"Poland is flourishing"

Jealous ?

The reason Poland is flourishing is because they are one of the few European countires smart enough not to join EU. It only benefits France and Germany because they are larger, but won't benefit Poland. I hope they stay sovereign.

Erm...

europa.eu/abc/european_countries/eu_members/poland/index_en.htm

;)

Eh? You mean EUR (the currency), right?

I fear not:

The reason Poland is flourishing is because they are a soverign country and not part of the NWO known as THE EUROPEAN UNION. That is why Poland was the only country to grow in 2009 after the global financial meltdown, because they kept their sovereign currency they didn't crash with the EURO like other european countries who adopted the EURO. in 5 years the Euro will not exist.

I beg to differ: europa.eu/abc/european_countries/eu_members/poland/index_en.htm. They are not members of the single European currency, however, and as such their central bank/monetary policy is sovereign.

You may have a point about the currency breaking up, by the way...

The only reason why PL grew was because of the zillions of euros they got in subsidies. Fortunately NL and UK are against raising the EU-budget and I hope they will stick to it. Let's see whether PL is able to keep growing after the money from the EU dries up.

If it was as simple as that...... You still need to learn a lot about Poland..... E.g., the fact that Poland was growing throughout 1990s and early 2000s, without being a member or subsidies.

Historical annual data[21]

Total 1991 -7.0%
Total 1992 2.6%
Total 1993 3.8%
Total 1994 5.2%
Total 1995 7.0%
Total 1996 6.2%
Total 1997 7.1%
Total 1998 5.0%
Total 1999 4.5%
Total 2000 4.3%
Total 2001 1.2%
Total 2002 1.4%
Total 2003 3.9%
Total 2004 5.3%
Total 2005 3.6%
Total 2006 6.2%
Total 2007 6.8%
Total 2008 5.1%
Total 2009 1.7%
Total 2010 3.8%

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economy_of_Poland

I don't believe that is true Stu, it is of course a contributing factor, one which the old E.U. designed themselves to have a level playing field in the Euro zone.

I'm not an economist but here are contributing factors that I think really helped, in no particular order:

1. The strict banking policies which didn't allow so much bad credit like in Ireland (same reason why what is happening in Ireland won't happen here in Poland).

They have just made it even harder to get a mortgage, something I used to complain about but now I really see the benefits.

2.The two million Polish people who emigrated, not only gave rise to employment figures and had a direct result on wages going up here but also they sent back billions each year, making up part of Poland's GDP.

3. Not joining the Euro meant that the Zloty fell about 30%, increasing exports and decreasing imports.

It's a win win, so long as you stay in Poland (here I am, not the only reason but a contributing one :)

4. Highly educated yet relatively cheap labour for foreign investment.

I would agree with the first point.

Irelands economy was build on a bubble...Polands economy is not. They will avoid Irelands, or the greek, failure for that alone.

The Euro isn't the deciding factor if an economy works or not, it's a tool, not more, not less.
It makes for a good scapegoat though when national governments want to avoid the hard look in the mirror.

For working economies the Euro is a plus as it makes the trading business so much easier..but for that you need to have business in the first place.

I think there's going to be a very real debate soon as to where the EU is going - the Euro can't work long term without further political integration.

Still, the EU should never have expanded so fast, so quickly. I'm still of the view that the EU should have stopped at 17 - the previous 15, plus Slovenia and Estonia.

with the education standards rapidly falling how long do you expect it to last? Poland's strength was it's basic and high school level professional/technical education - now it is mostly gone

You have officially wiped yourself off Milky's Christmas card list :)


But it does effect imports and exports and you can manage your inflation better without it.

But these are the hard times, the Euro (if you don't listen to the UKIP) is more stable, dropping 30% could have had a catastrophic effect.


Just change your mind and the forecast will get better ;)

Has Poland taken part in PISA? What was the verdict?


Oh cume oooon....you know I love ya! *shuffles feet*

You sure we will?? Our current government does not much to avoid the Greek scenario (read national debt is quickly rising). Sure thay only think of the next election (this autumn)


I don't frankly get your point :)

I have pointed this out to you before and you either missed it or ignored it.

It's still much lower comparatively.

27th External
47th public debt

Well..just yesterday they wrote that the shadow economy in Greece approaches 37% of the whole economy. Meaning no-taxpaying black markets.

Greece is rotten to the core and it will take years to get it cleaned up...I wouldn't put Poland in the same basket!

In my opinion Poland experiences the growing pains of a real capitalist economy...not everything is rosy right now but they keep it straight and the outlook is good.

Especially as they try to avoid the pitfalls of others...

Where'd you get that figure? and how'd they calculate it?

I wonder what Poland's is, anyone?

No surprise, really.

Poland's done a lot to clean it up - the latest move, of requiring lawyers, doctors and a few others to use a "kasa fiskalna" (machine to produce receipts) wasn't a bad move at all.

In Spiegel...

spiegel.de/wirtschaft/soziales/0,1518,760229,00.html

My translation:

the public debt already reached the level of 55 per cent of the GDP - and econimic forecast for Poland is not very bright (European coal tax anyone? the most expensive natural gas in Europe ( Mr Pawlak's (in)famous Russian gas deal) - think all artificial fertilizers and some other chemical industries in Poland may collapse in a few years, the growing burden of debt, growing unemployment among the youth)

That is why Greece is a poor country with rich citizens as they use to say.

Are you posting this for fun or you really treat Spiegel as a reliable source for anything besides ads for cars and insurance and super gunstig chances to get those?

Help me out here Southern...is it really hereditary or is there really a will of the people to clean it up.
When I see greek people protesting what is their alternative to austerity. What are they protesting actually.
How do the Greek see themselves in 20 years?
Is there a mood to roll up the sleeves and to wish through the mess with a really big mop? Or will it
all stay the same as always..

This is what happens when you don't look at the links provided, you misunderstand what is meant.

The [en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_sovereign_states_by_public_debt] 47th public debt refers to place compared to other countries not the debt itself.

To make it short this article is full of BS!

I know what it means - still comparisons don't make much sense when you see some difficult times ahead - CO2 quota lowering for Poland - heard about that - in general it means Poland being not in very favourable economic position faces challenges it may not equal to in near future - and there are people who are responsible for it

I think it makes perfect sense to compare to others especially when difficult times are ahead, how else can you avoid pitfalls and make strategically advantageous moves? read PF? :)



Reuters

the article is from 2009 - these good times are about to end soon SeanBM - I'll try to find some respective links


advantageous moves cannot be made by comparisons to others but by recognizing realities

bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=newsarchive&sid=ahlP2z11ukIY