The Polish Mission of Orchard Lake, Michigan, a pro-Polish think-tank, is asking:
Can anybody tell me why we're subjected to this kind of slander? I'm calling on the United States government to take responsibility BEYOND paper-thin apologies, and for James Comey to be held accountable.
If you weren't already aware, just Google "Comey Poland" to find out how our FBI director bulldozed through decades of work on behalf of historians and diplomats. Yes, Poles and Polish-Americans have once again been forced to shrug off yet another slap in the face by the United States.
I definitely don't want to takes sides here, and I honestly don't care what somebody said, but I really hate it when a sentence or two are plucked out of a statement and used to rile people. They should have printed a whole speech. These 10 seconds "soundbites" so prevalent today try to make their readers into morons (if they're not morons already ;) ).
here is the link to the speech, I'm sure most of us here are capable of getting its point:
Michael Schudrich, the Chief Rabbi of Poland who arrived in Poland from New York five years ago, says Comey's words was a "painful mistake", but in his opinion it was a mistake with "no bad intentions". - "This is not going to be a tragedy, if he doesn't apologise for his words, but disgust will remain, however" - added Schudrich.
In the interview with Monika Olejnik on the TVN channel yesterday evening, Schudrich said he tries to avoid using the term "Nazi" when referring to the actions undertaken by the Third Reich, including the Holocaust, preferring instead to use the term "German". Notice that it is in sharp contrast to the habit of certain members of the PF who very much like to use terms such as "Nazi-Polish invasion of Czechoslovakia", for example.
It was Nazis. Average Germans did not set up the horror of the concentration camps, it was Nazis. Saying Germany/Germans is the same misnomer as when people suggest Jews and communists are one and the same.
yes it was Nazis - average Germans were so much against the invasion of Poland that they refused to bomb Polish cities and shoot bullets at Polish troops - it is actually a miracle that the invasion did not fail because of that - I guess they only conscripted Nazis into the Wehrmacht - this would explain a thing or two - also Nazis were building tanks guns and planes -
the thing is that your average German believed and accepted that he was the Herrenvolk and actually dreamed about the Lebensraum in the east - it's those who didn't get caught in this craze that were minority
the thing is that your average German believed and accepted that he was the Herrenvolk
Most were deeply demoralized after defeat in 1918, the revolution of 1919 and the years of poverty, hunger and instability that followed. You underestimate both the antipathy that existed towards them from the educated and the workers and the breath of fresh air that they seemed to others, leading them to swallow the usual nationalistic rubbish they were spouting.
They swallowed that rubbish for they, as children were raised in violence and beaten into obedience in accordance with infamous, poisonous pedagogy - so we already KNOW why.
The present discourse over that American person's mistake during his speech (have you read the speech in full?) doesn't have much to do with Nineteenth Century Austrian childrearing culture (hardly different from that in Poland, one thinks). An interesting theory, however it would help if the Yanks had their speeches checked just to make sure before they accidentally put their foot in things.
His mistake was not a mistake with the facts; the facts in what he said were completely correct. His mistake was to not understand how over sensitive some people are about that topic (and why).
His mistake was not a mistake with the facts; the facts in what he said were completely correct.
I don't understand Harry why do you make yourself suffer in this anti-semitic country - save yourself suffering and go somewhere else - btw I wonder how many of your Polish 'friends' are familiar with your views of Polish history
Poland isn't an anti-semitic country; I am very happy to correct anybody who claims it is.
btw I wonder how many of your Polish 'friends' are familiar with your views of Polish history
I was talking about what Comey said last night in a pub with a couple of Polish nationalists (one of who apparently used to be proper naughty little ******* in the Mlodziez Wszechpolska). I very strongly agreed that Poland hadn't taken part in the Holocaust and Poland had never collaborated with the Nazis. Then I pointed out what Comey had actually said and that it wasn't the same thing as saying Poland took part in the holocaust. One of them did say that there had never been a Polish SS regiment but did agree when I said that the fact some British men joined the SS when not many had the opportunity very much suggested that at least one or two Polish men might have joined non-Polish SS units.
For slander
Truthfulness is an absolute defence against charges of slander.
and being a federal suit with a big mouth.
Could you go into detail as to which law that breaches?
No there were no Polish SS units. There was no Quisling, Tiso or Pétain Nazi puppet regime, but individual Poles did turn Jews over to the Gestapo. People of every nationality in Nazi-occupied Europe collaborated with the Nazis. The collaborationist Jewish ghetto police was often more brutal towards fellow-Jews than the Germans were. And the Judenräte (councils of Jewish elders serving the Nazis) actually drew up name and address lists of Jews which greatly facilitated their transport of Auschwitz and other "holiday resorts". The point is that in extreme conditions, when one'a utter survival and that of one's family's is at stake, people do drastic, inhuman and unspeakable things. War brutalises everyone -- victim and victimiser, soldier and civilian, peasant and intellectual, Jew and Goy, Catholic and atheist....
The present discourse over that American person's mistake during his speech (have you read the speech in full?) doesn't have much to do with Nineteenth Century Austrian childrearing culture (hardly different from that in Poland, one thinks). An interesting theory, however it would help if the Yanks had their speeches checked just to make sure before they accidentally put their foot in things.
Yet, child rearing had much to do with that average German following that nationalistic rubbish - not hunger, poverty ( which was/is present elsewhere ) Agree, it is off topic.
Now when USA power starts to crumple expectations from Poland would raise. It would be expected that Poland totally obey and actively contribute to preservation of standard of living of US population. What i want to tell you, insults on the account of Poland are something normal.
No there were no Polish SS units. There was no Quisling, Tiso or Pétain Nazi puppet regime, but individual Poles did turn Jews over to the Gestapo. (...)
A very fair assessment though I'd add that the Judentrater were blameless - the ghetto communities were forced into that dreadful role.
Problem is that for years, as with Austria, Poland saw herself almost completely as victim of Nazi aggression, i.e. especially Jewish persecutions, rather than as a partially willing participant. As Austria had to eventually confront its gung-ho Anschluss with Grossdeutschland, Switzerland too was forced to admit complicity in closing off her borders to incoming Jewish refugees, even Holland had finally to do some skeleton in the closet clearing about the presence of Dutch Nazis (a topic long taboo in public discussions with the outside!) etc.
All Comey meant was a need for greater transparency. The fact that the wonderful USA was heavily Nazi leaning during the '30's, e.g. Lindberg, the America Firsters, the American Legion, Watson and IBM he never denied:-)
Unlike Poland, Austria has never been a victim of the Nazis. They were the ones who cheered the loudest when they were admitted "heim ins Reich", and since then they are trying to blame someone else for their own actions.
