poland_  
28 Sep 2010 /  #39
n a speech given by David Millband in Warsaw June 2009, Mr Miliband spoke of the "deep and real bonds" between Poland and the UK, and said he considers himself one of the million of Britons with Polish blood.

"Jews and Poles are becoming more aware of the bonds they have with one another," Ms Kirshenblatt-Gimblett said. "There is a stereotype among some Jews that Poles are and always have been anti-Semitic, which is nonsense."

The American historian Richard C. Lukas has estimated that up to 3 million Polish Gentiles were in some way involved in rescuing Jews during the Holocaust, which may have led to about 450,000 Jewish lives being saved. Israel has awarded more than 6,000 Righteous Among the Nations medals to Poles, the highest number given to any nation.

About 70 per cent of American Jews and 60 per cent of Israelis have roots in Poland, according to Tad Taube, of the Taube Foundation for Jewish Life and Culture.
richasis  1 | 409  
28 Sep 2010 /  #40
up to 3 million Polish Gentiles were in some way involved in rescuing Jews during the Holocaust

I wonder how many Israeli Jews can be said to have likewise assisted Palestinians.
(EDIT: Yes, there ARE numerous Israeli Jews who actively advocate for Palestine).
ShortHairThug  - | 1101  
28 Sep 2010 /  #41
I wonder how many Israeli Jews can be said to have likewise assisted Palestinians.

LMAO.
poland_  
28 Sep 2010 /  #42
I wonder how many Israeli Jews can be said to have likewise assisted Palestinians.

You ever seen the film O' Jeruselam.

I think it's called Highlander.

The film is called " Outlander "
richasis  1 | 409  
28 Sep 2010 /  #43
You ever seen the film O' Jeruselam.

I'll keep an eye out for a copy.
Trevek  25 | 1699  
28 Sep 2010 /  #44
Isn't it illegal ?Illegal activity should be stopped, if they undercut ......

Undercutting prices/wages? Illegal? Not really, everyone does it in some way.
The thing is that there are levels of undercutting, like when a builder works for 25 an hour and someone does the job for 15. !5 an hour is a reasonable wage in UK, I believe. The companies just say "Accept the wage or we go to a temp agency and get a load of Polish workers cheaper". It's not necessarily the Polish workers who are undercutting, it's the companies using them.

Interesting point: In a local Polish gmina I heard of the local government advertising tenders for a contract. There is some restriction on taking the most expensive tender (supposedly to stop corruption). The trouble was that the cheapest one was the biggest bunch of cowboys going. Delays and bad workmenship, but a low price. Seems advertising a fair price for good work isn't the way to do business.
AdamKadmon  2 | 494  
28 Sep 2010 /  #45
Then how natural is multicultural?

Monoculture makes soil barren and impoverished, you cannot say this about multicultural societies.
gumishu  15 | 6167  
28 Sep 2010 /  #46
Wałęsa has cleared his name on several occasions yet the allegations still fly.

Sean - be serious - what kind of clearing was that? Do you mean this special UOP action to get rid of the remaining communist archives on Wałęsa (SB archives of course) he ordered while in presidential power - whith pages obviously torn out - btw these were not the only actions of UOP (State Security Bureau) taken allegedly on Wałęsa's order - many other archives have been searched and emptied of inconvenient and sometimes of any material concerning Wałęsa
Seanus  15 | 19666  
28 Sep 2010 /  #47
My point was that they were making a mockery of the judicial process by disrespecting it. We all know that politicians have skeletons in the closet and I really don't know if he is innocent or not and, more to the point, I don't pretend to know beyond reasonable doubt.
DariuszTelka  5 | 193  
28 Sep 2010 /  #48
Monoculture makes soil barren and impoverished, you cannot say this about multicultural societies.

Well, it depends on what we put in "monocultural" and "multicultural".

In this aspect I meant monocultural as "European", and multicultural as mixing christanity with islam.

The first one works, and has given us the western world as we know it through art, science, technology, litterature, democracy, womens rights, workers rights and freedom of speech.

The second one has given us terror, hate, fear, religious intolerance, racism, homophobia, bigotry and reduction of womens/childrens rights.

One can of course interpret these differently, as Europe being multicultural, as mixing German, French, Spanish and Russian cultures too. But in today's political climate it's mostly "us" versus "them", as in christian secular world against the islamic world.

DariuszTelka
alexw68  
28 Sep 2010 /  #49
In this aspect I meant monocultural as "European", and multicultural as mixing christanity with islam.
The first one works, and has given us the western world as we know it through art, science, technology, literature, democracy, womens rights, workers rights and freedom of speech.

Can't fault you on the last 4 points but your history's a little shaky on the bold ones. There's no small Arabic/Moorish influence on these in European culture in the early Mediaeval period - and we've not yet mentioned the spice and silk trades.
DariuszTelka  5 | 193  
28 Sep 2010 /  #50
There's no small Arabic/Moorish influence on these in European culture in the early Mediaeval period - and we've not yet mentioned the spice and silk trades.

Sorry, everything I mentioned came from the "white man", the Hindus, Egyptians, Persians, Mesopotamia and European culture. The Moors and arabic culture never had anything they didn't conquer, kill and overtake by brute force. What happened to the islamic "golden age" after islam conquered all these great places? It all stopped, rather quickly.

You can equate it a bit to how the Christians took over heathen Europe. Over all the religious places of worship, there were built churches, all the nice and accepted traditions like yule celebrations, traditions like santa claus, the christmas tree, summer and winter solstice, all these were stolen/taken/incorporated into Christianity so to not upset the locals too much.

The same happened with the muslims in Persia and other places mentioned above. They came in, took over what was there, like math, science, algebra, litterature, and made it "arabic", translated much of it and then passed it on as "theirs". Tody, sadly, there are few remnants of those great civilizations, and only islam in it's pure form remains. Oppressing, non-democratic, homophobic, sexist and religious intolerant to other faiths and their lands former history and knowledge.

But as all these sciences and technology slowly ventured up north, to free havens like Europe, and our continent started to blossom! Today one can clearly see the difference in our ways of life. This is not a coincidence.

Arab conquest of non-muslim lands after 600AD:

everything2.com/title/Chronology+of+the+Arab+Conquest

This one is a bit long, but very informative on how the muslim took over Persia and ruined it;

"The Arabs those days knew nothing about art, architecture, mathematics, astronomy and chronology. Arab conquerors were even surprised when they robbed their first coins. So after four centuries of Islamization in Persia the light of science and knowledge had slowly faded away".

historymedren.about.com/library/text/bltxtiraq4.htm

How Mesopotamia as it was called under Greek rule was conqured and today is called Iraq;

"Most of the Iraqi tribes were Christian at the time of the Islamic conquest. They decided to pay the jizya, the tax required of non-Muslims living in Muslim-ruled areas".

onlydemocracy4iran.com/2010/09/05/the-golden-age-of-islam-another-theft-of-persian-heritage-and-history/

And last, my favourite, "What arab civization?"

"You state, "its architects designed buildings that defied gravity." I am not sure what you are referring to, but if you are referring to domes and arches, the fundamental architectural breakthrough of using a parabolic shape instead of a spherical shape for these structures was made by the Assyrians more than 1300 years earlier, as evidenced by their archaeological record".

ninevehsoft.com/fiorina.htm

All the science, the numbers, the astronomy, astrology...it was already there, Alexw68. Just look at the nobel prize winners list...how many muslims do you find there in math and science? The ones with arab sounding names are mostly Christian arabs, educated in Europe or the US. So still today, the arab/muslim world cannot keep up with us...something to think about?

DariuszTelka

Mod: Sorry, off-topic again....last time, I promise.
Amathyst  19 | 2700  
28 Sep 2010 /  #51
Do you think that Poles are travelling around the world looking where they can undercut local wages ?

They certainly dont look at what the working wage is for a builder, instead they say "oh I can do it cheaper" FACT..

What card? Do you claim that only Poles arrived to UK ?So, ?

Crying all the time!

First of all it your government policy to let Poles in and work- legally!

One we were not consulted on and one that backfired on them..15,000 at most from ALL of the A8 countries..was what they expected!! LOL!!

Secondly Poles are being employed by your citizenry, why do you have a beef with Poles only?

I have issues with anyone that undercuts and English man...I dont care where he's from, but this happens to be a Polish forum and you started harping on about Polish people being phucking victims!

Why wrong - working class would like socialism in the national guise, work for all citizens, minimum wage, reduced work hours - paradise eh?

Times have changed...Those working class of 40 years ago do not exist...As for work for all, why not? Rather that than benefits for all!! Minimum wage? Sure, or are you suggesting we pay people incredily low wages so that they are forced to leave their families and friends behind in order to find a decent living wage??? Reduced workign hours...thing of the past we signed up to the European working directive and everyone I know works more than 37.5 or 40 hours a week...simply because of the demands of their job...

Isn't it illegal ?Illegal activity should be stopped, if they undercut ......

its not but it should be, prices should be set like in the German building trade (I heard this recently)

Monoculture makes soil barren and impoverished, you cannot say this about multicultural societies.

? Japan is pretty much a monoculture but is very far from being barren.

5 an hour is a reasonable wage in UK, I believe

WTF - I'd like to see you live on that an hour over here! Prices seem to be rocketing in the shops! (food wise with clothes to follow - the cheapo Brit buying culture is soon to be over!)
richasis  1 | 409  
28 Sep 2010 /  #52
Forget undercutting wages - just go on the dole like other 'select' groups and have babies.
sascha  1 | 824  
28 Sep 2010 /  #53
They certainly dont look at what the working wage is for a builder, instead they say "oh I can do it cheaper" FACT..

That is called free economy market. In Germany we had the similar problems. It's the way it goes. The EU opened the doors and of course people are looking for opportunities - no matter from where they are.

I have issues with anyone that undercuts and English man

I don't, because your government allowed this situation and now crying or complaining over it is little bit amoral.
In Germany same situation. Face it, change sth if you can but get over it.

Japan is pretty much a monoculture but is very far from being barren.

98.5% Japanese, 0.5% Korean, 0.4% Chinese, 0.6% other
Those data are from wiki. Quite old I suppose, but they cannot afford to shut their doors ;-)
richasis  1 | 409  
28 Sep 2010 /  #54
98.5% Japanese, 0.5% Korean, 0.4% Chinese, 0.6% other

Methinks the "0.6% other" are ESL teachers :)
Mr Grunwald  33 | 2131  
28 Sep 2010 /  #55
"There is a stereotype among some Jews that Poles are and always have been anti-Semitic, which is nonsense."

I liked that, but his family's past is quite... Well im skeptical to that guy. Would have to meet him personally and have a chat, other ways I would never vote for him

IF he would try to get elected in my country ;)
zion  16 | 168  
28 Sep 2010 /  #56
Good to see another Jewish brother doing well .

and his comments about Poles is right by the way ,Ed Miliband for PM
poland_  
28 Sep 2010 /  #57
He is a confirmed atheist, lives out of wedlock with a non Jew and does not attend synagogue.

So what is the point?
Mr Grunwald  33 | 2131  
28 Sep 2010 /  #58
and his comments about Poles is right by the way ,Ed Miliband for PM

His comment about them taking on the system etc, or it's a nonsense that Poles are by default anti-semites?

I liked that, but his family's past is quite... Well im skeptical to that guy.

Was thinking of his grandfather running from Belgium to join the red army, just so that is clear ;)

So what is the point?

Look at his name: A Zionist probably...
zion  16 | 168  
28 Sep 2010 /  #59
He is a confirmed atheist, lives out of wedlock with a non Jew and does not attend synagogue.

he does still has Jewish blood, so he is a Jew, born from a Jewish mother so say the Torah.
Londynie  - | 4  
28 Sep 2010 /  #60
lay off the paranoia

Archives - 2010-2019 / UK, Ireland / Ed Miliband, new Labour leader, talking about Polish immigrants yesterdayArchived