Why are Czechs more effective than Poles and Poland?

i agree. the czechs are more effective in the every sector of economic, politics, security and defence ( this, i do not know for sure ), ideology, social & culture. sope,..i think czechs have found the keys of success..has known the rhyhtm of managing the state..good luck for you czechs, I hope someday when you succeed we will meet again as the no. 1 country in the world! VIVA czechs..!

They lare a bit ahead, yes.

But Poland is catching up. The distance was much bigger when communism fell.

Why ahead?

The answer is simple - in the past, all Czechs were under Austrian control, while half Poland was under Russian control. Austria was better developed than Russia.

ask Slovaks - they would probably tell you, that Czechs were like parasites on slovakian people and after the "divorce" cleaned them totally ;)

I am sure Czechs say the same about Slovaks. :):):):)

The silver mines of Bohemia helped finance their state and the creation of their urban centres for a long time. The mines haven't been a major economic engine for centuries, but the cities, infrastructure, industries and the society that developed because of those mines, laid the foundation for the Bohemian/Czech culture and their state. Once the cities and trade routes were established, the country continued to develop. Prague is the big city, but there have been a couple well developed cities and towns within Bohemia with functioning governments in functioning states, most for centuries. Austria did not develop Bohemia - Austria inherited a developed Bohemia. Bohemia/Czechs have been developed ('playing the game of civilization') as has much of their country for centuries longer then Poland.

Of interest to me, is why the Czechs have not bounced back to levels they were at historically - is it all on the communists or did the centuries under the Habsburgs sap the continuation of their growth?

And what can the less developed parts of Poland do to emulate comparable regions that had similar situations historically, but are now doing quite well - the best example that comes to my mind is the rise and development of Slovakia.

(PS, I know of the the mines in Slovakia, they did not benefit Bohemia as the two were separate states or functioned separately within Austria/Hungary for much of the last millennia, and the mines had mild influence on Slovakia as a whole as they were often used to finance Hungry's wars, debts, etc.. )

Oh, I see. Thanks. I will try to remember that for future use.

PS. Are you of Czech origin?

Not just that. Russia's policy was always to suck dry the resources of the nations it conquers or dominates, not to put anything in. Remember the wide track rail line (which I believe still exists) from the Soviet Union to southern Poland? For years they were buying coal from Poland for a fraction of the cost. Not to mention things which were stolen from Poland by the Red Army in 1944-45, art work, trains, heavy machinery etc. Same thing in former East Germany, the GDR was building ships (cargo) for the Soviet Union for 45 million dollars a piece, while the cost of building was 140 million!!! The difference was paid by East Germany, constantly losing money on that deal. The only thing Poland got from Russians was the Palace of Culture, and I'm not sure if it wasn't paid for by Poland. Btw, the Czechs got a 3 or 4 time smaller work force than Poland, much easier to find them employment.

My parents are Polish. For a while I was something of a Polish nationalist as a teen, defending Polish rights to Poznan, Wroclaw, etc.. Learning about Bohemia was something of a tangent.

" Why are Czechs more effective than Poles? " is the original question.

I see two reasons. One is that Poland developed another way than Česko. Poland had strong nobility, and very weak bourgeoisie. In Bohemia the bourgeoisie was alwys biger and more important than nobility. The city Prague, capital of Czech Republic, is so big as Warsaw, capital Poland, but two countries have different size. Nobility do not do much for development of country, it is city dwellers who do the development by production of goods, trade, commerce, and so on and so on.

Second is that about different religion - Bohemia prefered protestantism, but Poland chose Roman Catholic doctrines. Protestant people work hard and get rich and it is not shame, but Catholic people when they get rich it is bad. Jesus said about rich men who cannot be in Paradise.

Czechs worked hard and get richer in history than Poles. I remember crisis in socialist Poland in the years 1980 = 1990. Poles coldnt buy many things and visited Československo for it. But it change very much. This distance gets smaller every year. Poland is catching fast.

A fact that for most of their history Czech has been part of the German Empire and then Austrian Empire has anything to do with it.

Also Czech as a country has been never divided between their neighbors.
That would be my two cents worth of an input!


Eh? At the time Poland had plenty of cities and official religion was communism, sort of protestant religion like ideology.

Don't you see the contradiction between these two statements?

Nope!

Well OK then. Enjoy your day.

OH I will:)
Do you see contradiction where there is none? :D

very good thread, from the golden age of Polish forums

on the first place, Poland is object of bigger manipulations by certain powers from the west of Europe and, plus Russia complicated, too.

Czeska is strategically less important so Czechs have more maneuverable space to create effective state. When Poland progress, it immediately attract attention.

As for Germanic influences, let us don`t forget that Germans themselves originates from Slavs. So, forget genetics. Its not about it.

But they only say such things or dream about it while Poles act like this

in my opinion Czech villages look much poorer than Polish ones. on the other hand the biggest cities are more developed in CR. it's a small country, i wasn't much impressed by it while living there. it's slightly richer than other neighbouring countries but i didn't notice any vast differences. we could ask as well why Slovenia is richer than CR as well.

Poland's GDP - 22,162
Czech - 26,590

the gap is like betwen Germany and Austria.

I'm not desputing it but can you please write more about it

in some other thread. i mentioned that here due to development of discussion but, its the other topic actually

It is clear that southern lives sonwhere in the south..... hehehe
The Austro-Hungarian Empire built up the fourth largest machine building industry of the world ...
And ........ and The Czechs inherited 70 to 80% of all the industry of the Austro-Hungarian Empire.

Really very clever country ...... most intelligent people in the world.....hehehe

Poland experienced DEATHS AND DESTRUCTION at least two times (WW1 AND WW2 )
I don't want to talk here about less important wars
In Czechia the industry increased considerably during WW2
Now there is no gap between these countries, only unimportant difference

And now be so kind tell me who is more effective, please

....

Would you mind giving some links?

Yes, Tiso was a good example :)

go start with google on Rujan island and Arkona. History of Germany is nothing but history of constant germanization and onslaught of Slavs

Now that I answered the Crow's question, Crow, give me an answer to my question, please

Silly comparison

Poland:
Free for 50 of the past 200 years
Invaded by 4 nations (including Slovakia)
Decimated during WW2 and mostly not rebuilt
Never gave in to Hitler
Fueled the break up of the Iron Wall
Polish industries were stripped by Nazis, Soviets and then Allies

I remember back in the late 1990's, the gap & more importantly future forecast of the two nations was significantly wide. But the current picture is different. It's fairly obviously Czech with it's smaller size, less foreign occupations and less post war rebuilding; would be more organized and efficient. But Poland has the distinct upside in the future. Poland is the one with access to the sea and in general a more contrasting landscape. Czech is overtly reliant on Prague, while Poland simply has more to offer. Considering the public relations improvement we've seen from Poland in the past 5-10 years, it's just a matter of time before Poland catches up in terms of organization. A lot of the current issues are byproducts of Communist society just 20 years ago but that is dying out along with that specific population of people.

People take shots at the church and I understand why but you are ignoring it's positive influence during Occupation. For better & worse, it is a staple of modern day Polish society until.....it also decreases along with that specific population of people.

Very ridiculous thread, from the golden age of Polish forums