New cross war in Warsaw

I tell you the truth: it bodes ill for the future...Poles VERY HARD HEADED AND HEARTED sometimes.

And I tell you something else: New Polish immigrants to the USA not like this...They fill the church, yes.

We try really hard not to make Poland resemble USA. We much more prefer Swedish model ;)

Btw. you don't see that every extremistic group like that (which breaks the law) makes other ppl hate all religious ppl? Catholic Church should excommunicate those ppl who stand there and won't let priests take the cross. They were yelling at priests: "sprzedawczyki", "sataniści" etc. it's enough to excomunicate those ppl who act like a sect.


Gladly they are in the USA... in the very right place for christian fundamentalist. Tell them not to go back.

Yeah, it doesn't augur well. I like the fact that Poles are striving through identity and have carved out 'Polishness' quite well but not when it's rammed down peoples' throats. Again, the key word in life is balance. LK and JK were too vociferous and DT and BK too passive. Poland has yet to find its golden boy of politics :(

Keep that cross there, I'm off to pray :)

I'm anything but... ;)

Oh no, we won't let it, no way ;>

Ach, Davie, you're setting me up again for jokes I don't wanna tell ;) ;)

The Kashubian wonder is undoubtedly passive. He needs to put a cross on himself as he'll need it in the future.

Yes, but before we will burn the babka hats!!! ;)


Cmon! I know its within you :)

Sean when you will start to be a Polack? Did you already applied for your citizenship? I see you can't wait to make your first cross in a voting paper... ;D


Yeah, let's make a big ognisko! and kiełbaski... oh it's going to be almost like in Missisipi...

BB, In theory in theory. According to canonic law women also have right to choose a husband.


what are you talking about?

As far as polish chrisitianity we are talkin : POLONIA SEMPER FIDELIS.

aa as far as modern polish society like all society is divided , for example In my opinion the Cross should stay ( I don1t want obelisk ;)) but everybody have his own opinionm and I respect it.

What is more this Cross case is no important in comparison to the new VAT. The " liberal" goverment is not as liberal as I want it to be, so they have one vote less and UPR one more.

You talk nonsense...Christian Fundamentalist?...Define it in your own terms in an intelligent way, and I respond....Also, I speak of the Catholic Church in my post...But, you hate that, too.

Perhaps you confuse American Christians with 'Christian Zionists'...They are simply one part of business partnership with Israelis.

Yeah...I get the hint...I'm bowing out here :)

I hate it?!?!??? Well that's funny cos I'm the one who recently advocates Catholics on PF. You don't know what you are saying.

Btw. I've already know why there are so many polish jokes in USA. No wonder... I forgot that polonia is the most eager sponsor of o.Rydzyk!


Fundametalist = literally reads Bible.
Oh, ok, I used a wrong word. I should say a christian sect because ppl like those defending cross are not Catholics certainly.

My father is also a churchgoer. And you know what he hates those moherstwo pisowskie.

you are advocating Cellar Catholics ...:)

What's the latest on it? Has Rydzyk stepped in with a cross and some hissing? Is he armed with garlic for all those vampires? What a circus it is!

no, its Gods Playground )

It should be actual size that way nobody will take notice of it:)

text in Polish removed

It was on the news after midnight last night (this morning). This really has the potential to create a schism in Polish society. PO do not want Lech to be honoured with a cross, that's how it appears! I really don't see the problem in honouring a Catholic ex-president of Poland with a cross. It's symbolically fitting! Put the mohair berets to the side and enter this debate rationally. The geopolitical influence is at play. Just yesterday, the Hamburg authorities closed the mosque that Atta and his cohorts prayed at. In NYC, they are still toying with the idea of erecting a mosque near Ground Zero. They did this winding up in the Balkans too. Truly sad!!

the present gov is quite good, but Hopefully it will be somebody more like this man.

youtube.com/watch?v=sV94Rc5InlE

youtube.com/watch?v=Lft6haRzgjg

Minister Anthony Eden u Prezydenta Mościskiego

youtube.com/watch?v=YExkGgq5kkE

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ignacy_Mo%C5%9Bcicki

They should be taking a clear stand on the cross issue. Creating a fractious schism is hardly in Poland's interest. PO need to pull the finger out and take decisive action on this and not puss*foot around.

Yeah...let the tanks rolling! ;)

Why not a referendum for example? This cross issue is just a symptom of the already happening discussion about how much church the polish people want/need in their lifes.

This discussion can't and shouldn't be decided by the current party in power...and this discussion needs time...it can't be solved with a law or a decisive action.

A consent needs to grow with the whole of the people whereas the fanatics on the margines beat each others heads in.

Nothing totally new actually...but a process other countries in the "old Europe" have already behind them.

We should marginalise these radicals. Yes, they too have a voice, but they are wreaking havoc over what is, in essence, much ado about nothing. I alluded to the bigger games at work, see post 257 above.

BB, the German police closed down the Hamburg mosque that was formerly frequented by Atta and his goons. That could easily be seen as controversial when you consider that globalists have an impeccable sense of timing, e.g Clinton bombing Serbia on the day of his impeachment trial. Pure deflection!

Nope, just much to late if you ask me.

But german history makes forbidding/banning something difficult (as long as it isn't neo-nazi).
The anti-basic law activity/goals needs to be absolutely proven first.

But once it's done first there is hope there will be more mosques being closed down...the first time being the hardest time! :)

What was the official justification? Public nuisance?

That would be to easy :)

No, to ban or close something it must be proven that it works towards the destruction and undermining of Germany's basic law...that's it more or less...but being the meeting place of a group of nutters on their way to New York to murder thousands of innocent people was obviously not enough :(

A cross divides poeople these days - many say those words in news.
It's has always been one of the most important symbols in my country.
What it means for Polish people? Who knows it? Everybody can say what the cross means for him.
The war against the cross is just a natural state of fight and defence...
Just like Torq said in one of his posts. "Being Polish means to stand for something." Many people stay for a cross. Because it has a meaning form them.

For many it is a symbol of democracy and freedom... A symbol of suffer.
So why do media call it a war against cross?
Do these people want this war?
They just want to have a right to show what they feel. They want to expose their emotions and values a cross brings...

So what changed in the 9-year interim period, BB? They had a recent debate in France over niqabs and burkas. They are really turning up the heat. I wish the German government would listen to Andreas Von Bulow. He is a great guy IMHO.

The cross war in Warsaw is really hammering it home how people can make a fuss out of sth. It's a shambles and that cross should be left alone. Kommie is likely behind it. He wants everyone to think the sun shines out of his arse and that LK needs to be put firmly and squarely behind us.

They got the proof at last Seanie.

The BND was at work all the time but these hate preacher know that they are under observation and are suspicious of any possible informer. They know the basic law and know exactly what to avoid saying out loud, they are very cautious.

It was hard work and needed awhile.



There you have your best reason for a secular state....if there isn't a hundred percent pro-cross majority but a rift is going across the country it does nothing but weaken the state, furthering disruption, unrest, aggravations, fights along the country till to segregation, clashes, civil war, the history is full of that....you so don't need that.

Those who need a cross in their lives should have the right to do so...in their private rooms...those who don't likewise.

Seanus wrote "That cross should be left alone".
I don't agree with you. We are in Poland. Society is mostly Catholic.
Leaving a cross alone for many means leaving a spirit of being Polish.
Bratwurst boy wrote:
"Those who need a cross in their lives should have the right to do so...in their private rooms...those who don't likewise."

Why? Let's say a cross for me is equal to freedom.
"it does nothing but weaken the state..."
It does. But how to tell those crazy people not to be stubborn and fanatic...You are right that it weakens the state.

Yes, for you!
But for many other not.
That's the point here, isn't it? Do you really want to endanger your country in petty fights about who is right? Poles against Poles???

I don't get your point, noreen. If anything, you are backing me up. If crosses can be put in classrooms and also at the side of the roads for road casualties, they can DEFINITELY be put in a strategic place for an ex-President of the country. There are plenty of other crosses for churches. What, St Anne's has somehow run short? ;) ;)

BB is spot on! Why create conflict? Why? Because it's the Polish way and foreigners will lambast you for it. Be reviled as you look like a bunch of squabbling children.