Which modern developments harm Poland?

Which modern developments, practices or phenomena in Poland or your home country do you regard as negative? Why? What is the alternative? For instance workaholism, Internet addiction, atomised families, environamental destruction, megabureacratic governments, etc.

A few of us here should know about that. But the young seem to have very short attention spans nowadays.


Without a dining table in the home even.

In the UK, the decline of pub culture and the growth of suburbia, everyone staying at home in insulated bubbles, driving to the mall. In Poland, gated estates.

But above all, television. Too much, too trashy.

In America atomisation started when the youngster got his own TV set, then mum got a little portable to watch her soaps while working in the kitchen and other family members (if there were more) ditto... Originally the telly brought families together. in Poland relatives tell me that when they were one of the first in their village with a TV set, neighbours would come round with their chairs to sit on for DTV and Monday night Teatr Telewizji but even more so for Thursday night Kobra (murder mysteries) sessions.

Trashy TV in Poland? Quite! But what country would you hold up as a model of television excellence? Britain, the USA, France, Finland, Belarus? In the global era they all show tacky soaps, Jerry Springer type crap, reality shows, extreme sports, MTV, pûrn, etc., generously peppered with really stupid adverts.

seems to be forced on some workers


one doesn't have to watch it. the beauty of tv is choice.


i quite enjoy some of them


a lot of skill involved. plus steel balls for some of those folk


plenty of choice


a little pûrn never harmed anyone.

in some places, example Wroclaw, there is no vision when it comes to architecture

Not every choice is a good thing when it infects immature or underdeveloped minds. Do you really thing a nine or 10-year-old finding out about 'love' on an Internet prn site is the best solution.

And the topic was the trashiness of much of TV. There is no question that there's plenty of choice. The question is: why do so many choose that which is cheap, tacky, trashy and gutter-level?

Who is the blame: parents, the school, the church, the media, peer pressure?

Cheap to make and appealing to the lowest common denominator. Kind of bread and circuses.

I used to grumble about how bad Polish TV was compared to the UK, then ten years later, I go back to the UK for a couple of months and see that it's declined there even further.

Pope John Paul II warned that the great danger facing the West, including Poland, after the fall of communism would be consumerism...All of the problems you mention are related to this...From what I read on the Forum, it seems that both native Poles and some diaspora Poles, with their mindlessly negative attitude toward the Church, reflect this trend.

your post seems to be directed at me.

you listed prn under tv trash. not internet.

any child watching tv after 9:00pm may see light prn.

and once again. it doesn't harm anyone.


i watch what i watch because i enjoy it.

the things you mention are only trash in your opinion, not mine.

And what do you think his attitude to some of the racist stuff that appears on PF would be?

I agree, consumerism, in its extreme is perverting people's idea of beauty, self esteem, freedom and reason.
Nothing specifically about Poland though.

Who doesn't want to live the dream:

"I'm just a regular Joe with a regular job.
I'm your average white suburbanite slob.
I like football and pûrno and books about war.
I've got an average house with a nice hardwood floor.
My wife and my job, my kids and my car.
My feet on my table and a Cuban cigar."

youtube.com/watch?v=UrgpZ0fUixs

What I think is the worst? The rat race, the "always be first and the best" attitude, if you're not original and popular than you're nothing...Many things...Mostly the attitude that you have to be Someone.

Yes. Check out the Amish/Plain People stuff on another thread. They get by without all that crap and are probably happier and much richer in themselves for it.


I was talking to the teenage son of a diplomat in Warsaw not long ago. He'd attended posh private schools around the world. He said the rich kids in Warsaw were by far the most materialistic he'd ever come across, talking only about what they or their parents owned.

Nevertheless, a bank in Poland (a well known one) did a very private survey of their richest 10% of clients a few years ago and were surprised that over half of them hadn't been abroad, even for a holiday, in the past 10 years and tended to drive mid-range cars.

You ya (unt

Which one?
i think that's a bit of an extreme too, I shouldn't really knock it till I've tried it.
I think life has a lot to do with balance, do stupid things but balance it out with something semisensible ;p


I have met many rich secondary school kids and there is a tendency for them to be sycophants.


? That's odd, I wonder why, any ideas? working too much?


I tend to agree, from personal experience.
Many of the (mentally) poorest people I know in Europe tend to wear the trendiest gear, drive flashy looking sports cars (but only flashy looking not actual sports cars) and have the latest mobile ringtones.

I guess people with cash don't need to prove themselves.

Parents.Who else?Why the school or the church?


I agree but I wouldn't give up my PC :)


I always thought that REALLY rich ppl don't show off.They have big money but they don't have to brag about it-they know what they have.

There is beautiful word in Polish:nowobogaccy (nem money)-that's the kind of ppl that always talks abot what they have.

Bizarrely, the one about Formula1.


The guy who told me (a marketing bod) said that they suspected it was to do with the fact that some of their richest clients were farmers who'd got into businesses like making breezeblocks and cement rendering etc, and were the type of people who were naturally frugal, very family orientated, not particularly inquisitive about life outside their immediate sphere of interest and not ones for holidays or frivolous spending etc.

Perhaps not a very scientific analysis, but an interesting thought.

The media?


Or buttons... :)


We say "Nouveau riche", the opposite being "Old money".


Hahaha, I have some reading to do :)


Curious alright.

Ive met lots of them in Poland, all the talk but still living in a small flat with a mediocre car. It is what it is, thats one of the reason ive come to despise capitalism.

Because rich people with class don't brag about it.

What you don't understand is that during "communism " times it was (and still is) much better for you not to show off.I know a guy easily worth 10 milions PLN and he is driving 95 VW Passat and when you ask him how is he doing he will tell you that he is not doing good at all.

I think that's a general rule, not only the rich can afford :)

Very true. Though bragging nouveau riche or not, few of us decline invitations from multi-millionaires.

Think I might have spotted an oxymoron there. Depends how you define rich, of course...

One of the main reasons for the problem is the decline of consensus. Atomisaiton of the family has developed along with the polarisation of society. Used to be in the USA that parents, school and Church (many if not most PolAms attended Catholic schools) were all on the same team rearing schoolchildren. So were neighbrs and family friends. If a parent was called into school because Johnny had done something stupid, little Johnny would 'sorely' regret it. He was not only grounded, depriced of TV and pocket money that week but may well have been in for a good thrashing. Now the parent starts badmouthing the teahcer, apparently siding with the kid. But isn't it really out of some parental guilt feeling that he/she isn't devoting enough time to he youngster? He/sge may be driving the kid to practice and showring him with gadgets and fashion items, but he is not giving of himself and sees this as an opportuntiy to redeem himself. What do you think?

If you disagree with that assessment, what is yours? Why has the child-rearing consensus collapsed?

Welcome to the EU/capitalizm ;D


Good old times. They will never come back.
Now parents have to psychologists, sponsors....and of course for the kiddy only the best.
My guess is that this trend is not to stop. Unfortunately. Consequences of that we will probably not experience... ;-)

Which century are we talking about again?


Are we talking about Poland or where you are?


I don't think it has collapsed.
Yes, there has always been a minority that have literally paid for their child's affections but that is not knew and not the norm.

Media give opportunities but it's parents job to raise their children.


I think it's not that.Ppl with class don't show off and it has nothing to do with communism-it was always a
faux pas to be flashy.


We have nuworysze but it's about ppl who were promoted to the upper class(by money or education) but are still not accepted there.The word nowobogaccy means ppl that are wealthy but stupid and with bad taste.

Both, probably.

I've heard a fair few shocking stories recently about parents - it seems that Poland is much worse than the UK/Ireland when it comes to directly attempting to manipulate teachers.

I know a teacher here and one of the kids fell and chipped his teeth, the teacher was scared, especially when the father of the chipped toothed young fella came in to speak to her.

He came to apologise about his child's disruptive behaviour.

Although that thread on Polish cheating is interesting.

I stayed with someone in one of these in Warsaw,all the householders hated it,called it "the ghetto".....walls and gates suddenly appearing round your previously pretty well crime free neighbourhood,thats gotta suck.

lols,The Amish,the perfect example of blind religious nonsense. Must live by the Bible but are Forbiden to read the Bible,which they would have a job doing as none of them speak the origional high german its written in.

They arnt allowed electric power into their homes so they have mobile hand set phones with the power source in a shed :)
Mind you,say what you will,most of them come back after that rumspringger thing.