Grafitti plague in Warsaw

Rather more than you. I see scribbles that annoy people, disrespect for the built environment which we all share, elderly people upset by all the 'CHUJ' stuff, ethnic minorities intimidated by the 'MURZYNY DO DZUNGLU' and 'ZYDZI WON' stuff, I see newly renovated buildings that cost their residents money to paint covered with scrawls about football.

The thing is, Chimichero, I see all that round Warsaw, but I don't see much Banksy.


That just shows how low your standards are. Half of me hopes someone comes and draws a giant cock on your granny's balcony.



Art?

How about on your grandmother's house in which she's lived all her life?

I don't think so. You see what you've been told is direspectful and annoying. There're much more horrifying things in life than a cock on the wall.

But nevermind that, I'm not a fan of all the chuj stuff, but where would we get Banksys from if we didn't have graffiti at all? Of course Banksys are rare. Just as rare as good film makers.

By the way, you should really watch the film I posted, guys - it shows what makes the public decide what is art and what isn't

they should stick a can with paint up the ass of each caught culprit.

Told by whom? Some of us can think for themselves rather than defend vandalism on the grounds that they have a taste for it. No man is an island, and the teenage vandals who commit grafitti aren't artists any more than an emo cutting themself is the new Kurt Cobain.


So you're admitting that even the most famous grafitti artist is derivative.


It's the scrawls that aren't art that they're forced to (and I use that phrase carefully) see that are the problem. And those scrawls constitute 99.9999% of all grafitti. The little gits who spray on walls around Warsaw (and the horrendous grafitti problem is a sign of how broken Polish society is) are not artists. They are vandals.


Exactly - though the penalty is up to 2 years in prison.

Polish society isn't broken. A sick society is the one in which there's no room for any form of being different apart from the form which they are told is acceptable. So 2 women kissing on the street are acceptable but a cock on the wall is not as it may hurt the feelings of sensitive watchers. This is what you're told.

And the emo kids - they think they're being acceptably different, but for some reason they're all the same. What kind of mutant defective resistance they express that is nothing different from following another fashion, another rules.

I told you, although you don't seem to listen, that I don't support the rubbish graffiti - but I realize that to get some good graffiti we must agree on a certain amount of rubbish. And yes, I think it's worth it. I'd rather live with HWDP on my wall than in an artificial orderly world where human being is no longer a human but a predictable and obedient machine

Maybe not but is at last battered badly.

That's ok. There are many valuable things one can learn from being battered.


Yes, I believe Banksy is derivative of vandalism. That's what makes me think twice before I condemn vandalism

Yes, that wouldn't surprise me at all. Hesitating before condemning crime against the individual. Now PM me with your granny's address, and I'll pop over with the spraycans.


Many would disagree.


Unfortunately the law in Poland, which you say is not a broken society, says otherwise. Two women can't kiss in a romantic way in the street, and sadly, I can't see the law changing any day soon. Kissing is normal wholesome human behaviour. Spraypainting a metre-high cock on the bus stop or on your neighbour's house is disturbingly destructive


By whom? Don't judge others by your own easily-led mindset.


By self-harm, suicide, vandalism - do you really think that's "another fashion, another rules" Or behaviour patterns that are crying out for more stable humans to help them out of.


Really - doesn't look like it.


So in fact you do support the "rubbish grafitti." Make your mind up, woman.


And what about condoning the plight of others who have to live with HWDP and worse on the wall of their home? People who may not share your 'interesting and unusual' views. Self-expression by vandals isn't a fundamental human right. Living safely without fear and with one's property intact, is.

For example in £ódź there is a huge problem of antisemitic graffitis driven by football club wars. If someone writes for instance RTS with crown above then you can be sure that within few days there'll be a David star, "Jew" or even a swastika on it. And yes, it's a great harm to all those people who visit the city and see it. It's a great harm for the preception of Poland abroad. So you pretty missed the point. Besides that the owners of the properties are obliged to remove such graffitis (and the vulgar ones) if there is a call from the straż miejska on their own costs. If they don't do that they can be fined.


It would be better to take a spray away from everyone. There are many places and occasions where you can make a graffiti legally. You can even make a good money out of that.


Oh give me a break, those guys who paint all those tags around the city probably even don't try to call it an art themselves. If you want to do an art you try to make something aestethic...


You can express whatever you want but do than on your own expenses not expenses of people who own the properties.

Completely right - they should make them eat the paint they are spraying
I cannot understand - but perhaps I have a shopkeeper's mind as someone else suggested here - how damaging someone else's property (including public property such as buses and trams) can be acceptable.

It has nothing to do with living in a sterile society. It has to with being decent and respecting other people.
It is not art, it crime. The same as damaging public transport is an equally loathsome crime.

still they perhaps never end up convicted - bacause of 'low damage/harm to the society ' (i tranaslated it from a Polish court phrase - I guess there is one similar in meaning in British judicial language

There is no such a thing as graffiti these days. Now it's called street art.

If anyone paints anything on my house i will punch their face in...its not called violence , its called street theatre....

Graffiti in most cases is like dog pis$ing. They pis$ in order to mark territory. Sometimes someone is talented and graffiti is not so bad. Sometimes someone is not stupid kid and actually sprays only in places where it is not forbid. As in most things in this world talent and wisdom rarely come together. So, we have man dog pis$ing all over our cities...

"not in the public interest" is probably our equal.

Utter nonsense where vandalism is concerned - it doesn't take a genius to work out that a vandal can easily progress onto more serious things.

No it takes a bitter old codger to devise this slippery slope fallacy.

Says our resident bedroom expert.

Anyone with half a clue about criminology will tell you that serious crimes often begin with far less serious ones.

You know guys, if Banksy is a derivative of vandalism, then a defiance and graffiti are derivatives of the self rigtheous herd that is called the society, so in a way I do support your point of view too ;) Without you there wouldn't be the need for graffiti.


anyone with half a clue about history will tell you that totalitarianism doesn't come all of a sudden but begins with taking little freedoms away and calling little provocations a crime

little provocation is when someone writes sth on in chalk on tarmac (even Policja to tacy i owacy)- when he sprays things all over it is just vandalism - btw what provocation is there (unless it makes people furious for devastating their property/surrounding) - what thought is there? what idea do they promote? - most people here can see the difference between some artistic or intelectual provocation and vandalism - why can't you?

btw the totalitarianisms I know had strictly totalitarian aims and had not worked in the little steps manner (do you call killing all political oponnents step by step action)

btw I had a spraying spree (one evening together with a friend of mine) early in the 90's - and it was provoacitve believe me - I wouldn't do that now of course

well, I must admit, I have just half a clue about history... :)


you... rascal

How can you be so deranged that when the hooded criminals who scratched my neighbour's windows with their tags, you call these "little provocations"?

Western civilized society was built on just that: The respect for each other's property, common decency. Common rights. This Banksy hood is just another deranged criminal as all of his "brothers".

By the way, could you publish your home adress here...Sounds as if you you would like your home and car sprayed over as a piece of art

i'd just like to say this:

when the berlin wall was up i used to take little tour groups of colleagues along a particular section. most important was knowing where to by a can of spray paint. such was the demand for this paint that it was often sold in mini-cans, handbag size.

i remember at this time a james bond movie being made and a hundred meter stretch of the wall was painted white. oh how some people complained. not because a film was being made, but because the grafitti had been wiped out.

some of the best and most humourous grafitti i've seen appeared on that wall. and much of it came from folk who in their own city or country would never have put up with such a thing.

rightly or wrongly i'm quite happy to have written on the wall.

this is a blow of an arguement - congrats


well the spree resulted in three inscriptions on walls and one unfinished (someone left the block next to where we were spraying - OK it was me who was spraying )- and hmm - I have copied 2 of the inscriptions from an article in a newspaper but hell they were provocative

The discussion is taking an unexpected turn... It turns out that there are quite a few street vandals among us :))


Looks like everyone wants to spray my house... Nice, I'm happy! You can post your portfolios :)

I was not targeting homes :P just walls of a garrage complex and a wall in public toilet at the railway station :P

There is no need for grafitti. It is not in itself art - the intention of teenagers with spray cans is merely to damage. No craft, no skill, no inspiration, no intention to create art. Just damage.


Like the freedom to damage property?


But far less than half a clue about art.

Equally criminal. Equally loathsome. What kind of pleasure it gave you to do this?
That is what civic society is about. The common set of values to be respected. This is a concept which no grafitti criminal will understand.

Hooded sprayers should be have their tags branded in their foreheads and flogged on Plac Zamkowy.

There's no need for any form of art. Basically 4 bare concrete walls would function just as well as the York Cathedral


Please teach me something then, JonnyM..


Oh Oh Oh

I have already mentioned that I wouldn't do that anymore - I guess I grew up :)

and hell it was pleasure - it was so much fun ;) - btw you would love the messages (no no tags here) I have inscribed :P (as you are so anti-catholic :P)